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LC 105 underpowered and over-equipped

Discussion in 'Diesel Tech / 24 volts' started by Asiarider, Jan 25, 2004.

  1. Asiarider

    Asiarider

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    Look at Toyota in markets like Australia and Africa. For years they were producing excellent, strong and reliable offroad cars like the LC 70 and 80. Everybody was praising Toyota for their reliability and that you can repair them at almost any garage in the bush.

    Suddenly the world-markets change. New players are pushing in the offroad sector. Every reputable car manufacturer has suddenly a 4x4. Most of them equipped with all goodies you can think off. In the region of a Landcruiser 80 there are now Porsche, VW, Mercedes, BMW, SAAB, etc. to compete. How can you offer a car that cost $ 60K and above without the same electronic equipment as the competitors. Toyota had a problem :whoops:

    So they created the LC 100, the latest model. To compete with the other choices in the luxury 4x4 department it had to be a Mall Cruiser ::) So the engineers finally came up with a car that has almost all of the electronic stuff the competitors offer (okay, others are still better equpped, but ..) but they had to compromise the offroad capabilities. Otherwise it wouldn't run so smooth as a Mercedes or BMW and the handling would be too rough. Customers would have selected any other luxury 4x4 if Toyota would have offered less.

    But what about the old customers in markets like Australia and Africa. They don't want a Mall Cruiser. They depend on the reliability and capability of the cruiser. Toyota paniced and made a move. It created something like the LC 105 to hold the market share especially in the important Cruiser-market Australia. But what have they created:

    A LC 100, big-size, fully equipped with electronic up to the roof, heavy-weight champion and they place all this on a chassis of a 80 with a 4.5L engine. Sheesh, who had this idea ???

    We are all complaining already about the speed of our 80's. What about a LC 105 with our engine but much more weight. We are going back to the times of our beloved 4.0L engine. And do you think all the electronic stuff will be mastered by a garage in the bush? I have stayed for eight years in Africa and have seen LC 80's used for the rough areas only. Almost all electronic funny stuff, like electr. seats, sunroof, radio/CD, even the windows were not operating anymore. Not important, but the A/C was running. And the car was a great and reliable truck.

    Now look at a LC 105. I don't know about the grade of electronic equipment that remains but it will be for sure much more than in a LC 80. And the price is far too high for the bush. I think that the LC 105 was a rescue mission of TOY to save market shares. Nothing more and nothing less.

    It would have been much better to continue the 80 for some markets, maybe to boost the engine a bit and to sell them as bush-taxis.

    If the LC 105 would have a V8, solid axles, lockers and less funny stuff for a price close to a new 80 then I think it would be great.

    This is only my personal opinion and I know you will disagree but out of my experience in Africa I don't see the light for a LC 105.

    Mike

    (Sorry for the spelling. I am trying :D)
     
  2. Jonathan_Ferguson

    Jonathan_Ferguson ★ is in the wrong locale SILVER Star

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    I would'nt mind a Poverty Pack HZJ78/HZJ79/HZJ105 with High Country Pack, But they are so exspensive. Even If I could afford to buy, I would'nt as it's just plain rediculous to spend that much money on what is just a Car and won't increase in Value.

    I would'nt even buy the cheapest Landcruiser, Which is the Prado GX. - As it is also incredible exspensive.
     
  3. Jonathan_Ferguson

    Jonathan_Ferguson ★ is in the wrong locale SILVER Star

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    TOYOTA LANDCRUISER PRADO RZJ120R GX $39,230 (rrp*) * Prices shown are manufacturers' recommended retail prices only and do not include dealer delivery, on road costs or statutory charges and are subject to change without notice.

    Australian $39,230.00 = American $30,452.29
    Australian $39,230.00 = Thai Bahts 1,187,563.07
     
  4. Asiarider

    Asiarider

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    [quote author=Jonathan_Ferguson link=board=2;threadid=10593;start=msg95128#msg95128 date=1075034856]
    TOYOTA LANDCRUISER PRADO RZJ120R GX $39,230 (rrp*) * Prices shown are manufacturers' recommended retail prices only and do not include dealer delivery, on road costs or statutory charges and are subject to change without notice.

    Australian $39,230.00 = American $30,452.29
    Australian $39,230.00 = Thai Bahts 1,187,563.07
    [/quote]

    Let me shock you:

    Used 97 Prado in Thailand 1,250,000.00 Baht
    New 04 Prado in Thailand 3,500,000.00 Baht

    :'( :'( :'( :'(

    Mike
     
  5. Jonathan_Ferguson

    Jonathan_Ferguson ★ is in the wrong locale SILVER Star

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    The more accurate way is to have it as a Percentage of the Average Income. :doh:
     
  6. denis

    denis (O) toyota nut (O) SILVER Star

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    dude, the 100 came nearly 8 years ago, back when the only contender was the RR P38 and jeep "grand cherokee". Its actually toyota who kind of started the fashion, just like they did with the smaller models with the rav4...
     
  7. Asiarider

    Asiarider

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    [quote author=denis link=board=2;threadid=10593;start=msg95131#msg95131 date=1075035896]
    dude, the 100 came nearly 8 years ago, back when the only contender was the RR P38 and jeep "grand cherokee". Its actually toyota who kind of started the fashion, just like they did with the smaller models with the rav4...
    [/quote]

    You have to look overseas. There were quit a number of luxury 4x4 that Toyota had to keep up with. The G-Wagon from Mercedes, Range Rover, Land Rover, etc. Some had much better equipment as a LC 80 at that time. Toyota never created a fashion for the USA market. A Jeep Grand Cherokee was never a contender for any Cruiser.

    Mike
     
  8. Jonathan_Ferguson

    Jonathan_Ferguson ★ is in the wrong locale SILVER Star

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    The 78 Series has no Competitor in Australia.
    The 79 Series Compeititors are the Nissan Patrol Truck and the Landrover Defender 130.
    The 105 Series only Competitor is the Nissan Patrol Wagon.
     
  9. Pitbull

    Pitbull

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    I think the new Lexus GX470 is the right size (for me). About the size/weight of our FZJ80's and I like the V8 engine (but the price they want for them suck) I'll buy a New LC or LX before I would spend $50K for the GX470. Since I'm one of the owners that drives on the road 98% of the time the fact that they have an independant front suspension does not bother me. But I have to say that I would buy a "NEW" FZJ80 before I would buy any of the new 4x4's. Wish I had that choice in the future, but I doubt that I will.
     
  10. drexx

    drexx

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    26Jan2004 (UTC +8)

    Underpowered, the 1HZ**? I think you're spending too much time on the highways and trying to out-accelerate other cars. Get awn the bush, boy!

    I just purchased a new Hilux 4x4 (i.e. Tacoma for the 'Mericans) with a 3L (2.8L normally-aspirated diesel engine) and am currently re-discovering the joys of stock, open diff, manual tranny driving in the Philippine jungles. I have only recently realized that I have been spoiled rotten with my supercharged 1FZ-FE and regular 2UZ-FE engines there in USA.

    **The 1HZ is a 4.2L normally-aspirated engine that is way bigger than the humble 3L.
     
  11. Darwood

    Darwood

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    Drexx,

    I think your HiLux is actually more like the 95 toyota pickup than it is like a Tacoma. It just looks like a Tacoma. As far as I understand the HiLux has torsion bars, recirculating ball steering, and a boxed frame all the way. The Tacoma has coilover suspension, rack and peanut steering, and the frame is boxed from the front to the front rear spring hanger. IMHOP the HiLux is better for off road reliability than the Tacoma (that is assuming of course that Toyota has fixed idler arm issues.)

    Just being nit pickey :D
     
  12. drexx

    drexx

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  13. mustardfj40

    mustardfj40

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    Drexx,

    I looked at the wesite and see no land cruiser 100/105, how can you survive? Must be hard!

    /td
     
  14. drexx

    drexx

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    26Jan2004 (UTC +8)

    Hiya TD! Dude, we have lots of HDJ-100s in here... grey market but they sell more Cruisers than Toyota does (sometimes I question the sales strategies of Toyota planners)... just check out a sample of stuff for sale in http://www.autolink.ph But no HZJ-105 though... only 1HD-FTE with the H155F manual tranny ;)

    Currently, I have an open diff, 2.8L diesel Hilux 4x4 and it's a fun thing to have! Though come this July, I expect my 'Cruisers there in San Jose to be here with me in Metro Manila....
     
  15. tucker74

    tucker74 Moderator

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    Mike,

    I spent some time looking through the Toyota global site this weekend - and the only way you can get the solid axle 105 is w/ the diesel (no I6, no V8, no Turbo-diesel) in plain-jane form. I think you are right in it was designed to maintain the traditional work Cruiser - but it doesn't have most of the fancy gadgets you were talking about anyway. And for your other point - Toyota still does make the 80 series with the 4.5L and solid axles in South America, you can get it stripped down or with all the equipment of any of our american FZJ80's. In Peru they even sell it beside brand new 100 series....guess some people still like the 80 series.

    Tucker
     
  16. s79bj40

    s79bj40

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    we used to have the 1HZ GXL 105 in Gun metal grey, and it was awsome, it had to be one of my favourites, but it was sort of slow, not much of a change from the 80hp i have atm. It had a beautiful ride on the dirt, was great through creeks, and had all the mod cons, like elec windows and cd player. I think it looks way better than the 105 too - way better.
     
  17. FJ809496TLC

    FJ809496TLC 80 series addict GOLD Star

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    [quote author=drexx link=board=2;threadid=10593;start=msg95224#msg95224 date=1075055222]
    26Jan2004 (UTC +8)

    Underpowered, the 1HZ**? I think you're spending too much time on the highways and trying to out-accelerate other cars. Get awn the bush, boy!

    I just purchased a new Hilux 4x4 (i.e. Tacoma for the 'Mericans) with a 3L (2.8L normally-aspirated diesel engine) and am currently re-discovering the joys of stock, open diff, manual tranny driving in the Philippine jungles. I have only recently realized that I have been spoiled rotten with my supercharged 1FZ-FE and regular 2UZ-FE engines there in USA.

    **The 1HZ is a 4.2L normally-aspirated engine that is way bigger than the humble 3L.
    [/quote] Drexx, Are you wheeling in Northern Luzon? 5R still in existence? ???
     
  18. drexx

    drexx

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    [quote author=FJ809496TLC link=board=2;threadid=10593;start=msg95742#msg95742 date=1075171085]
    Drexx, Are you wheeling in Northern Luzon? 5R still in existence? ???
    [/quote]

    Yup! But I'm gonna go to Western Visayas next month --the trip there and the Hilux ride on the ferryboats will be interesting.

    As for the 5R, I don't know if 2.0L gas engine 1RZ-E is related? The latter engine model is in use for brand new vehicles. Just FYI, all workhorses here, vans and 4x4s alike, are diesel powered and many don't offer gas versions. Diesel is 39.36 cents (US) per liter.
     
  19. FJ809496TLC

    FJ809496TLC 80 series addict GOLD Star

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    Cool. I have never been to Visayan Island nor Mindanao. :-\ Maybe someday. I experienced riding on a ferry inside the cruiser from Victoria Island, Vancouver to Seattle, Wash.. Have a good time. :)
     
  20. bad_religion_au

    bad_religion_au

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    "The 78 Series has no Competitor in Australia."

    what about (in a round about way) poverty pack patrols,
    or in a direct compeditor market, the landrover 110 wagon (whatever they call em these days, 110 country or something i guess?)