Moving firewall brace 1965

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DomSmith

DomSmith

Joined
Nov 16, 2004
Threads
299
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3,761
Location
Oceanside, CA (Fire Mountain)
I've read a few threads on moving the firewall brace over on early rigs to accommodate a booster for disc brakes and was hoping somebody that has done it can chime in. I've got a 65 FJ45 and I'm adding discs. I have a geo metro booster and can make the appropriate spacer but am interested in mounting an FJ60 or similar booster long term. It looks like there's just one weld near the top of the brace? Cut that away, a few notches and bends and a re-weld would do the trick? Anyone done this?

I'm not interested in fabbing a newer firewall in.

Thanks.
image.webp
 
The weld on top is easier to get to than the spot welds on the flange going down the firewall. I had planned installing a brake booster in my 68 years ago. Instead of cutting and bend the brace I sourced a later brace to replace the earlier straight one. Before that happened I went on a cruiser buying frenzy. Never did change it on my 68 but decided just replace the whole cowl. If were to just do the brace I would still go the full replacement then just bend the original one. I will admit with the engine installed the welds towards bottom would be tricky drilling out.
 
Dom, I have a plasma cutter and can zip whatever you need out pretty easily.

Plus I still owe you $20 for the bezel if you still have it....
 
I ended up cutting mine. I decided it served no purpose once I realized on my year the pedal buck is welded to the other side of the firewall. There is no what they firewall will budge around where the booster goes with the bucket on the other side. The bigger problem was going from 3 bolt holes to the 4 bolt of the geo metro booster. Sounds simple to drill 4 holes, till one of them hit the steel for the pedal bucket. If I had a plasma cutter I would have been good, but I did not.
 
pedal ratio is different as well.. Tried the spacer and stock booster / 3 speed pedals.. never got it dialed in. If one were to try and save time and retain the firewall, i'd be very inclined to utilize the correct pedals. they align the booster and clutch master. Hardest part then will be cutting the welded pedal bucket out. I think it took about 8 spot welds under the windshield frame.
 
tornadoalleycruiser said:
pedal ratio is different as well.. Tried the spacer and stock booster / 3 speed pedals.. never got it dialed in. If one were to try and save time and retain the firewall, i'd be very inclined to utilize the correct pedals. they align the booster and clutch master. Hardest part then will be cutting the welded pedal bucket out. I think it took about 8 spot welds under the windshield frame.
Click to expand...

Are you saying installing a later pedal bucket would be the best way to solve the pedal issue? I believe LCWizard posted a while ago it was in 69 when the bucket started being bolted in. The whole cowl replacement solves a lot of problems except in the US starting with the 68 model the ribs in the dash were gone replaced by dash pads top and bottom.
 
My 1962 welded in petal bucket seems to work really well with the geo master brake booster. Other then the one bolt hitting the support on the bucket side and having to cut the support some to get the nut on, brakes work really well with 77 disc axles up front and 77 drums in the back. Have not hooked up the booster, but few trips to test around the block brakes work real well. Adding the vacuum to the booster will only make it better. In the fj45 section I think where I saw the use of the geo metro booster, I do think those were also early 60's fj45 and had very good success with the geo metro booster master setup.
 
Dom,
Don't know if you have seen Kotekaman's build thread in the 45 section but he did exactly what you are describing. Besides cutting that top weld you will have to get those spot welds down the support too.

Here are some pics I stole from Kotekman's build thread
fj45firewallbrace.webp
fj45firewallbrace-2.webp
 
"Are you saying installing a later pedal bucket would be the best way to solve the pedal issue? I believe LCWizard posted a while ago it was in 69 when the bucket started being bolted in. The whole cowl replacement solves a lot of problems except in the US starting with the 68 model the ribs in the dash were gone replaced by dash pads top and bottom.
"

I am saying to install a later pedal bucket.. Will be the easiest thing.. aligns the booster, pedal ratio is correct and actually "bolts" in after you get the old pedals out.. also aligns the clutch master..
i've see where people just remove the rib and try and bolt a booster to the firewall..
you can probably follow my thread and see the holes in the part under the windshield frame where the old pedals are spot welded in place. I replaced the whole firewall.. Just cause i had one.. Dunno when pedal buckets were just bolted in place.. but that would indeed be much easier than drilling spot welds..
 
Been following this with interest, and a few questions for the experts:

If saving the original firewall and not patching-in a later firewall section, and if the welded earlier pedal bucket provides strength to the firewall and cowl structure, would replacing the bucket on the original firewall with a later bolted-in bucket accomplish the same purpose?

For anyone who has done the bucket switch, can the early firewall holes for the brake and clutch masters line up with the later bolt-style bucket if it is bolted carefully, or is the later clutch hole further offset towards the outside fender and need redrilling?

In a similar light, if replacing an earlier F engine with a later 2F engine, does the bolt-in bucket allow for brake booster and brake master clearances away from the later carb and manifolds? And allow clearance for a variety of Toyota or other boosters to be used, whether single or double diaphram, larger diameters, etc.?

It appears that the top weld and several of the spot welds along the upper section of the older firewall brace need drilled-out, the brace bent at a 45 degree angle, and then rewelded to the firewall to allow space for the booster and the new clutch master?

Is there a thread with any of these issues already covered as a good reference?
 
:)Good Thread - I have a 1966 FJ 40 with the flange and I have been grinding away in my mind what to do about it when I get to putting in a Power booster. I wasn't sure if there was a gap behind the flange or just what it did except get in the way. I was thinking about cutting it off and welding in a 2" flat piece to maintain strength.

Then I read here where - (it sounds like this) just cut it out of the way and use a later pedal mount.

So with that in mind I have a 1976 donor FJ 55 that I was going to try and use the booster/master cyl for the 66. Am I correct in thinking that I can just use the FJ55 (1976) pedal assembly along with the booster/master cyl and probably the clutch master/slave fairly easily????

And just cut out the flange not messing with the 2" strap patch?????

Thanks - LBM :bounce::bounce2::D
 
Fj55 pedal assembly? I have no idea if its the same. Lots of parts interchange but that one I do not know
 
"
can the early firewall holes for the brake and clutch masters line up with the later bolt-style bucket if it is bolted carefully, or is the later clutch hole further offset towards the outside fender and need redrilling?
In a similar light, if replacing an earlier F engine with a later 2F engine, does the bolt-in bucket allow for brake booster and brake master clearances away from the later carb and manifolds? And allow clearance for a variety of Toyota or other boosters to be used, whether single or double diaphram, larger diameters, etc.?
"

Uh.. the reason you swap stuff is so you get different holes.. so no they are not the same! the OLD OLD ones were welded in so didn't really bolt in as easily..
and they were designed for the newer motors so yes they will clear within reason.. .. Example. i have a 3fe in my 1964 and it fits.. when using a spacer you run into more problems and interference with the carb. YMMV..
 
Lots of good questions. I've reached out to a few members I've found that have either cut down the brace or moved it.

Clemson- I saw that thread and it got me thinking about moving instead of just spacing a booster out. I got some info from John at Proffitts. I'm thinking I may just try to tackle that with some help from a few buddies and some liquid courage.

Bear- I have a lot of those same questions. If I move it far enough and build a thin adapter from 3 hole to 4 hole will it clear later if I put in a 3FE? I'm growing tired of the F135 and if I HAD to drive it more I'd prioritize that. I wish I could do a newer motor and keep the column shift. :bang:


This option from akeyzoo isn't bad either...
MetroBooster004.webp




Just need to decide if I want to 1. cut it down or 2. move it over or 3. leave it alone and space it. Almost certain option 3 would have to be redone if I added a 2F or 3FE....


Thanks for the good discussions....
 
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