If you had more experience, you would probably not want to use a high lift a shovel and some boards to get out of a boggy stick. Why not get one of those cheap winches from China? Aren't they designed in OZ like they say? If not, at least go with a mate that has one.
No winch, how do you guys get yourself out of the bog?
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If you had more experience, you would probably not want to use a high lift a shovel and some boards to get out of a boggy stick. Why not get one of those cheap winches from China? Aren't they designed in OZ like they say? If not, at least go with a mate that has one.
He should have a hi-lift anyway, but he'll need lift points on his rig to use it. Sometimes there's no point in winching until you lift the truck out of the muck first.
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Getting bogged, breaking down, getting injured etc can be deadly in the oz bush if you're on your own.
I've gone out in the oz bush a lot in one vehicle, but always with a mate. I've broken down once (busted suspension component) that required getting back to the highway (little honda 50cc minibike in the back of the 4wd - we take 2 of them) about 30 miles away. Then hitching a lift to the nearest town (100 miles away), getting replacement part, hitching a lift back, driving back to the 4wd on the minibike. Quite the adventure that took nearly 2 days out of our trip. Mate stayed with the 4wd and worked on getting it jacked up and ready for the replacement part. The key was keeping calm, taking it easy, taking it safe, knowing we had plenty of food/water and alternate transportation to get back to help.
Anyhow, not directly an answer to your question, but something to consider beyond the simple "getting bogged" issue.
Bare minimum gear I'd take would be a full size shovel, a decent jack, highlift/baseplate etc AND spots on the vehicle that it can be used on. Be able to deflate/re-inflate the tyres. Be ready to hike to get wood etc to put under the tyres after you've jacked the vehicle up. Decent mud terrain tyres. Brain engaged before putting vehicle in gear....
Eventually you'll get tired of the de-bogging b/s and get a decent winch, extension cables and think about recovery options (trees etc) that may not be available before hitting the bog
Diff locks will also help a lot.
Momentum will get you a long way - maybe too far....
Once you get stuck and start digging down, get off the pedal fast before you're down to the chassis.
Worst stuck ever was on the edge of a salt lake. Took ~4 hours of digging and dragging wood/shrubs from a mile or two away - nothing much lives around a salt lake - especially one named "Lake Disappointment" Took us 1 minute to get stuck (2 vehicle lengths into the lake) and 4 hours to get the vehicle unstuck (moving it back 2 vehicle lengths)...
Finally, sounds like you need to find some mates with 4wds and go have some fun together and learn what works for you and what doesn't. Learn the capabilities of your rig and how it is setup and learn to read the terrain so to not attempt the really stupid (well not too often at least). When unsure, it doesn't hurt to get out on foot and take a stick and do some soil tests - easier to get your feet a little muddy versus your entire body
cheers,
george.
I've gone out in the oz bush a lot in one vehicle, but always with a mate. I've broken down once (busted suspension component) that required getting back to the highway (little honda 50cc minibike in the back of the 4wd - we take 2 of them) about 30 miles away. Then hitching a lift to the nearest town (100 miles away), getting replacement part, hitching a lift back, driving back to the 4wd on the minibike. Quite the adventure that took nearly 2 days out of our trip. Mate stayed with the 4wd and worked on getting it jacked up and ready for the replacement part. The key was keeping calm, taking it easy, taking it safe, knowing we had plenty of food/water and alternate transportation to get back to help.
Anyhow, not directly an answer to your question, but something to consider beyond the simple "getting bogged" issue.
Bare minimum gear I'd take would be a full size shovel, a decent jack, highlift/baseplate etc AND spots on the vehicle that it can be used on. Be able to deflate/re-inflate the tyres. Be ready to hike to get wood etc to put under the tyres after you've jacked the vehicle up. Decent mud terrain tyres. Brain engaged before putting vehicle in gear....
Eventually you'll get tired of the de-bogging b/s and get a decent winch, extension cables and think about recovery options (trees etc) that may not be available before hitting the bog
Diff locks will also help a lot.
Momentum will get you a long way - maybe too far....
Once you get stuck and start digging down, get off the pedal fast before you're down to the chassis.
Worst stuck ever was on the edge of a salt lake. Took ~4 hours of digging and dragging wood/shrubs from a mile or two away - nothing much lives around a salt lake - especially one named "Lake Disappointment"
Took us 1 minute to get stuck (2 vehicle lengths into the lake) and 4 hours to get the vehicle unstuck (moving it back 2 vehicle lengths)...Finally, sounds like you need to find some mates with 4wds and go have some fun together and learn what works for you and what doesn't. Learn the capabilities of your rig and how it is setup and learn to read the terrain so to not attempt the really stupid (well not too often at least). When unsure, it doesn't hurt to get out on foot and take a stick and do some soil tests - easier to get your feet a little muddy versus your entire body
cheers,
george.
Winching with a HiLift can be done but its hard yakka.
The handles useful for fighting off dropbears though.
The handles useful for fighting off dropbears though.
This couple drove through the Congo in their 78 series Landcruiser without a winch, but what an adventure...
Democratic Republic of Congo: Lubumbashi to Kinshasa - Expedition Portal Forum
Democratic Republic of Congo: Lubumbashi to Kinshasa - Expedition Portal Forum
You'd be better off keeping the carton of beer. That way you'll have something to keep you occupied while you wait for someone to come help you
Seriously though, the hi-lift is a great tool. It can be difficult and time consuming AND dangerous to use as a winch, but it will work. Sometimes a little digging and a few well placed rocks or sticks is much faster than winching. Plus, you're not "cheating"
lol, ain't that the truth, and the very reason why I don't drive thru water and mud when I can avoid it.
Once you've been stuck, you'll get a winch before going out again. First thing I did to my truck was install a winch. Even before I stuck tires on it.
The fact is, if you're going to go mudding in a bog, you'll need a winch. You may not want to spend the money one and install it, but you'll need it.
It's possible to install one for super cheap without buying an ARB bullbar by putting it inside the stock bumper. That cuts down on the cost by a few hundred dollars.
https://forum.ih8mud.com/80-series-tech/447707-winch-inside-stock-bumper-fzj80.html
Toyo Boyo
SILVER Star
What's a bog?
Funny as f**k!
This is a bog, the truck was right down on the frame rails and skid plates, no traction at all.
And this is what happens when you - leave your recovery kit at home including hi lift jack and hand winch; don't properly check out what's ahead; leave your mud tyres in the house too; wheel alone (but not too remote, lucky for me)
This was a big learning opportunity - now I never do any of the above (ok, maybe wheel alone) Oh, and I got an 80 with lockers, the Surf is long gone.
For the remote outback, I would get a good winch
looks like if you were in a Rover you'd have all the Top Gear crew pulling you out, but then you'd be Jeremy and I wouldn't wish that on anyone.
Mark W
Yep, I really don't really care that much I guess.
If you explore alone... in any sort of terrain that includes bogs and other terrain that can easily leave your vehicle immobilized... without appropriate recovery gear (and the knowledge of how to put it to good use)... far from assistance... especially in rig like a basically stock '80 series Cruiser... and not wanting to have the recovery gear???
You had better be prepared to walk out.
I understand the desire to explore alone. I do it when I can. Slowly pushing new trails further into the back country and when I get as far as I can take the vehicle, I spend a day or two hiking scouting potential routes to take the rigs) further.
I DO have recovery gear and I DO have the experience to use it (The comment not wanting to see how a Pullpal would "fly" if it failed to bite while winching seems to indicate that the OP does not have much extraction experience along with not wanting a winch on his rig).
But no matter how much gear you have or experience using it, if you are exploring by yourself, the most important thing to understand is when to STOP. When to not try to push the rig through a tough spot. If you have any question about getting through a particular spot in your rig, you need to be aware of what being stuck will result in.
There will always be places and ways to get a rig stuck or disabled so that whatever gear you have will still be unable to get you moving again. It is just a part of serious off road travel... once you start pushing things, you will find that you can never have everything you need for every situation.
Laying your rig on its side in a rocky slot is a problem to be dealt with when you are in a group. When you are alone... it can be the start of a disaster. Drowning your rig in a water crossing can be an irritation in a group and deadly when alone. A long stretch of alpine or river bottom quicksand makes for a goods story when you have a buddy or two to pull you out but a can give you a rig that simply cannot self extract if the friends are not there.
Exploring alone is good stuff. But unless you are just running lightly used roads or never getting far from them, then of the most important gear to have is the gear needed to hike back to civilization and the awareness that you might have to do so.
For that matter, this can still happen even when you have a partner. We had a situation a couple years ago where I snapped the output shaft on my 203 doubler about 80 miles from the road system. Four us us and a dog plied into the other '40 that was with me... but we had crossed a couple of spots that had required both rigs working together to get through. We were very concerned that we would wind up stuck in one of these spots on the way out in the now single rig. We wound up blazing new trail through the woods to circumnavigate a marsh. We made it to the road system with no problems, but we had to be ready for a very long hike and a lot of river crossings if we had run into any problems.
Again... the most important gear to carry is the gear to hike out anytime you explore alone.
Mark...
You had better be prepared to walk out.
I understand the desire to explore alone. I do it when I can. Slowly pushing new trails further into the back country and when I get as far as I can take the vehicle, I spend a day or two hiking scouting potential routes to take the rigs) further.
I DO have recovery gear and I DO have the experience to use it (The comment not wanting to see how a Pullpal would "fly" if it failed to bite while winching seems to indicate that the OP does not have much extraction experience along with not wanting a winch on his rig).
But no matter how much gear you have or experience using it, if you are exploring by yourself, the most important thing to understand is when to STOP. When to not try to push the rig through a tough spot. If you have any question about getting through a particular spot in your rig, you need to be aware of what being stuck will result in.
There will always be places and ways to get a rig stuck or disabled so that whatever gear you have will still be unable to get you moving again. It is just a part of serious off road travel... once you start pushing things, you will find that you can never have everything you need for every situation.
Laying your rig on its side in a rocky slot is a problem to be dealt with when you are in a group. When you are alone... it can be the start of a disaster. Drowning your rig in a water crossing can be an irritation in a group and deadly when alone. A long stretch of alpine or river bottom quicksand makes for a goods story when you have a buddy or two to pull you out but a can give you a rig that simply cannot self extract if the friends are not there.
Exploring alone is good stuff. But unless you are just running lightly used roads or never getting far from them, then of the most important gear to have is the gear needed to hike back to civilization and the awareness that you might have to do so.
For that matter, this can still happen even when you have a partner. We had a situation a couple years ago where I snapped the output shaft on my 203 doubler about 80 miles from the road system. Four us us and a dog plied into the other '40 that was with me... but we had crossed a couple of spots that had required both rigs working together to get through. We were very concerned that we would wind up stuck in one of these spots on the way out in the now single rig. We wound up blazing new trail through the woods to circumnavigate a marsh. We made it to the road system with no problems, but we had to be ready for a very long hike and a lot of river crossings if we had run into any problems.
Again... the most important gear to carry is the gear to hike out anytime you explore alone.
Mark...
Toyo Boyo
SILVER Star
Indeed, and having done that I felt like a Jeremy!I had the
with me, I was dropping her off to lunch with her friends - missed that! It took me many calls (poor signal) and several hours (friend of a friend etc) to finally get a farmer to come and pull me out.And he took £40 off me before he'd get out of his cab.
A lesson learned, and in serious off road, I'd get that winch and anchor (there were no trees at all). And yes to being prepared for a long hike if it does go t!ts up.
x2 what Mark and others said about going it alone.
I've been making a bit more effort to go out with friends on new trails after spending a night with my 3 yr old in Metal Creek quicksand digging and that was with a winch (you have to dig a big hole to winch off a 36" spare). My situation wasn't terribly serious, but I also realized that if it had been the wrong time of year or weather conditions persisted in warming up, the creek could have risen and turned life threatening.
If you push your vehicle to the limits or are exploring challenging new trails, it's best to have someone to help pick up the pieces or at least help dig you out. As for the winch question, definitely get one eventually, but you still really need a hi-lift, recovery strap, winch line extension, shackles, etc... even with a winch, so you might as well get those and learn how to use'em. You'll appreciate the winch even more after using a hi-lift.
I've been making a bit more effort to go out with friends on new trails after spending a night with my 3 yr old in Metal Creek quicksand digging and that was with a winch (you have to dig a big hole to winch off a 36" spare). My situation wasn't terribly serious, but I also realized that if it had been the wrong time of year or weather conditions persisted in warming up, the creek could have risen and turned life threatening.
If you push your vehicle to the limits or are exploring challenging new trails, it's best to have someone to help pick up the pieces or at least help dig you out. As for the winch question, definitely get one eventually, but you still really need a hi-lift, recovery strap, winch line extension, shackles, etc... even with a winch, so you might as well get those and learn how to use'em. You'll appreciate the winch even more after using a hi-lift.
- Thread starter
- #34
Good conversation so far everyone. I really like that thread posted with the guy on safari, he got bogged ALOT!!
What I mainly get from this thread is, drive cautiously. And I always do anyway in terms of going through sections that could get me into trouble and I haven't been bogged in the 80.
I had another lesson yesterday afternoon where I was backing out of a trail that was too boggy too pass and the track was really narrow and I hit a concreted pole.. Luckily it only scraped its paint onto my plastic wheel-arch and I was able to get most of it off. I learned not to just back out willie nillie and always check the path before making rash decisions because thats how things go wrong.
Working with safety officers recently they have a motto.
They said to me
'We don't believe in accidents, only stupidity' and they believe that all work-place accidents can be avoided. I believe the same pretty well goes for 4wding.
What I mainly get from this thread is, drive cautiously. And I always do anyway in terms of going through sections that could get me into trouble and I haven't been bogged in the 80.
I had another lesson yesterday afternoon where I was backing out of a trail that was too boggy too pass and the track was really narrow and I hit a concreted pole.. Luckily it only scraped its paint onto my plastic wheel-arch and I was able to get most of it off. I learned not to just back out willie nillie and always check the path before making rash decisions because thats how things go wrong.
Working with safety officers recently they have a motto.
They said to me
'We don't believe in accidents, only stupidity' and they believe that all work-place accidents can be avoided. I believe the same pretty well goes for 4wding.
Mark W
Yep, I really don't really care that much I guess.
Drive cautiously.. or maybe just say, "Drive intelligently"... we all take risks, just make sure that you understand them as you do. Plan ahead...whether it is the trip or the obstacle, plan ahead, Be prepared. Learn from your mistakes so you can do it better next time.
Have fun and make it home.
A few here have heard me say this..."An adventure is just a disaster survived."
Never go looking for adventure. It will find you often enough.
And someone else's disaster? That is just a funny story.
Mark...
Be prepared. Learn from your mistakes so you can do it better next time.Have fun and make it home.
A few here have heard me say this..."An adventure is just a disaster survived."
Never go looking for adventure. It will find you often enough.
And someone else's disaster? That is just a funny story.
Mark...
