Great opportunity to get the spindle properly cleaned and rebuilt, including brass bushes, needle bearings and seals. Looks like lack of lubrication and water intrusion.
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- Thread starter
- #22
Unfortunately I can't get the knuckle part off, so I would have to rebuild the spindle and all the sleeves and brass bushings with it on the vehicle. I got the upper ball joint free, but the lower one and the steering arm one just won’t break loose. And the two bolts that attach the steering ball joint to the knuckle are so tight my impact wrench won’t budge them, and with a breaker bar on them I got one to move, but it felt like it was just going to break the bolt off so I stopped. Almost every bolt I try to remove breaks off, even with PB Blaster and heat.
So I re-edited the photo, I assume the part with the green arrow is the seal, and the chewed up blue arrow is the brass bushing. But I am not sure; the pictures of the rear brass bushing looks different, the center part is longer. These bushing don’t fit tight, do they? The inside of the blue arrow part is OK it seems, it is just the face that is chewed. And the seal seems OK. Maybe it will still be OK once cleaned?
It still doesn’t make sense why this happened. The cv joint seemed clipped in when I pulled it out of the differential, shouldn’t that have kept it away from the bushing, if that is what it is?
And here I thought the new cv joints and hub flanges would solve my problems!
So I re-edited the photo, I assume the part with the green arrow is the seal, and the chewed up blue arrow is the brass bushing. But I am not sure; the pictures of the rear brass bushing looks different, the center part is longer. These bushing don’t fit tight, do they? The inside of the blue arrow part is OK it seems, it is just the face that is chewed. And the seal seems OK. Maybe it will still be OK once cleaned?
It still doesn’t make sense why this happened. The cv joint seemed clipped in when I pulled it out of the differential, shouldn’t that have kept it away from the bushing, if that is what it is?
And here I thought the new cv joints and hub flanges would solve my problems!
The brass bushing is pressed in (although its an easy press). Your rubber seal looks toasted to me. I would replace it all, including the needle bearings. It wouldn't be bad, even on the truck. It looks like you may have gotten debris in there because the seal is bad, and it destroyed the bushing. Its also dry, and should have grease, so friction may have just done it in. I grease this when I do the wheel bearings.
- Thread starter
- #24
Thanks Bisho,
I should have looked a Souq first – exact right parts on that link. I thought I would have to use a shop press for the bushing – I will give it a try on the truck, and yes, replace everything I can. When I looked at the bearings from the outside everything was well packed in grease, and I’ve never looked at the inner side. This truck sees a lot of water and mud so most likely the bad seal. After buying 2 new OEM cv joints, I don’t want to install them into bad hubs! Will update when I get the new parts.
I should have looked a Souq first – exact right parts on that link. I thought I would have to use a shop press for the bushing – I will give it a try on the truck, and yes, replace everything I can. When I looked at the bearings from the outside everything was well packed in grease, and I’ve never looked at the inner side. This truck sees a lot of water and mud so most likely the bad seal. After buying 2 new OEM cv joints, I don’t want to install them into bad hubs! Will update when I get the new parts.
I knocked the brass bushing out with a punch and used a piece of 4x4 to knock it in with a hammer. The needle bearing is grease with a special tool separate from the wheel bearings.
- Thread starter
- #26
OK, I think I am getting this sorted out – I haven’t done this on this vehicle yet and didn’t know the difference between a spindle bearing and a wheel bearing (!). I took apart the wheel bearings and they seem in new condition, and felt like it when it was all together as well. So maybe I will just do the seals. But there was up and down play in the old cv shaft after I took off the hub flange, so the spindle bearing might be worn, especially after all that wear on the bushing.
But a couple of questions:
- when you said you use a punch to knock out the brass bush, do you hit it from the outside through the spindle shaft tube? So in fact you hit the spindle bearing which then hits the bush? Is the brass bush’s job to just hold the spindle bearing in place?
- when you grease the spindle bearing (those tools look handy), do you use the same grease as for the wheel bearings? On that subject too, is Lucas Red “n” Tacky OK for these wheel bearings and the spindle bearing? It’s an NLGI GC-LB grade 2 grease. Can’t find the Mobil 1 synthetic stuff everyone seems to use, up here in Calgary anyway.
Thanks again.
But a couple of questions:
- when you said you use a punch to knock out the brass bush, do you hit it from the outside through the spindle shaft tube? So in fact you hit the spindle bearing which then hits the bush? Is the brass bush’s job to just hold the spindle bearing in place?
- when you grease the spindle bearing (those tools look handy), do you use the same grease as for the wheel bearings? On that subject too, is Lucas Red “n” Tacky OK for these wheel bearings and the spindle bearing? It’s an NLGI GC-LB grade 2 grease. Can’t find the Mobil 1 synthetic stuff everyone seems to use, up here in Calgary anyway.
Thanks again.
Yes to both of your questions. You'll probably destroy the needle bearings in the process of removal. I've started using a marine (blue) grease on the needle bearings. Given I cross water every so often, I figured it couldn't hurt.
- Thread starter
- #28
Another question, unfortunately. But first an update.
After reading some good reviews here we decided to try Partsouq for the seals and bearing – to note, Toyota dealers in Canada are saying that the inner seal is discontinued, which would be bad if true. They seem to still be available in the rest of the world, so we ordered a couple of them just in case. Anyway, we were lucky enough to order from Partsouq on the day before Eid, so they were closed for several days, and then the floods hit them and knocked out all transportation. Once shipping it only took 2-3 days to get here though, so still might try them again in the future.
I managed to get the old spindle bearing out, it put up a fight and was destroyed in the process, but it finally came out. Got the new one in with a circle of hardwood and a hammer, and set it to the correct depth using the old bushing. But when I went to press the new brass bushing in it just spins – it’s flush with the surface, and right up against the bearing but even if I pound on it (with hardwood for protection) it won’t stay in.
I have watched and read so many threads on this but everyone glosses over this point, people just say the bushing is easy to press in and focus on the bearing. Should the bushing spin? Is it OK if it does? Do I need to grind down the surface so it goes deeper? Do I need a new knuckle/spindle assembly? Did hammering the bearing in widen the hole?
I actually bought a GX470 to tide us over while working on the LX470 (no, really) but that now needs U joints or a driveshaft or something; need to get that into the garage so I have to sort this out. I really hope I can finish this job soon. Thanks.
Edit - just found another video, it is not supposed to spin. Going to try cleaning the surface under the bushing more, then hit it with a bigger hammer...
After reading some good reviews here we decided to try Partsouq for the seals and bearing – to note, Toyota dealers in Canada are saying that the inner seal is discontinued, which would be bad if true. They seem to still be available in the rest of the world, so we ordered a couple of them just in case. Anyway, we were lucky enough to order from Partsouq on the day before Eid, so they were closed for several days, and then the floods hit them and knocked out all transportation. Once shipping it only took 2-3 days to get here though, so still might try them again in the future.
I managed to get the old spindle bearing out, it put up a fight and was destroyed in the process, but it finally came out. Got the new one in with a circle of hardwood and a hammer, and set it to the correct depth using the old bushing. But when I went to press the new brass bushing in it just spins – it’s flush with the surface, and right up against the bearing but even if I pound on it (with hardwood for protection) it won’t stay in.
I have watched and read so many threads on this but everyone glosses over this point, people just say the bushing is easy to press in and focus on the bearing. Should the bushing spin? Is it OK if it does? Do I need to grind down the surface so it goes deeper? Do I need a new knuckle/spindle assembly? Did hammering the bearing in widen the hole?
I actually bought a GX470 to tide us over while working on the LX470 (no, really) but that now needs U joints or a driveshaft or something; need to get that into the garage so I have to sort this out. I really hope I can finish this job soon. Thanks.
Edit - just found another video, it is not supposed to spin. Going to try cleaning the surface under the bushing more, then hit it with a bigger hammer...
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It should end up tight against the spindle bearing, so make sure everything is clean and seated all the way. That bushing definitely shouldn’t spin when pressed in. Double check the part number and compare it to your old one.
- Thread starter
- #30
Yeah - and I was just drafting an email to Partsouq subject "What the actual...". So I thought maybe I should just try the other bushing I got in the shipment; same part number but I just noticed a different code in the bottom corner. And it is definitely longer, and does not spin when I put it in. Still haven't pounded it in (so I could take pictures). Also comparing it to the old part, the old bushing (which was torn apart) seems to be made of 2 different materials fused together, and the new ones are just one block of metal. I am going to try and press the alternate one in, if that fails then just order one from Toyota in town here.
That part at least fit my 99 LC. Exactly what I ordered. Needle bearing was 90364-33011.
- Thread starter
- #32
I think this might not be a real Toyota part - looks like it was cut on a CNC machine , and not in Japan. And the one on the right was just poorly cut. But I don't know, the label looks right. Anyway the other bushing hammered in solid, and in fact since my last post my daughter and I got the new seal and the new cv axle installed. Now just the wheel bearings and it should be off the jack stands by the end of the day (saying that to tempt fate...). Going to do the other side after looking at the GX470's driveshaft. Thanks for the input and I will keep updating.
- Thread starter
- #33
Well I started this thread almost a year ago when the LX470’s front hubs/cv spindles wore to the point of almost failing on a trip to Alaska. I like to finish out threads with how things worked out, so I just wanted to say that I finally have 2 new OEM CV joints installed, new spindle bearing on one side, all new seals, and it seems to be rolling great now. Tips I learned that might be of use to someone else with rust issues would be you don’t have to disconnect the steering or the sway bar link, just the upper ball joint; there is a YouTube video of an easy way to get the cv axle out in 30 minutes – it does actually work. As far as ordering from Partsouq, my first experience was not great, but when I went to order the seals they were the only ones anywhere that had one of them, so I tried again and they got them to Canada really fast.
A completely unrelated tip that is not really worth a new thread is related to dealing with the classic P0420/P430 catalytic converter codes. I changed all the O2 sensors, no change, and finally replaced the cats. But I couldn’t stomach 3 grand for OEM so gave the $300 ones a try. They fixed the codes, but within 4 months they were shot and the codes were back. So I know about extending the O2 sensors to trick the system, but on the 100 series the rear ones (which cause the codes) are the flange type sensors so the spark plug extenders that everyone recommends don’t work. But if you search on Aliexpress, there is a company now that sells extenders for the flange type sensors. The got here in a couple of weeks and initial tests say they work. If you use both sections that come with them to extend the sensors, they are so quiet I got a new code for the sensor being unreadable. But I shortened them by just using one of the section (this will make sense if you get them) and if you live stream the O2 data you can see the rear sensor responds to throttle but is nice and smooth and quieter in general. And no codes!
Anyway thanks to everyone who helped me out with the cv joint problems.
A completely unrelated tip that is not really worth a new thread is related to dealing with the classic P0420/P430 catalytic converter codes. I changed all the O2 sensors, no change, and finally replaced the cats. But I couldn’t stomach 3 grand for OEM so gave the $300 ones a try. They fixed the codes, but within 4 months they were shot and the codes were back. So I know about extending the O2 sensors to trick the system, but on the 100 series the rear ones (which cause the codes) are the flange type sensors so the spark plug extenders that everyone recommends don’t work. But if you search on Aliexpress, there is a company now that sells extenders for the flange type sensors. The got here in a couple of weeks and initial tests say they work. If you use both sections that come with them to extend the sensors, they are so quiet I got a new code for the sensor being unreadable. But I shortened them by just using one of the section (this will make sense if you get them) and if you live stream the O2 data you can see the rear sensor responds to throttle but is nice and smooth and quieter in general. And no codes!
Anyway thanks to everyone who helped me out with the cv joint problems.
