Alright, So I've got a 10/84 FJ60 (it's got the H42) and I've got more oil leaks than I can count. Should I spend the money on the 2F or invest in a conversion? I'm thinking either a Chevy 350 or a Chevy 4.3 V6... Any advice?
Rebuild the 2F or Convert?
- Thread starter randomhero01
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Oil is cheap, and some of the leaks can be easy/cheap to fix. Hows the engine run? What is the compression? How many miles until you need to add a quart?
Lets say you drive the american average of 12,000 miles per year, and have really bad leakage so you need to add 1 qt every fill up (~200 miles). This means 60 qts of oil per year, or about $120.
Now if the engine doesn't run well...that's a different situation.
Lets say you drive the american average of 12,000 miles per year, and have really bad leakage so you need to add 1 qt every fill up (~200 miles). This means 60 qts of oil per year, or about $120.
Now if the engine doesn't run well...that's a different situation.
Im in VIRTUALLY the same situation except my engine is just plain TIRED and surprisingly NOT leaking.
The rebuilt motors are $$$$$$!
FAAAAR more than I would have though.
The re build kits are RIDICULUS $$$$$$!
Again, far more than I would have EVER imagined!
For my rig and the mileage it has it is actually MORE cost effective to swap than it is to rebuild.
If youre happy with the performance of your set up, id say replace the seals that are leaking if that is your only complaint. But when you start getting into pulling the whole assy. out to replace it with a rebuilt/ rebuilding it, you might be better off considering other options as the "F" units are EXPENSIVE!
Some will disagree, but this is what Ive found recently. However, I have a 3fe with the auto which skews my situation somewhat.
Chicago
The rebuilt motors are $$$$$$!
FAAAAR more than I would have though.
The re build kits are RIDICULUS $$$$$$!
Again, far more than I would have EVER imagined!
For my rig and the mileage it has it is actually MORE cost effective to swap than it is to rebuild.
If youre happy with the performance of your set up, id say replace the seals that are leaking if that is your only complaint. But when you start getting into pulling the whole assy. out to replace it with a rebuilt/ rebuilding it, you might be better off considering other options as the "F" units are EXPENSIVE!
Some will disagree, but this is what Ive found recently. However, I have a 3fe with the auto which skews my situation somewhat.
Chicago
I am in the same boat also...what i want to know is How much does a late model chevy V8 swap cost VS the older carb. V8 swap? Also has any done or is it possible to do a V8 swap out of a tundra or a V6 swap out of a tacoma?
yes but adapters are not redily available making the swap much more expensive.
chances are you will not be able to do a carbe'd V8 swap in your area (smog laws)
if you have a shop do the conversion. Figure 5K on the low side (you provide the parts) to over 15K easily. And you can always pay more. V8 swaps are labor intensive. If you can do the work yourself, they are not too bad. But if you cannot, they get pricy, fast..
if you have a shop do the conversion. Figure 5K on the low side (you provide the parts) to over 15K easily. And you can always pay more. V8 swaps are labor intensive. If you can do the work yourself, they are not too bad. But if you cannot, they get pricy, fast..
I rebuilt the 2F in mine, because I'm a bit of a purist, but if I have to do it again, I'd prolly go with a SBC crate engine. By the time I was all done (or close to it - motor ain't in yet) I've got a wee bit over $3k into the motor (professional rebuild by the guy who does MAF's motors), but that was about $500 over just the cost of parts and machining.
So if I had to do it again, I would either go SBC or the best option, I think, squeeze the money somehow and do a Diesel swap - then you'd have a truck for the next 20 years.
I'm not sorry about the 2F rebuild -- I really like the 2F motor and the ease of working on an Inline 6. Plus, it's original, if that means anything to anybody anymore
S.
So if I had to do it again, I would either go SBC or the best option, I think, squeeze the money somehow and do a Diesel swap - then you'd have a truck for the next 20 years.
I'm not sorry about the 2F rebuild -- I really like the 2F motor and the ease of working on an Inline 6. Plus, it's original, if that means anything to anybody anymore
S.
Any average Joe with a FSM, and the aid of 'Mud can rebuild a 2F in their garage.
I, for one, would rather buy a 100bucks worth of tools than spend that same 100bucks for an hour of shoptime. 'Cause you get to keep the tools.
If you don't do your own fabwork, but can follow written directions. Rebuild the 2F.
You'll have to buy (or borrow) the best engine stand you can. Rent, buy or borrow a hoist. You'll drop a couple Grand at the machine shop. But you can assemble, install, start and run your 2F all by yourself. The only scary part is the size and weight of that block. There is nothing that complicated in the engine, it all goes together easily and bolts back into place beautifully.
There is a certain security in rebuilding a 2F. Everything has a place and a purpose.
And if you get all the internals in the right place (not hard), and put the block back where it belongs (kinda hard, but do-able), hook up all the wires, cables and hoses (not too hard), and then all those vacuum hoses (seems impossible, but it's been done), Somehow, when you give it electricity, it starts and runs. (oh, the feeling you get when you hear your rebuild start for the first time? Indescribable). And if you've done a decent job, it'll run for another 20 years. A hand-made, owner-built 2F (with the aid of a good machine shop) is, IMNSHO, superior to a factory-new engine. (You WILL have your rotating assemblies balanced). It will run better than new. Guaranteed. Plus, you have the option of certain upgrades at this time.
It will not run like a v-8. It's still just a LandCruiser. I'm not gonna badmouth v-swaps, 'cause someday I may have one. But right now, I suggest rebuilding your 6. It's cheaper, easier, been done a million times. Plus, the knowledge, of your rig, gained, is friggin' priceless.
I, for one, would rather buy a 100bucks worth of tools than spend that same 100bucks for an hour of shoptime. 'Cause you get to keep the tools.
If you don't do your own fabwork, but can follow written directions. Rebuild the 2F.
You'll have to buy (or borrow) the best engine stand you can. Rent, buy or borrow a hoist. You'll drop a couple Grand at the machine shop. But you can assemble, install, start and run your 2F all by yourself. The only scary part is the size and weight of that block. There is nothing that complicated in the engine, it all goes together easily and bolts back into place beautifully.
There is a certain security in rebuilding a 2F. Everything has a place and a purpose.
And if you get all the internals in the right place (not hard), and put the block back where it belongs (kinda hard, but do-able), hook up all the wires, cables and hoses (not too hard), and then all those vacuum hoses (seems impossible, but it's been done), Somehow, when you give it electricity, it starts and runs. (oh, the feeling you get when you hear your rebuild start for the first time? Indescribable). And if you've done a decent job, it'll run for another 20 years. A hand-made, owner-built 2F (with the aid of a good machine shop) is, IMNSHO, superior to a factory-new engine. (You WILL have your rotating assemblies balanced). It will run better than new. Guaranteed. Plus, you have the option of certain upgrades at this time.
It will not run like a v-8. It's still just a LandCruiser. I'm not gonna badmouth v-swaps, 'cause someday I may have one. But right now, I suggest rebuilding your 6. It's cheaper, easier, been done a million times. Plus, the knowledge, of your rig, gained, is friggin' priceless.
I rebuilt the 2F in mine, because I'm a bit of a purist, but if I have to do it again, I'd prolly go with a SBC crate engine. By the time I was all done (or close to it - motor ain't in yet) I've got a wee bit over $3k into the motor (professional rebuild by the guy who does MAF's motors), but that was about $500 over just the cost of parts and machining.
So if I had to do it again, I would either go SBC or the best option, I think, squeeze the money somehow and do a Diesel swap - then you'd have a truck for the next 20 years.
I'm not sorry about the 2F rebuild -- I really like the 2F motor and the ease of working on an Inline 6. Plus, it's original, if that means anything to anybody anymore
S.
It means something to me as well. I plan on rebuilding my 2F although I know it won't be the cheapest route.
I've always admired that big classic Japanese anchor under my hood
The amount of weekend cruising i'll be doing when my truck's back together , that 2F will last the rest of my lifetime.
There is good reason to rebuild just like there is good reason to convert. I think a rebuild will be cheaper than a conversion so if money is big issue then I say rebuild. As for engine size, definitely go with the 350 if you choose to convert.
$1380.00 for a lq9 6.0 Chevrolet motor, manifold, computer, and all acc., $500.00 computer and wiring flashing and conversion, Turbo 350 or 400 Tranny and a 205 transfer case around $500 or so, and the ease of being able to stand straight up and never have to worry about the engine cutting off sputtering priceless. With this install I would recomend a set of longfield but if you are feeling lucky go ahead and try. Oh yeah I am sorry there is a torque converter that you have to buy to adapt to the old style tranny for $200 but still well worth it. I would say no more than really rebuilding that old tired 2F
The stock 6 rebuild makes sense, knowing your rig is important. The 350 conversion is nice, lotsa power, cheap (and easy) to fix.
I personally wouldnt use a turbo 350 for the trans, and a 205 t-case has not so desireable gearing and has a centered rear output. The best would be to use a 5.3 chevy (pretty good fuel economy) a 700r4 or 460le to a 203 to a LC t-case. that could get really pricey. I bought a 88 GMC suburban for $800, it had a rebuilt tbi 350, 700r4 and a 261 t-case.....not the best t-case but I found another one on craigslist for $75...so I have a spare...theyre easy to change. Im putting Chevy full size axles under it cuz I had em (14 bolt rear, unsure of the front). We'll see what happens. Its kinda hard to know where to stop the converions i.e. where do you blend the 2 together. As of right now with buying the 2 rigs, selling off what I didnt need and Buying a set of 35s and a detroit, Im only into the rig for about $500.....but thats me doing every bit of the conversion and lotsa fabrication...and I know how to wire the TBI in without a pain(fullyexpensive)less wiring harnes.
Good luck!
I personally wouldnt use a turbo 350 for the trans, and a 205 t-case has not so desireable gearing and has a centered rear output. The best would be to use a 5.3 chevy (pretty good fuel economy) a 700r4 or 460le to a 203 to a LC t-case. that could get really pricey. I bought a 88 GMC suburban for $800, it had a rebuilt tbi 350, 700r4 and a 261 t-case.....not the best t-case but I found another one on craigslist for $75...so I have a spare...theyre easy to change. Im putting Chevy full size axles under it cuz I had em (14 bolt rear, unsure of the front). We'll see what happens. Its kinda hard to know where to stop the converions i.e. where do you blend the 2 together. As of right now with buying the 2 rigs, selling off what I didnt need and Buying a set of 35s and a detroit, Im only into the rig for about $500.....but thats me doing every bit of the conversion and lotsa fabrication...and I know how to wire the TBI in without a pain(fullyexpensive)less wiring harnes.
Good luck!
The 700r is a good tranny if you throw a lot of money at it the 4l60e is a little better but the reason for using the 400 and 350s depending on what you are doing with them is to where you have to draw the line. For highway use and a little mild wheeling the 700 and 4l60e are fine but I have saw to many of them break down. The 4l80e out of a 2wd is a better tranny and can be coupled to a land crusier tcase. TBI are ok motors along with the 5.3. If you go the 5.3 make sure that it is a later model engine bc the earlier ones had a engine ping to them until they got warm.
I'm with Pighead.
Rebuild the 2F.
I may be biased because I'm in the process of doing it but who cares
Rebuild the 2F.
I may be biased because I'm in the process of doing it but who cares
So you have $2380 just in parts alone.
Axles? Gonna change the lug pattern? New tires/wheels???
Radiator?
fuel tank?
exhaust?
driveshafts?
coolant/fuel lines?
Motor mounts?
The bummer about a V8 conversion is that it is not the big ticket items that end up costing a lot.
It is the little things that end up nickel and dimeing you to death....
BTW, pighead, a couple grand at the machine shop?? Doing what???
Or are you having the machine shop source the new parts???
Cruiserdrew
On the way there
Assuming this is not a Daily driver....I think the 2F just works. It will run at stupid low rpm, any angle, and cause no problems for 200k miles. What else do you want? Rebuild the 2F. If you want fuel injection, make a 2F-E.
If it's a daily driver, there is an argument to be made that a SBC will do the job better. It has more displacement, more power, more everything except Toyota karma.
I don't know my Chevy's real well, but what about a 292? It's sort of a 2F, only better. Then you don't have a 350 like everyone else, and you have the in-line 6 excellence.
If it's a daily driver, there is an argument to be made that a SBC will do the job better. It has more displacement, more power, more everything except Toyota karma.
I don't know my Chevy's real well, but what about a 292? It's sort of a 2F, only better. Then you don't have a 350 like everyone else, and you have the in-line 6 excellence.
- Thread starter
- #18
Thanks!
Hey guys, thanks for the responses. I think I'm gonna stick with the 2F, but my next question is, should I just replace the seals (front/rear main, transmission, etc) or look deeper? I'm gonna be driving this daily for the next few months, then off to Benning, GA for some fun.
RH01
Hey guys, thanks for the responses. I think I'm gonna stick with the 2F, but my next question is, should I just replace the seals (front/rear main, transmission, etc) or look deeper? I'm gonna be driving this daily for the next few months, then off to Benning, GA for some fun.
RH01
What makes the 4L80E better than the 4L60E?
What components failed on the 700r/ 4L60?
What is "mild" wheeling to you?
Ive talked to a few people with the 5.3, 4L60, 203, 19 spline set up and havent had any problems with them?
The 4L60E is the route Im going, so Im all ears (or eyes in this case) for your response.
Chicago
deja vu.
I rebuilt mine a couple of years back... got the 5 speed tranny and a little afte a year I decided to do the swap into the chevy.....
I liked the 2f for the most part but was not meant to be and it wasn't cheap...
if you can do the rebuilt yourself its a lot cheaper.. I didn't have the time or space back then...
I decided to do the swap and being my first its been well over a year now (damn, I miss driving my rig !!!) but Im glad I did it....
I have done alot of other non planned work on my truck and it has been really cool working on it and getting all the guidance from the mud fellas in here !!!
Im waaaaaaay waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaayyy past my original budget but then again Im not doing it to get better fuel milage
Good luck to yah...... !!!
I rebuilt mine a couple of years back... got the 5 speed tranny and a little afte a year I decided to do the swap into the chevy.....
I liked the 2f for the most part but was not meant to be and it wasn't cheap...
if you can do the rebuilt yourself its a lot cheaper.. I didn't have the time or space back then...
I decided to do the swap and being my first its been well over a year now (damn, I miss driving my rig !!!) but Im glad I did it....
I have done alot of other non planned work on my truck and it has been really cool working on it and getting all the guidance from the mud fellas in here !!!
Im waaaaaaay waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaayyy past my original budget but then again Im not doing it to get better fuel milage
Good luck to yah...... !!!
