New member intro / regearing question

[Zdeech]

Hi folks, I bought a '91 FJ80 last March, and joined Mud, and the High Desert Cruisers back in April, but I haven't taken the chance to post in the clubhouse. I don't think I can make the North Baldy run this Saturday, but I do want to make it out to a meeting!

I also have a tech question, and thought I would run it by local members. I think the land cruiser I bought is in pretty good shape. It has around 168k, and it was more or less stock when I bought it. It was running good, and had some maintenance records. I went through and baselined it, and it is running great. I have a friend with a '92 FJ80, so I knew what I was getting into regarding the 3FE. I was attracted to the low cost of entry, and if I want to drive fast, I have a quicker vehicle for that.

So, after adding some heavy 16x8 steel wheels, 285 75 R16's, a 2.5" lift, and now a frontrunner roof rack, I really feel the need to regear. It feels less responsive around town, and I notice it more on highway runs. I went up to the Jemez last weekend for a quick day trip (vehicle was pretty empty), and noticed that I am at 2400 rpms at around 74-75 mph (actual speed from GPS). It seems like 2400 rpm on the 3FE is where it should be on the highway, but I feel like I am really flogging it to keep this beast going ~75 (it's almost like having cruise control - just mash the peddle to the floor!). I would like to regear to gain some acceleration and maybe cruise more comfortably at around 65-70mph?

I am trying to decide on whether to go with 4.56 or 4.88 gears. I just bought the 33"s, and do not plan to go larger as far as tires go. I would like to add sliders at some point, but I don't plan to armour it more than that. This is not my daily driver, and is used for weekend camping trips, and the occasional week long overland style trip. I have read several threads, with varying opinions. I also searched the 60 series forum and found threads where people say that 4.88 gears are perfect for the 3FE / A440F combo with 33"s. From analyzing some online calculators, it looks like 4.56 would be close to stock with my 33"s. But then going with 4.88s might be a good choice since we live at 5,000 plus feet, and go higher than that usually for trips. I am concerned that if I go with 4.56, it might feel like it wasn't quite worth it. I also wouldn't want to go with 4.88's if the engine is screaming at 65mph.

TL/DR: New member here, should I go with 4.56 or 4.88 on an FJ80 (3FE) with 33"s?

Anyone have any suggestions?

Here a couple shots from last Saturday!

Thanks,
Zach

 

[pappy]

First ... I really like the 3FE. I (sort of) own one (2F + 3FE Frankenstein). Second, your situation is similar to what I went through with my 4Runner.

My 4Runner came with 28" tires and 4.10 gears (manual tranny). Convention says going to 31" tires requires 4.56 gears, and 33" tires requires 4.88. On the 4Runner, I have 33" tires and 4.56 gears. Love it, but ... I have a R151F for a transmission, which has a lower first gear. It helps a bit around town. On the highway it's fine.

I had an 85 xcab for awhile and installed 33" tires and 4.88 gears. I hated it. It was fine around town, but rpms on the freeway were much higher than they needed to be.

So, what it comes down to is the primary use of the truck. For camping and a little expo, I would go 4.56. If you plan on turning the truck into a crawler, then go 4.88.

 

[jstncse]

Welcome, Good looking 80. I think I would have to agree with Pappy on this one. 4.56 gears should be plenty to get you back to where you felt it was ok. 4.56 gives you an 11 or 12% increase in overall gearing which should comfortably overcome the added tire size.
I would go 4.88's if you have any thought (in the dark recesses) of going to 35's or 37's.

 

[evanz80]

Welcome! I think the guys above have some good suggestions on gearing. I have a '93 FZJ-80 with 4.88's and 35 inch tires, but it's the 1FZ-FE engine, so that's a different story.

I was curious about your roofrack - did you buy it new or where did you find it?

Look forward to seeing you on the trail!
Evan

 

[Zdeech]

Thanks guys, I appreciate all of your advice. It looks like I will go with 4.56's.

@pappy: I read about 3FE strokers at one point, that sounds like a sweet engine. Thanks for mentioning your experience re-gearing vehicles.

@jstncse: I don't plan on going to 35's or 37's. Could be famous last words! I am sure people have done that....

@evanz80: The roof rack is a Front Runner slimline II. I ordered it new from Slee. I considered putting together a rack from an ATV ramp (found a thread on mud about that), and also considered a baja rack (there is a 3/4 length one for around $600). I saw a front runner rack in person, and decided it was worth the price. It is very light, and all of their add-ons seem well designed. I also like that it is flat, but still has the option to add rails on the sides. I picked up a double jerry can holder, a shovel mount, and some eyelets to help with tying stuff down. I plan on mounting a 2 meter ARB awning in the near future, and possibly getting a tire mount so I have the option of putting the spare up there if I need to.

For the re-gearing work, I was thinking of having NM Gear and Clutch do the work. I had them install a detroit truetrac on a tacoma that I had, and they did a good job. Anyone have any other suggestions on where to get the gearing done?

I know I should probably spring for an ARB locker in the rear while I am paying for the labor of the re-gearing. i don't think I could swing front and rear lockers at this point, but I could probably get the funds together for the rear. It looks like I could get an ARB locker for the rear with the ARB high performance compressor for a little over $1200. How difficult is the compressor install, and running the air lines to the diff? I have run air lines before on a firestone ride rite air bag install on another vehicle, and it was pretty easy. I didn't install a compressor though.

 

[alia176]

I have 4.56 with 315s (metric 35's) and that's not a very good choice for this altitude. I did my re-gear at sea level but out here in Abq, this is a poor choice for 315s. Just another data point for you.

Regarding running locker air lines, it's a piece of cake. I have ARB lockers using York air comp and a generic air manifold. I'll be more than happy to show you all this if you want. Just let me know.

 

[Zdeech]

I have 4.56 with 315s (metric 35's) and that's not a very good choice for this altitude. I did my re-gear at sea level but out here in Abq, this is a poor choice for 315s. Just another data point for you.

Regarding running locker air lines, it's a piece of cake. I have ARB lockers using York air comp and a generic air manifold. I'll be more than happy to show you all this if you want. Just let me know.

Thanks for your input on this, and the offer to let me take a look at your air compressor install. I will probably take you up on that. I will get in touch with you at some point in the next few weeks. Thanks!

Anyone have another local gear shop they would recommend? I want to get a second quote.

 

[pappy]

• Regearing: Many of us use U-Joints to do the work.
• Rear ARB: Are you really asking this question? If you are having the back end opened up you might as well do it right the first time. Yes, install the ARB and don't look back.
• ARB Awning: Go with the 2.5 meter. I have the 2m on my 4 Runner and really wish it was the larger size. The 2.5M is a good size for the 80-series. The price difference is near nothing.

 

[alia176]

I agree with Pappy, go with the longest awning you can fit. Because, why? Pappy knows the answer

 

[pappy]

Because, why? Pappy knows the answer

To quote the infinitely wise Ali ... "you can't have enough shade in the desert."

 

[Zdeech]

Ha, I appreciate the awning tip, unfortunately I ordered a 2 meter awning earlier this afternoon! Doh.

Yea, I did actually ask the question about the ARB locker. I know it would be dumb not to do it while you are re-gearing anyway. I should do the rear, I just have a little bit of a sticker shock on the compressor and locker, but I doubt anyone regrets it in the end.

I will check out U-Joints. I called another shop and the owner said in the conversation that they work on a lot of fords and chevies, and they don't know toyotas well. That isn't a huge vote of confidence.

 

[alia176]

Tee hee hee , that's right, can't ever have enough shade in the desert.

Regarding the ARB, it's stupid expensive so just get the locker for now if you can swing it. If you can't, it can be installed after the fact. Worry about the air line stuff later, that can be done anytime.

 

[evanz80]

@evanz80: The roof rack is a Front Runner slimline II. I ordered it new from Slee. I considered putting together a rack from an ATV ramp (found a thread on mud about that), and also considered a baja rack (there is a 3/4 length one for around $600). I saw a front runner rack in person, and decided it was worth the price. It is very light, and all of their add-ons seem well designed. I also like that it is flat, but still has the option to add rails on the sides. I picked up a double jerry can holder, a shovel mount, and some eyelets to help with tying stuff down. I plan on mounting a 2 meter ARB awning in the near future, and possibly getting a tire mount so I have the option of putting the spare up there if I need to.

Thanks for the info on the rack - I will check it out on Christo's website. Just a thought about putting your tire up there on the rack too - it would get it out of the way, but be careful about putting too much weight up high - it can play hell with your center of gravity when on off-camber trails (no tip-overs, please!). Especially with the 16x8 steel wheels. I've got the same wheel, but with 35's, and those get to be a very heavy combination.

 

[alia176]

Thanks for the info on the rack - I will check it out on Christo's website. Just a thought about putting your tire up there on the rack too - it would get it out of the way, but be careful about putting too much weight up high - it can play hell with your center of gravity when on off-camber trails (no tip-overs, please!). Especially with the 16x8 steel wheels. I've got the same wheel, but with 35's, and those get to be a very heavy combination.

Speaking of storing the wheel on the roof rack, this one time in band camp, I was lowering the wheel and it got away from me. On its way down it broke the side view mirror. This was one a Land Rover so it doesn't count. It was gonna fall off anyway.....

 

[Zdeech]

Good points on the tire roof storage. That tire and wheel combo is over 100lbs. I hadn't really visualized getting it up there either, that could be an olympic event (or at least funny to watch).

 

[alia176]

Good points on the tire roof storage. That tire and wheel combo is over 100lbs. I hadn't really visualized getting it up there either, that could be an olympic event (or at least funny to watch).

I don't about your 80, but on my previous '97, I was able to easily stuff a 33" under the cargo area and tucked it up. There is a way to raise the spare tire cross member higher by about 2" or so. It's worth while to do that if you want to protect the spare from getting dragged a whole bunch.

 

[evanz80]

Or spend big bucks on a rear bumper with a spare tire carrier...

 

[Zdeech]

Or spend big bucks on a rear bumper with a spare tire carrier...

Oh man, totally tempting. I had a trip planned to the Denver area in June, and I drove the cruiser up there and had Slee Offroad install my lift. I saw their rear bumper with tire swing out and jerry can rack on an employee's 100 series. I went back in and asked if they had any in-stock, and they were back ordered for a several weeks (which was good for my wallet!!). I decided to think on it. I might do that down the road, but those things are spendy. That would be cool to learn how to weld and get the 4x4 labs kit too. I have to wait a bit though.

I don't about your 80, but on my previous '97, I was able to easily stuff a 33" under the cargo area and tucked it up. There is a way to raise the spare tire cross member higher by about 2" or so. It's worth while to do that if you want to protect the spare from getting dragged a whole bunch.

Actually, the tire does fit under there pretty well. After I jumped up to the 285's, I was concerned about how low it hung down, especially in the front. I found the DIY method, and then decided to order the tire leveling kit from Wit's End.
80 Series Tire Leveling Kit
I installed it, and it helped a lot. On my rig, it raised the front of the spare tire 4 inches, and the rear .5 inches.

 

[sl33p3]

Oh man, totally tempting. I had a trip planned to the Denver area in June, and I drove the cruiser up there and had Slee Offroad install my lift. I saw their rear bumper with tire swing out and jerry can rack on an employee's 100 series. I went back in and asked if they had any in-stock, and they were back ordered for a several weeks (which was good for my wallet!!). I decided to think on it. I might do that down the road, but those things are spendy. That would be cool to learn how to weld and get the 4x4 labs kit too. I have to wait a bit though.


Actually, the tire does fit under there pretty well. After I jumped up to the 285's, I was concerned about how low it hung down, especially in the front. I found the DIY method, and then decided to order the tire leveling kit from Wit's End.
80 Series Tire Leveling Kit
I installed it, and it helped a lot. On my rig, it raised the front of the spare tire 4 inches, and the rear .5 inches.

Nice, sounds like you are on the right track! I built Luke's bumper from kit on my old 80. It was way fun!

 

[slimbuddha]

The other thought is to keep an eye out for a used bumper.