I'm interested, the February trip was epic. If you have never traveled with Kevin you are in for a treat if you like friendly, helpful, knowledgeable loud snoring guys. Kevin had a plan/itinerary at all times but was also flexible about changes as long as it was safe and agreed by the group. Did I say loud snoring...
Seriously great trip!
Thanks for the kind words Scott you and Garret were great to have along!
For what it's worth, I have two friends who own property in Primo Tapia, just north of Cantamar. They live next to the dunes. One friend (a gringo) drives the toll road every day to work in Ensenada in a black H3 with American plates. These guys see Baja Norte on a daily basis and have a better feel for what is going on than us and I talk to them regularly. They both agree that there has been an escalation of commando type bloodshed mainly orchestrated by the drug lords and their henchmen against police and politicos. This is reminiscent of the Mafia of old in the U.S. where many of the poor actually support the drug lords because they fear them less than the corrupt police and because they provide a black market economy which provides a better standard of living than can be had by the average uneducated Mexican. This is a very deep socioeconomic problem that is not going to go away by hiring a few more police officers in Rosarito or Tijuana.
I agree with this above statement 110%
Yes there are break ins, robberies and murders but statistically no more, in fact less, than goes on here in So. Cal. Most of the violence is drug cartel against police or against fellow drug dealers. The attacks on tourists are random and few but make headlines because it happened to a tourist.
Again, agreed 110%
You old timers who remember the good old days in Baja keep in mind that we Americans are partially responsible for many of the problems there.
This is apparent especially during the races, i have very often seen piss drunk young american men being obnoxious, yelling obsenities @ mexican women, racial jokes @ mexican men, it happens A LOT and honestly i dont really blame the majority of the anger towards americans there. Rosarito is a huge college party spot because americans can drink @ 18, how many well behaved 18 year old college students you know. For folks that dont get out of their country much, for many of them, this is what they know of americans, sad, very sad.
Besides the drug war we bought up most of the coastal property when it became available to buy not lease, which raised the prices to there current levels. It's a free market but we have walled off and gated the communities blocking Mexicans from the beaches they have visited for generations and isolating ourselves from the locals and creating more envy and hostility.
Again, agreed 110%
I didn't show up in a shiny Ford F250 or Cadillac Escalade flashing my gear and showing disrespect for the locals. We'd lay low, smile big
and try to share with locals." T-shirts, leashes, old wet suits, etc." My dads old Playboys traded well for a lot of lobster from the fisherman.
Exactly and that has been the goal/mission of the majority of my trips down there. For those of you that were NOT able to join us in febuary, we had locals arrive in camp with horses, scotty rode them around, we gave them beer, they hung out @ camp with us for a bit and later on brought us firewood and hung out, THAT is what Baja is all about to me. Oh, also, when we got to the famous Mikes Sky Ranch, the kitchen was closed, but with a smile and a polite request they opened it up for us and catered to our every need! Awesome people!
Even though Baja has grown enormously in the last 10 years there is still so much poverty and inequality. Tourists have historically been an easy mark not just in Mexico but everywhere in the world.
Exactly my point! When i first graduated college i spent 1.5 months backing and exploring a lot of Asia completely solo and unsupported, i had quite a few attempts @ robberies (simple pick pockets) but the generousity of the locals and the smiles i brought to their faces, weighed out the bad by about 100:1. Plus the joy of snapping a pickpockets arm into 2 pieces was quite cool too! I had one guy that after i snapped his arm, the local police ran @ us with guns drawn, i will admit, i thought i was a dead man (lone gringo for 50 mile radius), but to my surprise the police protected me, beat the living wazoo out of the pick pocket right in front of me and smiled and went on their way! Good times i tell ya!
So be aware, but be friendly and courteous just the same. Paying a "La Mordida" bribe to a curious or greedy local cop should be considered standard operating procedure but sometimes a hello and an offer of a beer is all that is needed.
Damnit, i hate agreeing with people so often! Again, agreed 110%. I have driven through miltary checkpoints many many times in the hot heat, and EVERY SINGLE TIME they are looking in the back of the truck, i open the engel and offer then cold water, they take it EVERY SINGLE time, smile (sometimes shake hands) and way the rest of my convoy through. I have probably done this at least 1/2 dozen times! A smile, respect, and lack of attitude goes a long way in Baja!
The average bribe for a vehicle offense is less than $25 and most bribes for tourists are related to vehicle infractions. P.S. Gas is about $2.70 a gallon right now, not bad eh?
Exactly, i am thinking back on my overcrowded recent trip to Big Sur that cost me over $450 in gas to be camped out next to a bunch of RVs and retarded college students thinking i coulda done the whole baja pennisula for that much and spent every night on the beach!
For me personally, the rewards of traveling to Mexico and other countries abroad have always far out weighed the risks involved.
AMEN BROTHER!!!!
Long Answer: I have reduced the number of trips to Baja lately, but it has more to do with economics at home than problems in Mexico.
Same here, i keep bitching about gas prices, but also keep forgetting its still $2.50 down there!
I think Kevin's safety tips are reasonable and not too difficult to follow. . I have been avoiding TJ for years because the border there is such a royal PITA!
Yeah, tecate is much easier, less BS, MUCH MUCH less local beggers knocking on your window, etc....
Travel in third world countries is always sketchy and even 30 years ago I heard stories of trouble in Baja. The drug cartels have been active in Baja for as long as there have been drug cartels. But now the internet has allowed millions of people to share stories; many are true, but most are regurgitations of anecdotal drivel retold time and time again almost like fish tales - bigger and more dramatic with each telling.
Exactly the point i am trying to make with this whole thread!
Use good judgement, respect the people, respect the land and you will be rewarded.
AMEN DUDE!
Short Answer:b I'm still interested.
Look for a PM soon about a fall trip to Sea of Cortez for wheeling/fishing
Our Camp was robbed while we went to town for dinner. Our tents, sleeping bags and ice chest were all stolen. This was in a busy area with a lot of americans, but our own fault leaving the stuff we should have know better. Again this has never happended to me in the US.
Ok, looted is a better term, not robbed. Anyway, yes, your fault for leaving it unattended, sorry but true, this has happened to me 3x in the US and never in Baja, however, in Baja i never leave anything unattended, rule #2
These were bandits robbing us with knives and machetes, 4 of them jumped 2 of us on the beach and took what little money we had, some of our clothes and our watches.
I am confused, how were they robbing you with knives and machets while you were in town @ dinner?
To the best of my knowledge these wer the federalies, the 16 year olds, the ones in army fatiques holding M-16. They cost us about $40 for speeding which we did not believe we were, some sodas, snakes and a cigar which they asked for in an idirect manner, but it was clear what they wanted.
Yeah, i wont argue that, thas has happened to me, but usually i bargain with them with cold water and batteries (yes, flashlight batteries are like gold down there)
This was gas from the San Felipe Pemmex on the way out of town. I usually take a lot of extra gas but we went much further south than anticipated. I put about 22 gallons in my chevy truck and ended up having to service in El Centro, fuel filter flush and fuel injector cleaning. Ran great after flushing and new gas. About $500 total repair.
Bizarre, any chance someone put in diesal?
I often think the same thing, I moved away from PB after living there 10 years to buy a place and don't miss the punks, but do miss the water and location.
Yeah, nice place to visit, but........ FYI, i have spent more time in Baja then in PB and have found myself in much more trouble in PB. Had 2 different occasions where people picked fights with me while in the water surfing, i am a respectful "barney/kook" and make sure not to get in peoples way, these dudes went out of there way to mess with me.
Both occasions, i paddled in, got dressed, waited for said punk (mind you this is only months after moving here from Boston, so i will still the short tempered angry guy), confronted said punk, watched said punk apologize like a little bitch cause his boys werent around, dropped both said punks (1 swing, 1 drop) like bad habits, went on my merry way. I simply cant deal with the "Tude" in PB and think those are the tools giving americans in general a bad name when they got to baja surfing. Your not tough, you dont own the beach, your not a local cause you have surfed their for 2 years since moving here from Iowa, you dont deserve the be in the water anymore then the next guy! Get over it!
You are probably right here. After the bandits hit us we tried to to go to the police and they just acted as if no big deal and chuckled. I'm 6'6" 250lbs and my buddy id 6' 200 lbs so maybe they thought we should have taken them on. They were no help and didn't sem to care. The federalies did not say much about it when we talkied to them, but they did charge us for the speeding and the sodas etc. as mentioned above.
Honestly, i will state that the cops down there are 100% useless, but we havent had any real issues with them. Sorry for your incident though! A group of 4-5 trucks would of most likely prevented that
Yeah I think after going there since the early 80's we got used to the easy going nature of the people and good times. Things have changed down there or I think more about the consequeces as I get older. Most of my experience down ther has been good but 2 bad trips have turned me away. I have never had problems with camping in borrego or anywere in the sierra,s but have had stuff stolen in the Dunes at Glamis. This was when I still road san toys and was just out of high school.
Glamis is 500x worse then PB if ya ask me!
Anyway, great discussion guys, some great points being made!
may be tougher.
