red vs blue block for 13B-T

[rutbeer]

Other than finding that the blue block appears to be a later version of the 13B-T, does anyone know the real differences between the two?

 

[lowenbrau]

Post 87? has the newer block which is not sleeved and has and 8 bolt crankshaft-flywheel connection rather than the earlier six. I believe this allows the use of a larger clutch disc and pressure plate ( same as the 2H )

 

[nickw]

I thought red block means it was made by hino?
True or rumour?
Not sure who makes blue.

lowenbrau: does this mean my 88 13bt is not sleeved? Anyone know?

Cheers,
Nick

 

[lowenbrau]

I thought red block means it was made by hino?
True or rumour?
Not sure who makes blue.

lowenbrau: does this mean my 88 13bt is not sleeved? Anyone know?

Cheers,
Nick

They were all probably cast in the same facility as the hino blocks. Yours is not sleeved (yet) All the non sleeved blocks can be sleeved once the cylenders are out of spec. It just means a bit more $ at the machine shop.

 

[Gold Boy]

just for interest.

looks like the same red as pre 87 13bt blocks.

 

[Greg_B]

Post 87? has the newer block which is not sleeved and has and 8 bolt crankshaft-flywheel connection rather than the earlier six. I believe this allows the use of a larger clutch disc and pressure plate ( same as the 2H )

I thought so too, till the head came off the blue block in Poo. Sleeves there are, and it was a late model donor.

Yes on the 8 bold crank vs 6 bolt. The red block shares the same crank number with the 3B.

All post 88/08 I have seen in BJ74's have been blue block, and all earlier ones have been read block thus far.

hth's

gb

 

[rutbeer]

So....which one is better to have? Sounds like a red block might be easier to find parts for, but the blue block might be better for holding turbo modifications because of the clutch and crank.
Why did you have to pull the head on yours Greg?

 

[nickw]

I thought so too, till the head came off the blue block in Poo. Sleeves there are, and it was a late model donor.

Yes on the 8 bold crank vs 6 bolt. The red block shares the same crank number with the 3B.

All post 87 I have seen in BJ74's have been blue block, and all earlier ones have been read block thus far.

hth's

gb

Stones truck (err.. my truck ) is a 1988 and its a red block.
Does that mean it was an engine swap? or that there are red block post 87?

If so, it makes me wonder, is it 6 bolt or 8?
I kinda want to take the pan off and look (but I won't)

Hmm.. come to think of it, Gold Boy, is your engine red or blue?
What about your Greg? Red or blue?

I wonder if they switch to blue block after a certian serial number?
If so, maybe they new "old" (NOS - new old stock) engines in newer trucks?

Or maybe I am just all messed up, and confusing things more?

Cheers,
Nick

 

[Gold Boy]

nick...

86 - red block

 

[Snailtrail]

Ive always thought Toyota started painting the blocks blue when they introduced the new non-sleeved block in 8/88.

I havent personally seen a blue 13bt, but ive got a red 13bt and a 14b in bits out in the shed. Ive been told by someone that has had alot to do with the 'b' series over the year that all the post 8/88 b's (b,3b,11b,13b/t,14b/t) used a common block with the only difference being the bore size.

If that is the case, it interests me that no one has made reference to the fact that the post 8/88 engines use a roller cam. These engines can be identified by the fact that they dont have a cam follower access cover behind the exhaust manifold. Instead the block is cast solid in that area, but has two rows of 8 bolts. IIRC one row has a 10mm head, the other 8mm (these are inline with the roller followers. One acts as a guide pin, the other as a stopper so the follower wont slide down its bore too far when the engine is being assembled upside down.)

It interests me because wouldnt that be a positive way of identifying a non-sleeved 13bt, or does the 'blue' 13bt still have the access cover???

I pressumed it wouldnt as a Daihatsu workshop manual i have for the b & 14b, printed in '88, has a cut away of both engines. It clearly shows both having the solid block and rollor cam.

Out of interest, i drove a Daihatsu Delta 4 ton truck last year powered by a 14b (factory). I forget the year, but '95 rings a bell.

I remember checking the engine over as it was the first 14b i had seen. It had a small aluminum plate glued to the top of the rocker cover which was just big enough to cover the cast TOYOTA in the cover (the glue had come loose enough for me to lift the edge.) The plate had 'Direct Injection' printed on it. The head and block were both painted black, but they both had a raised TOYOTA cast into them.

 

[Greg_B]

Posted dates in error and changed in the post above.

To confirm: Post 88/08 are blue block and have the 8 bolt cranks.

I think it is 1/2 of one, and 1/2 the other for which is better.

Snailtrail: My late model blue block 13BT has a side cover, and does not have a roller cam. Same for the 13BT in my BJ74 (1989).

rutbeer: A lifter needed replacing, as it was sticking and causing the piston to slap the valve, which would force the lifter back down. One new lifter, new head gasket, new valve oil seals and guides and all is well.

hth's

gb

 

[rick_d]

watchou talkin bout Willis?

mine is black...

oh that's right, former red ('87) but now HD-T.

crank, rear main seal retainer, and little stuff is all I have seen in parts searches.

thermostat is o ringed on blue block, gasket on red block (but o ring works as upgrade)

 

[Gold Boy]

when we talk about sleeves, do we mean wet or dry?

cheers

 

[lowenbrau]

In 13BTs, Dry

Prolly all Toyotas are dry.

 

[Deny]

Look at all you spoiled JDM people, discussing engine block colour! Pre JDM all we had was dirty oil coloured blocks!

 

[nickw]

Look at all you spoiled JDM people, discussing engine block colour! Pre JDM all we had was dirty oil coloured blocks!

Please don't hate me because I'm beautiful.
err... I mean: Please don't hate us because our rigs are beautiful.
Well something like that anyways.

 

[rutbeer]

Red block alt is course spline and blue block is fine spline. I have also noticed a difference in the bellhousing brackets. So far, that is all I see, but I haven't cracked it open yet either.

 

[xtremitys]

snailtrail >>

you would'nt have a 14b crankshaft aswell do you ? do you know if it is similar & will fit inside your 13BT block ? doesn't the 14b have a longer stroke ?

cheers
rick

 

[JohnnyBoy]

mine is definitly more of RUSTic brown with a hint of oil based black

 

[tlcruiserman]

I was reading through this again and this explains something on my 3BII engine, it does not have the access cover, yet it has the 8 and 10mm bolts. So my 3BII must have the roller cam, I was really wondering what the heck when I noticed it did not have the cover.

So in addtion to the rotory pump, different exhaust manufold configuration, it also has roller cam.

Oh, I also have a blue block 13b-T and that does hav ethe access cover.

My 3BII is a 1989 as well as my 13B-T

Cheers,

Michael

Ive always thought Toyota started painting the blocks blue when they introduced the new non-sleeved block in 8/88.

I havent personally seen a blue 13bt, but ive got a red 13bt and a 14b in bits out in the shed. Ive been told by someone that has had alot to do with the 'b' series over the year that all the post 8/88 b's (b,3b,11b,13b/t,14b/t) used a common block with the only difference being the bore size.

If that is the case, it interests me that no one has made reference to the fact that the post 8/88 engines use a roller cam. These engines can be identified by the fact that they dont have a cam follower access cover behind the exhaust manifold. Instead the block is cast solid in that area, but has two rows of 8 bolts. IIRC one row has a 10mm head, the other 8mm (these are inline with the roller followers. One acts as a guide pin, the other as a stopper so the follower wont slide down its bore too far when the engine is being assembled upside down.)

It interests me because wouldnt that be a positive way of identifying a non-sleeved 13bt, or does the 'blue' 13bt still have the access cover???

I pressumed it wouldnt as a Daihatsu workshop manual i have for the b & 14b, printed in '88, has a cut away of both engines. It clearly shows both having the solid block and rollor cam.

Out of interest, i drove a Daihatsu Delta 4 ton truck last year powered by a 14b (factory). I forget the year, but '95 rings a bell.

I remember checking the engine over as it was the first 14b i had seen. It had a small aluminum plate glued to the top of the rocker cover which was just big enough to cover the cast TOYOTA in the cover (the glue had come loose enough for me to lift the edge.) The plate had 'Direct Injection' printed on it. The head and block were both painted black, but they both had a raised TOYOTA cast into them.