New LX-470 Fiasco - Need To Vent

[greynolds]

Depending on greynolds stamina, this could be an interesting outcome. It very well could be a "David and Goliath" showdown, or merely watching the Lions as they have their way with him in the arena.

Considering what cary just said above, I'm not sure the Lemon Law will help in this case---it's a third party issue and NOT a dealer installed OEM option that was tested and validated by the manufacturer. Big problem!

If you were a gambling man, who would you bet on at this point ?

If I were a gambling man (and I'm not), I would bet on myself at this point. The vehicle is far too expensive for me to simply walk away and pretend there's nothing wrong. The air bags are a pretty critical safety feature and given that there's a possibility they could deploy when they shouldn't, I'm not going to just ignore that blinking light (or disconnect it).

Thanks for the vote of confidence .

 

[SWUtah]

Depending on greynolds stamina, this could be an interesting outcome. It very well could be a "David and Goliath" showdown, or merely watching the Lions as they have their way with him in the arena.

Considering what cary just said above, I'm not sure the Lemon Law will help in this case---it's a third party issue and NOT a dealer installed OEM option that was tested and validated by the manufacturer. Big problem!

If you were a gambling man, who would you bet on at this point ?

The dealer is liable, he contracted with the dealer for the work. The dealer hired the third party. It's not "David and Goliath" the dealer doesn't want a BBB complaint and a law suit over replacing a new vehicle with another new vehicle. They will fold like a deck of cards as soon as his Lawyer contacts them. Not worth the hassle and impact on the dealers name. It could be a fight if it was a Ford or Chevy but not a Lexus dealer.

 

[jp213a]

Well, unfortunately things seem to be taking a turn for the worse.

I got a call from the general manager around 6PM tonight. [cut ] The conversation ended with him saying he has to talk to his superiors (I guess that would be the owner of the dealership?) and get back to me in a day or 2.

From Greynolds' Post 117 of 2-8-06

Greynolds: The general manager at your local dealership is a low level pawn. He can probably approve up to $1,000 or maybe $2,500 on his own. He has already told you he must get approval from his superiors to resolve your issue. We've established that Lexus of Danvers is owned by a huge $1.5 billion corporation (Group 1 Automotive, Inc.) so I'm sure approval will need to come from way up the chain of command. IMO, you are wasting time waiting until Wednesday for the GM to return before making your next move. Try contacting David S. Rosenberg, Northeast Region VP for Group 1 at 713-647-5700.

 

[SWUtah]

From Greynolds' Post 117 of 2-8-06

Greynolds: The general manager at your local dealership is a low level pawn. He can probably approve up to $1,000 or maybe $2,500 on his own. He has already told you he must get approval from his superiors to resolve your issue. We've established that Lexus of Danvers is owned by a huge $1.5 billion corporation (Group 1 Automotive, Inc.) so I'm sure approval will need to come from way up the chain of command. IMO, you are wasting time waiting until Wednesday for the GM to return before making your next move. Try contacting David S. Rosenberg, Northeast Region VP for Group 1 at 713-647-5700.

Now that is what I call the first real help that Greynolds has gotten on this thread!!!

 

[greynolds]

From Greynolds' Post 117 of 2-8-06

Greynolds: The general manager at your local dealership is a low level pawn. He can probably approve up to $1,000 or maybe $2,500 on his own. He has already told you he must get approval from his superiors to resolve your issue. We've established that Lexus of Danvers is owned by a huge $1.5 billion corporation (Group 1 Automotive, Inc.) so I'm sure approval will need to come from way up the chain of command. IMO, you are wasting time waiting until Wednesday for the GM to return before making your next move. Try contacting David S. Rosenberg, Northeast Region VP for Group 1 at 713-647-5700.

I know he can approve at least a little bit more than $2500, but your point is certainly taken .

I'll try calling David tomorrow.

Thanks for the info - I found the Group 1 web site, but out of curiosity, how'd you find the phone # - I couldn't find it on their site?

 

[jp213a]

I'll try calling David tomorrow.

Thanks for the info - I found the Group 1 web site, but out of curiosity, how'd you find the phone # - I couldn't find it on their site?

Here's the web site where I found David Rosenberg. http://www.group1auto.com/Platform_Presidents/pp_dr.htm

The phone number is the general number for Group 1 headquarters in Houston. From there, you are on your own. If you don't get through to him, hopefully you can get his direct number or at least sent to his voice mail or administrative assistant. Or try asking for his e-mail address. Good luck!

Are you making any progress with Lexus USA?

 

[tech_dog]

From Greynolds' Post 117 of 2-8-06

Greynolds: The general manager at your local dealership is a low level pawn. He can probably approve up to $1,000 or maybe $2,500 on his own. He has already told you he must get approval from his superiors to resolve your issue. We've established that Lexus of Danvers is owned by a huge $1.5 billion corporation (Group 1 Automotive, Inc.) so I'm sure approval will need to come from way up the chain of command. IMO, you are wasting time waiting until Wednesday for the GM to return before making your next move. Try contacting David S. Rosenberg, Northeast Region VP for Group 1 at 713-647-5700.

I love the overwhelming force technique. Send a letter to group 1, to Lexus, to the BBB, to the state consumer agencies dealing with automobiles. Send copies of every letter to the dealer, to lexus, and to group 1. Put up a web page that has your story and links to this thread. Send the links to the dealer, to lexus, and to group 1....

Reselling the car as used will probably cost them $5K plus the damage they've done. I'd imagine the negative opinions created by this thread has already cost lexus more than that.

 

[jjbodean1970]

Reselling the car as used will probably cost them $5K plus the damage they've done. I'd imagine the negative opinions created by this thread has already cost lexus more than that.

maybe that dealer, but not lexus in general. i dont feel that this is a lexus issue, imho. sounds like the guidepoint dealer screwed this one up, not lexus the manufacturer, and the dealer has mishandled the situation

 

[G-Cat]

maybe that dealer, but not lexus in general. i dont feel that this is a lexus issue, imho. sounds like the guidepoint dealer screwed this one up, not lexus the manufacturer, and the dealer has mishandled the situation

The last time I ate at a Cracker Barrel, the food was the worst I've ever had. I sent it back with one bite removed, and told the waiter it was aweful and I couldn't eat it. He appologized and then brought me my bill...for the full amount. I had no time to talk to his manager or the like...but I will never ever eat at a Cracker Barrel again...ever.

I probably will never be able to afford a brand new Lexus...but this thread has made me feel okay about that.

I had always thought that the BIG difference between Toyota and Lexus was service and customer satisfaction...I think I'll take my chances with Toyota proper.

 

[SINCITY100]

I love the overwhelming force technique. Send a letter to group 1, to Lexus, to the BBB, to the state consumer agencies dealing with automobiles. Send copies of every letter to the dealer, to lexus, and to group 1. Put up a web page that has your story and links to this thread. Send the links to the dealer, to lexus, and to group 1....

Reselling the car as used will probably cost them $5K plus the damage they've done. I'd imagine the negative opinions created by this thread has already cost lexus more than that.

Or..Give us a link to a specific customer service E-mail address for Lexus, and let EVERY IH8MUD member who has read this thread give their "opinion" of the way you have been treated and our feelings towards LEXUS USA at this point.. I would gladly send an Email with my name and address etc...to help your cause

We just want your dealer to do what is right, not give the damn store away.. its not about freebies or money...its about principle AND a manufacturer`s ability to back their product, especially at the dealer level ..

ARE YOU WITH ME GUYS ? !!

 

[greynolds]

Or..Give us a link to a specific customer service E-mail address for Lexus, and let EVERY IH8MUD member who has read this thread give their "opinion" of the way you have been treated and our feelings towards LEXUS USA at this point.. I would gladly send an Email with my name and address etc...to help your cause

We just want your dealer to do what is right, not give the damn store away.. its not about freebies or money...its about principle AND a manufacturer`s ability to back their product, especially at the dealer level ..

ARE YOU WITH ME GUYS ? !!

Unfortunately, all one gets when opening a case in email is the generic Customer_Satisfaction_Inquiries@lexus.com address and a case number (which I'm somewhat hesitant to share). If anyone would like to send an email to that address, PLEASE keep things civil, and feel free to mention my name (Geoff Reynolds) as they should be able to correlate that to my case. It's for a Silver 2006 LX-470 purchased from Ira Lexus in Danvers, MA.

I've been getting some replies from a Vaughn Wendelstadt, but they're of the generic:

Thank you for contacting Lexus Customer Satisfaction. We are dedicated to providing superior service.

I apologize for not stating your issue better. I am working with Ira Lexus to resolve your issues with the dealership and will contact you as soon as I have more information available. I am sorry for an inconvenience this may have caused.

If you require further assistance, please respond to this e-mail, or contact Lexus Customer Satisfaction at 1-800-255-3987, Monday through Friday, 5:00 a.m. to 6:00 p.m., or Saturday, 7:00 a.m. to 4:00 p.m., Pacific Standard Time.

That reply was received on 2/10/2006, but there has been no indication that Ira Lexus has been contacted and still no resolution of the problem. It feels like customer "service" is dragging their feet, but it is nice to know that they're "dedicated to providing superior service" .

I received 1 additional reply from Mr. Wendelstadt yesterday as a reply to a message I sent over the weekend (after dropping the truck off yet again) where I mentioned that the Lemon Law would seem like it may apply at this point telling me I would need to send a letter to Lexus.

This morning, I called the telephone number provided in their email reply and spoke with someone who said she'd have to refer it to the person working on my case and I should hear something within 48 hours. Given that I initially contacted them on 2/9, I'm not exactly holding my breath for something to actually happen within those 48 hours.

 

[greynolds]

maybe that dealer, but not lexus in general. i dont feel that this is a lexus issue, imho. sounds like the guidepoint dealer screwed this one up, not lexus the manufacturer, and the dealer has mishandled the situation

As the manufacturer, Lexus should have some amount of pressure they can put on the dealer to get the problem resolved and make the customer happy. Whether the problem is the fault of Lexus or not, the situation still makes their customer service look far less than stellar.

 

[jjbodean1970]

The last time I ate at a Cracker Barrel, the food was the worst I've ever had. I sent it back with one bite removed, and told the waiter it was aweful and I couldn't eat it. He appologized and then brought me my bill...for the full amount. I had no time to talk to his manager or the like...but I will never ever eat at a Cracker Barrel again...ever.

i would try a different cracker barrel. different cooks, different wait staff, different managers.

i would also not go to ira lexus, and would not have the guidepoint fawks touch my car. but not buy another lexus? no, i think that is a harsh knee-jerk reaction. just my $.02

 

[greynolds]

From Greynolds' Post 117 of 2-8-06

Greynolds: The general manager at your local dealership is a low level pawn. He can probably approve up to $1,000 or maybe $2,500 on his own. He has already told you he must get approval from his superiors to resolve your issue. We've established that Lexus of Danvers is owned by a huge $1.5 billion corporation (Group 1 Automotive, Inc.) so I'm sure approval will need to come from way up the chain of command. IMO, you are wasting time waiting until Wednesday for the GM to return before making your next move. Try contacting David S. Rosenberg, Northeast Region VP for Group 1 at 713-647-5700.

I called the number this morning around 8:30AM EST. The only number they would give me for David Rosenberg was the number for Ira Lexus, which obviously won't get me anywhere. The receptionist said I might actually be better off speaking with someone at the corporate level, namely Gloria Cabalero (sp?) and told me to call back around 8:30-9 their time. I did and was transfered to Gloria's voice mail - with some luck she might actually call me back.

 

[greynolds]

I called the number this morning around 8:30AM EST. The only number they would give me for David Rosenberg was the number for Ira Lexus, which obviously won't get me anywhere. The receptionist said I might actually be better off speaking with someone at the corporate level, namely Gloria Cabalero (sp?) and told me to call back around 8:30-9 their time. I did and was transfered to Gloria's voice mail - with some luck she might actually call me back.

To her credit, Gloria called me back a little while ago. However, she didn't seem to have much support to offer and said that they tend to stand behind the decision the General Manager of the dealership makes. How's that for customer satisfaction? She did say she would look into things and get back to me in a day or 2.

 

[sleeoffroad]

I think you don't have to wait any longer. This is where you start the "who's your boss" then "who's your boss" questions until you reach someone that can make a decision. You have to start jumping the ladder to get to the top. Don't get bogged down in the bottom.

Also, you might want to call the local Dealer Licensing Baord in your area and see what they can do. In Colorado they are very comsumer oriented and they actually protect the consumer against dealer issues. Last thing the dealer wants is to get an inspection/enquiry from the licensing board. No need to treaten, just tell them your story and ask them what your options are. They know what a dealer and can can't do etc etc.

 

[jmarlo]

At this point they are really jerking you around. You really need to send the "Final Demand for Repair" letter to the dealer and the mfg. There is NO downside to sending this now. The dealer can and should continue to work on your car. But at least you have created your record. Although not necessary, send it by fax and certified mail to both, return receipt requested. Include in this letter that you sincerely hope that this matter can be resolved before you are forced to retain an attorney (they hate this because most state's lemon laws allow you to recover your attorney fees). You should also request their written response within 10 days. This is not unreasonable.

As mentioned before, if you do not receive what you perceive as full satisfaction within a reasonable amount of time (10--15 days), notify the mfg that you request to to participate in their pre lemon law arbitration/mediation program (if they have one--check your warranty).

Document everything in a written log that you keep, and confirm in writing every telephone conversation with the dealer, with a cc to the mfg.

The mfg and the dealer are certainly capable of resolving this issue within a short timeframe. Any other excuse by them is gamesmanship, with the hope that you will go away.

Good luck!

 

[sleeoffroad]

http://www.ago.state.ma.us/sp.cfm?pageid=1176

Some info

 

[Da Hapa]

I had always thought that the BIG difference between Toyota and Lexus was service and customer satisfaction...I think I'll take my chances with Toyota proper.

Garth -

The problem that you're missing is that dealerships are individual franhises. One shouldn't confuse this terrible experience that Geoff is having to endure as being indicative of the typical Lexus experience. I can absolutely see where Geoff would have such a bad taste from his individual experience with this s***ty dealership that he doesn't buy another Lexus (although that would be a shame IMO because we've bought 7 new Lexus vehicles since the brand was introdcued and we've got nothing but great things to say) but I think its a mistake to throw this one dealership's blanket of crap over the entire brand.

Hang in there Geoff.

 

[greynolds]

Garth -

The problem that you're missing is that dealerships are individual franhises. One shouldn't confuse this terrible experience that Geoff is having to endure as being indicative of the typical Lexus experience. I can absolutely see where Geoff would have such a bad taste from his individual experience with this ****ty dealership that he doesn't buy another Lexus (although that would be a shame IMO because we've bought 7 new Lexus vehicles since the brand was introdcued and we've got nothing but great things to say) but I think its a mistake to throw this one dealership's blanket of crap over the entire brand.

Hang in there Geoff.

I'm not soured on Lexus as a brand ... yet. But I am finding their customer service at the corporate level to be somewhat lacking so far - I expected a more proactive response in getting the dealer to resolve the problem, but they seem to have been dragging their feet just as much as the dealer so far.

One of the people following this thread sent me a PM with a contact number a little while ago. I called the number and spoke with someone who seemed to actually care about the problem. Not sure if anything will come of it, but it felt like a step in the right direction.