Mods: Can “more” ever be less-is-more too?
- Thread starter Markuson
- Start date
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It's tempting for sure. At the going market rate I am seeing around here and ebay, it doesn't make any sense to buy a clean 97 LX or 40th edition w/low miles. Even restoring one with new motor is still spendy. I do like the idea of putting an LS motor on it but again when all said and done professionally I am already exceeding the price of a used 200 or getting a 4-dr Rubicon.Or perhaps a fully built 80 series with a 4.7 V8 and keep it in the Toyota Family
Perhaps a bit of a tangent but I think the build level often reflect the personality of the owner and that is ever more evident than the gear that comes along and the level of camp comfort and accoutrements one needs to go out for the day or the month. Along with that, some personalities prefer to build, spend, build, sell, repeat. I.e. they love working on and/or having their vehicle worked on and outfitted more than the actual action of use.
On the other hand there are the build, use, spend, build, use, spend, repeat crowd. They drive stock Land Cruisers for years while enjoying trips all over. They go to Baja with a ground tent and a Coleman stove. They loathe the build and lust for the use, and their build and pack reflects it. There isn't a right or wrong or better and if you need xyz wigit to make you feel comfortable leaving home, so be it so long as you aren't using those items as invisible roadblocks to leaving home. I've heard so many times things like "once I have a fridge I'll go camping for a weekend", etc. As my good pal @dmc likes to say, "eff that, just go do it". Of course a few years back he quit his job, sold his house and left in his 80 for Ushuaia on a whim too. He wasn't ready, he didn't have everything he wanted to have, but he went.
I find myself in both camps depending on the day. The engineer in me demands efficiency, function, technology and I subscribe to the buy-once crude-once, spend the money and buy the best, do it right the first time. On the other hand I generally hate working on my vehicles and prefer to be driving them on trails instead. I don't subscribe to the one-size-fits-all vehicle, i.e. The 200 is great for some trail duty, lame for others. The 40 Series is great for x, bad for y, etc. You get the point. I'm rambling at this pint
A couple older articles I wrote on similar subjects:
Official - Packing for a week on the trail - Overview
Official - Is a rooftop tent (RTT) for me?
Official - Will An Off-Road Trailer Work For Me? The Off-Road Trailer Conundrum
Official - 12V Freezer-Fridges - Do they bring the heat?
On the other hand there are the build, use, spend, build, use, spend, repeat crowd. They drive stock Land Cruisers for years while enjoying trips all over. They go to Baja with a ground tent and a Coleman stove. They loathe the build and lust for the use, and their build and pack reflects it. There isn't a right or wrong or better and if you need xyz wigit to make you feel comfortable leaving home, so be it so long as you aren't using those items as invisible roadblocks to leaving home. I've heard so many times things like "once I have a fridge I'll go camping for a weekend", etc. As my good pal @dmc likes to say, "eff that, just go do it". Of course a few years back he quit his job, sold his house and left in his 80 for Ushuaia on a whim too. He wasn't ready, he didn't have everything he wanted to have, but he went.
I find myself in both camps depending on the day. The engineer in me demands efficiency, function, technology and I subscribe to the buy-once crude-once, spend the money and buy the best, do it right the first time. On the other hand I generally hate working on my vehicles and prefer to be driving them on trails instead. I don't subscribe to the one-size-fits-all vehicle, i.e. The 200 is great for some trail duty, lame for others. The 40 Series is great for x, bad for y, etc. You get the point. I'm rambling at this pint
A couple older articles I wrote on similar subjects:
Official - Packing for a week on the trail - Overview
Official - Is a rooftop tent (RTT) for me?
Official - Will An Off-Road Trailer Work For Me? The Off-Road Trailer Conundrum
Official - 12V Freezer-Fridges - Do they bring the heat?
Markuson
SILVER Star
- Thread starter
- #24
Ya, as a long-time backpacker, it’s amazing how little you actually NEED.
Hiking through Papua New Guinea for several days where there is NOTHING but thick jungle...the two local tribesman we went with didn’t even carry water...and it was crazy hot/humid.
Came out of a cave at one point and one of those two had come out 15 minutes before us. When we found him, he had already cooked (sort of) a small bat and all that was left were the wings and the head. The rest he’d eaten. Then he washed it down with cave water that—instead of sand at the bottom—was basically bat guano.
It’s funny how things change as you age though. That thin little foam pad I slept on for two weeks in the Minerets Wilderness each Summer would feel like a rock now.
Hiking through Papua New Guinea for several days where there is NOTHING but thick jungle...the two local tribesman we went with didn’t even carry water...and it was crazy hot/humid.
Came out of a cave at one point and one of those two had come out 15 minutes before us. When we found him, he had already cooked (sort of) a small bat and all that was left were the wings and the head. The rest he’d eaten. Then he washed it down with cave water that—instead of sand at the bottom—was basically bat guano.
It’s funny how things change as you age though. That thin little foam pad I slept on for two weeks in the Minerets Wilderness each Summer would feel like a rock now.
A big part of my LC build was for family comfort. Running water and a quickly deployed kitchen with fridge were necessary for my wife. My pickup is a different story.
I've been through the mod - -wheel - mod - wheel cycle with a few vehicles before.
The most complete cycle I've made was ~20 years ago with a 1994 Jeep Grand Cherokee.
First: Small lift, 31" Tires, ARB/Winch, and Sliduers. Very useful, could wheel mild trails, camp, fish, take on kayaking trips, and still drive to work/school with no issues. With good trail selection I could have fun without breaking stuff. But I wanted more...
Second: Long Arms, More Lift, 33" Tires. Still somewhat useful, OK on the road. Drove across the country to Moab. Wheeled pretty hard. Broke rear axle shaft. Fixed, drove home. Started thinking about Axle swap and a daily driver...
Third: Axle Swap, Lockers, 36" Tires, less lift and more cutting. Not fun on the road anymore but doable. Got Honda Civic DD. Wheeled as hard as truck would go, and kept up with Buggys until I rolled it. Ugh.
Fourth: Chopped Top and Full Cage. Tow Rig. Wheeling is a production that requires a small arsenal of spare parts, tools, welder, and about 200 gallons of fuel in a weekend. Wheeled harder still until the rest of the truck started falling apart. Parted out/Scrapped the truck, and longingly wished for the simpler days of mild useful builds.
If you read all that, the moral of the story is that (for me) sometimes less can be more. Now as long as I can use my rig(s) to get outside and have fun with family and friends doing what I want to do, they're built enough. I think a piece of the fun of modding is the creativity and ingenuity behind it that draws many of us in. My 200 build in may ways reminds me of the "good old days" with the Jeep. Small lift, good tires, a winch for insurance and utility, now with the sense to know when to say when.
The most complete cycle I've made was ~20 years ago with a 1994 Jeep Grand Cherokee.
First: Small lift, 31" Tires, ARB/Winch, and Sliduers. Very useful, could wheel mild trails, camp, fish, take on kayaking trips, and still drive to work/school with no issues. With good trail selection I could have fun without breaking stuff. But I wanted more...
Second: Long Arms, More Lift, 33" Tires. Still somewhat useful, OK on the road. Drove across the country to Moab. Wheeled pretty hard. Broke rear axle shaft. Fixed, drove home. Started thinking about Axle swap and a daily driver...
Third: Axle Swap, Lockers, 36" Tires, less lift and more cutting. Not fun on the road anymore but doable. Got Honda Civic DD. Wheeled as hard as truck would go, and kept up with Buggys until I rolled it. Ugh.
Fourth: Chopped Top and Full Cage. Tow Rig. Wheeling is a production that requires a small arsenal of spare parts, tools, welder, and about 200 gallons of fuel in a weekend. Wheeled harder still until the rest of the truck started falling apart. Parted out/Scrapped the truck, and longingly wished for the simpler days of mild useful builds.
If you read all that, the moral of the story is that (for me) sometimes less can be more. Now as long as I can use my rig(s) to get outside and have fun with family and friends doing what I want to do, they're built enough. I think a piece of the fun of modding is the creativity and ingenuity behind it that draws many of us in. My 200 build in may ways reminds me of the "good old days" with the Jeep. Small lift, good tires, a winch for insurance and utility, now with the sense to know when to say when.
RET2
SILVER Star
As funny as it sounds this thread sounds like an AA meeting for LC owners, certainly no disrespect meant. We've all went thru he stages of mods and loads or will some day and the thing that comes up is there is not 1 perfect solution for everyone or trail. It's fun to plan and then execute and sometimes the juice isn't worth the squeeze. Been just as happy with a cup of noodles or cold fried chicken on the trail as I have been with a hundred dollar steak dinner. Just enjoy it while we can is my thought, life is relatively short.
Markuson
SILVER Star
- Thread starter
- #29
Yes!
Agree!
In Baja, that was me.
I packed in a huge hurry, and ended up throwing more in than I should have.
That’s actually inspired me to get organized.
What I’ve learned about my organizational skills (or lack of) is that...I need everything to have its own place that is easy to access. And like @TonyP said...nothing buried. That’s a driver for my weird Velcro install PITA. It allows me to easily assign a spot to smaller items that tend to float around the truck during long trips.
My latest mod binge has been mostly about use of wasted space & organization. To some who tend to carry less, it may seem silly. But when you do carry stuff for long trips, it sure is a stress reducer.
Hi from a lurker here on the 200 forum. I am planning on moving from my hundy to a 200 soon and have been asking my self the same question so here is my 2 cents.
Winch- only used it 3-4 times but if I hadn't had it in a couple of situations I would have had to spend a lot more than it cost to get towed out. Also use it at least 2-3 times a year to pull a tree or bush out of the ground- win for the winch.
Front bumper- besides looking good and arguably better front impact protection, I would only put one on if I couldn't mount a winch with a stock bumper.
Lift- while I don't do any rock crawling, I need it for the places we like to go in southern Utah.
Sliders- see above- I came down on a rock in
's X5 and it cost me $3k to fix- win for the sliders.
Rear bumper- While I really don't care about damaging the Tupperware, I do need 15 extra gallons to do a number of the trips we do in southern Utah, so unless I want to lift 5 gallon jerrycans onto the rack of my lifted truck with my 66 year old back, it's a win for the rear bumper with a jerry can rack. Might as well throw in the spare swingout while I'm at it.
Drawers- I loved them but is only 5'2" and can't reach anything in the back on top of the drawers so that settles that.
Fridge- absolutely- I have mine mounted in the area where the 40% rear seat is when we go out, leaving the 60% for the dog.
Underhood compressor- nice to have but I got by for years with a little cig lighter plugin compressor. Only put it in to run my airlockers.
Lockers- Naw- only have them because I blew my front coming out of Kane Creek Canyon.
RTT- Tried a Grand Raid XXL and loved sleeping in it. hated climbing up and down in the middle of the night, and after a while I hated the top heavy feeling while off camber.
Water heater- Love the idea, but leaving a blackened 5 gallon jerry can in the sun to warm up and using a sprayer pump to take a warm shower after hiking is good enough for me. Of course, weprincess don't' get out when it's cold to that's not a problem. When I go solo, showers are much less of an issue.
Highlift Jack- left mine at the end of the driveway for someone to take.
Armor- Can't justify the cost for the weight and lack of rock crawling we do.
Teardrop trailer- A neighbor and friend owns Escapod and I have tried one of his and loved it. Went into the Dollhouse in the Maze with a friend who has a Moby XTR and it did great. That's about as gnarly as I want to go so we are seriously looking at buying one to solve a lot of the issues mentioned above.
That's the breadth of my experience and my thoughts on my next build.
Cheers.
Winch- only used it 3-4 times but if I hadn't had it in a couple of situations I would have had to spend a lot more than it cost to get towed out. Also use it at least 2-3 times a year to pull a tree or bush out of the ground- win for the winch.
Front bumper- besides looking good and arguably better front impact protection, I would only put one on if I couldn't mount a winch with a stock bumper.
Lift- while I don't do any rock crawling, I need it for the places we like to go in southern Utah.
Sliders- see above- I came down on a rock in
's X5 and it cost me $3k to fix- win for the sliders.Rear bumper- While I really don't care about damaging the Tupperware, I do need 15 extra gallons to do a number of the trips we do in southern Utah, so unless I want to lift 5 gallon jerrycans onto the rack of my lifted truck with my 66 year old back, it's a win for the rear bumper with a jerry can rack. Might as well throw in the spare swingout while I'm at it.
Drawers- I loved them but
is only 5'2" and can't reach anything in the back on top of the drawers so that settles that.Fridge- absolutely- I have mine mounted in the area where the 40% rear seat is when we go out, leaving the 60% for the dog.
Underhood compressor- nice to have but I got by for years with a little cig lighter plugin compressor. Only put it in to run my airlockers.
Lockers- Naw- only have them because I blew my front coming out of Kane Creek Canyon.
RTT- Tried a Grand Raid XXL and loved sleeping in it.
hated climbing up and down in the middle of the night, and after a while I hated the top heavy feeling while off camber.Water heater- Love the idea, but leaving a blackened 5 gallon jerry can in the sun to warm up and using a sprayer pump to take a warm shower after hiking is good enough for me. Of course, we
princess don't' get out when it's cold to that's not a problem. When I go solo, showers are much less of an issue.Highlift Jack- left mine at the end of the driveway for someone to take.
Armor- Can't justify the cost for the weight and lack of rock crawling we do.
Teardrop trailer- A neighbor and friend owns Escapod and I have tried one of his and loved it. Went into the Dollhouse in the Maze with a friend who has a Moby XTR and it did great. That's about as gnarly as I want to go so we are seriously looking at buying one to solve a lot of the issues mentioned above.
That's the breadth of my experience and my thoughts on my next build.
Cheers.
No need for a bumper just to carry more gas, now that the long range fuel tank is available. Also, you can solve the reach problem for items on top of drawers with the sliding top option.
Markuson
SILVER Star
- Thread starter
- #32
Yes. For me, the LRA let me move 15 gallons of water outside...instead of taking up precious interior space. When you sleep in the back? That’s a huge win.
An LRA really done create a domino effect of benefits that go beyond just range. -Lower center of gravity... No spills... No time fumbling with cans... and new storage space frees up (if you previously carried cans).
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Markuson
SILVER Star
- Thread starter
- #35
So this afternoon, I started methodically asking myself if any of my mods were a mistake in hindsight.
I actually spent a good deal of time thinking through each one (there have been s lot...but over time, with much deliberateness).
When I finally walked through my looong list, I was somewhat amazed to realize that ALL of them left me with zero regret. None. Zilch.
Of course a couple items come to mind that I switched out here or there, but never for any reason other than necessity...or just by way of a particular item’s part-time necessity.
I never had loads of cash to throw at my truck. So when I saved for a mod, I took serious care in selection. Heck, I bought and sold about a ZILLION sets of wheels in order to finance other mods.
I still found it almost hard to believe that I had no regrets, and tried hard to make sure I wasn’t Just over-justifying...
So I rechecked my list.
And again—Wow.
-I seriously love my 11 year old 200, and it confirmed that my sometimes painfully slow...careful, step by step...bit by bit building over a number of years has really worked well.
I actually spent a good deal of time thinking through each one (there have been s lot...but over time, with much deliberateness).
When I finally walked through my looong list, I was somewhat amazed to realize that ALL of them left me with zero regret. None. Zilch.
Of course a couple items come to mind that I switched out here or there, but never for any reason other than necessity...or just by way of a particular item’s part-time necessity.
I never had loads of cash to throw at my truck. So when I saved for a mod, I took serious care in selection. Heck, I bought and sold about a ZILLION sets of wheels in order to finance other mods.
I still found it almost hard to believe that I had no regrets, and tried hard to make sure I wasn’t Just over-justifying...
So I rechecked my list.
And again—Wow.
-I seriously love my 11 year old 200, and it confirmed that my sometimes painfully slow...careful, step by step...bit by bit building over a number of years has really worked well.
Markuson
SILVER Star
- Thread starter
- #37
I should add that several mods did require later tweaking.
For example...
I returned the first large inverter I tried and replaced it with a GoPower.
Related—Recently I completely redid the massive gauge wires to the inverter, and it was a real success. Voltage drop is dramatically improved upon heavy draw.
But those are just tweaks.
Main mods have been great.
For example...
I returned the first large inverter I tried and replaced it with a GoPower.
Related—Recently I completely redid the massive gauge wires to the inverter, and it was a real success. Voltage drop is dramatically improved upon heavy draw.
But those are just tweaks.
Main mods have been great.
Reminds me of hiking Mt Batur on Bali, Indonesia in the dark to summit at sunrise. Wearing my Vasque boots, high tech clothes, back pack etc. The two guides in thin flip flops with food and equipment in little plastic bags. Still hopping up and down the mountain like goats while we wheezed our way to the top.
Ya, as a long-time backpacker, it’s amazing how little you actually NEED.
Hiking through Papua New Guinea for several days where there is NOTHING but thick jungle...the two local tribesman we went with didn’t even carry water...and it was crazy hot/humid.
Came out of a cave at one point and one of those two had come out 15 minutes before us. When we found him, he had already cooked (sort of) a small bat and all that was left were the wings and the head. The rest he’d eaten. Then he washed it down with cave water that—instead of sand at the bottom—was basically bat guano.
It’s funny how things change as you age though. That thin little foam pad I slept on for two weeks in the Minerets Wilderness each Summer would feel like a rock now.
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To help those of us who haven't gone *quite* as far down the mod rabbit hole learn from your experience, let me ask these two questions:
1) What 3 mods have been your biggest benefits (either absolute or bang-for-the-buck)?
2) Which 3 mods have been less beneficial than you imagined they would be?
Let's skip over what seems like the consensus #1 and #2 mods, rock sliders and larger tires.
(Feel free to include any context or peculiarities about your requirements or usage if helpful).
1) What 3 mods have been your biggest benefits (either absolute or bang-for-the-buck)?
2) Which 3 mods have been less beneficial than you imagined they would be?
Let's skip over what seems like the consensus #1 and #2 mods, rock sliders and larger tires.
(Feel free to include any context or peculiarities about your requirements or usage if helpful).
Markuson
SILVER Star
- Thread starter
- #40
Ya, it’s amazing the level of prowess locals can toughen up to with no equipment.
Speaking of...
Just ran across a photo of my Papua New Guinea story.
If you zoom in on this crummy, 25 year old scan of a 4x6 print...you can see a dark brown triangle thing on the ground. -That’s the wing of the bat he just ate... (the guy peeking from behind the boy).
I was dripping wet...and they weren’t even perspiring.
And ya...that would be me on the left...less that half my current age...!
You wear hats because it was spider season. Between nearly every tree in some parts, you walk through a massive spider web after whacking the spider in the middle with the flat side of your machete. The guy on the right was a “modern” tribesman. He could read a bit...and had a watch and a flashlight that looked like it was from the 1950’s...
Markuson at 23... getting shown up by jungle trucking locals with no food...no water.
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