Ideas for improving the 2LTE (6 Viewers)

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My advice.

Ditch the water/methanol or you'll crack your head and/or keep blowing head gaskets. It spikes combustion pressures too much.

Your low rpm power problem stems from the stock turbo being a prehistoric design. A more modern wastegated turbo (of the correct size) will spool sooner, deliver more low end boost and more top end power. I would also push boost higher (15psi) and fit an intercooler.

For your low RPM stalling problem. Check battery voltage when it's doing it. It's possible your alternator and battery can't keep voltage high enough at low rpm. One of my diesels is EFI and it always had a stumble problem after starting. A new battery cured it for a while. Then I found out (after owning it for 7 years) that the alternator charge cable didn't make clean contact with the fuse box. So while it registered normal charging voltage just idling it would drop volts as soon as any electrical load came on.
 
Thank you Dougal for the very prompt response. I did what you told me, while we were at it we checked all ground links too including the 2 underneath the car. We found 1 that was black and loose. Cleaned it up and retightened it, one thing is now fixed - my volt meter. It is now consistent unlike before where there would be times it would read 9plus. Im getting a good 12 plus now at full load stationary.

Will have to test the rig a couple more hours if it was also the culprit of the intermittent acceleration I stated above.

Regards,
Touie
 
Hi Nick!

Okay so to give a background of what I have done so far with my rig:

1.) EGR block off plates
2.) removed both butterfly plates
3.) 2.5 pipe with Borla exhaust
4.) Bumped up the boost to 12.5psi
5.) installed a snorkel
6.) turned spill valve about 1/3 of a turn
7.) installed devils own water/meth injection
8.) trying a new computer box(will explain this in my problem below)
9.) all the usual maintenance items like filters etc

NOTE: my 78 is a Japan export and I live in the Philippines so I do not know how good the wiring is since it is converted to LHD.

PROBLEM:
Any power coming from the rev range of 2000rpm onwards the power is spectacular. More than I need since I do not tow anything at all. It puts a smile on my face that I am able to ride on an incline at 60-70kph coming from a tiny bit of momentum.

My last challenge is, and its been going on for a year is the response from 800rpm(idle) up to 1900rpm, it sometimes is very slow to pick up. Especially on an incline, when i stop in the middle and try to drive again it kind of stalls on D. This is where the computer box from a friend came in - now it has greatly improved(power is more consistent in the low range) but still times where i lose power to stalling on an incline say I start from a complete stop.

Solutions I have picked up from here and he Surf group:
1.) change the spill valve to brand new(note that I do not know if this makes sense)
2.) have the whole car rewired(wont do this if we can trace the possible problem)
3.) check spray pattern of injectors???
4.) check the wire on top of the Injection pump(some guys say its so sensitive or may not be giving enough voltage - 12v)

Thanks so much Nick! Hope I didnt bomb your thread with a long message.

Regards,
Touie


Hi Touie, thanks for posting here. Nice work on your LJ78!

Generally these little motors have a lot of torque in the low rpm range (out of boost), especially when the throttle plates have been removed and the motor can get all the air it wants. Low rpm torque is good because they have a very conservative cam grind that flows very well at low rpms (perhaps Toyota did this to make up for the laggy turbo). I never run out of power in the low rpms. Dougal is right that the turbo does take a long time to spool on these motors (not only is the turbo an old design, but it is actually a bit big for the displacement of this motor), but I don't think that is the problem you are describing. Especially if it is a new problem that did not previously exist. I've never been able to stall my engine.

A few things come to mind:

The first item I would be wary of is the wiring work that was done to convert to LHD. Does your check engine diagnostic light work? You can jumper the T1 to E1 pins in the diagnostic connector in the engine bay and turn your key to the 'on' position. Look at the flashing pattern of the check engine light in the instrument cluster. Record the patterns and see if there are any sensors out of range. The hilux surf au website has a list of the patterns and what sensor they correspond to in their tech section.

Check all the wiring visually and repair any poor splicing or work that was done.

Is your transmission shifting right? Even with the shifter in 'D' position, the transmission should start off in 1st gear. If it does not, there is something wrong with the electronic control (done by the Engine computer). Again this could be a wiring problem.

Is the injection system limiting fuel off boost? When you are having this problem and you have the accelerator pedal all they way down, do you see any smoke? I know if I stomp on my accelerator in the low rpms with no boost, I will get some black smoke. Does this happen to you? Did you change the injection pump calibration resistors? This could reduce fueling and cause problems. Also, when you turned the spill control valve screw, did you turn it in, or out? Maybe you reduced the fueling? By the way, I would not recommend turning up the fueling until you have intercooled the motor (or at least have a pyrometer gauge)....you are pushing your luck. I turned down the fuel until I had an intercooler.

When you removed the throttle plates did you also remove the throttle position sensor? This needs to be adjusted very carefully with feeler gauges to get the right setting. If this is out, it can cause the problem you are describing, although it would be very consistent (not random).

Some of the other Denso pumps (mechanical) can have issues under certain circumstances when the vehicle is on an incline. So there is a remote chance that for some reason your fueling is being limited. Have you checked for fuel leaks or air getting into the system? When you pump the hand primer does it get stiff quickly? The top cover does start leaking on these injection pumps after time. I had to reseal my whole pump. Resealed my rotary injection pump

OK, a couple comments on the water/meth injection. I've been using it for a few years now with no problems. I've had my cylinder head off (carefully inspected top end), and also have replaced my big-end con rod bearings (carefully inspected bottom end) after running the meth injection for years. There were no indications what-so-ever that it was causing any damage to my engine. Big end bearings looked brand new (204,000kms) and no indication of being hammered by the meth (Did my BEB...). So if properly used, I don't think you should have any concern. Improperly used, Dougal's concerns of engine damage are valid, although I personally feel the piston ring lands will go long before the head or head gasket.

There are a few things that can go wrong with the meth/water:

The first problem which is most likely is cracking or shattering the piston ring lands. This will occur from pre-ignition of the meth/water mixture before the piston has reached TDC. This is a VERY REAL RISK and can be controlled by using the appropriate mix of water/methanol. The idea is to have the methanol burn only when the injected diesel ignites, and not auto ignite before this time. Methanol auto-ignites at 470C. These temperatures can occur in the pre-combustion chamber. I have found that in the winter season where I live, I can run a 50/50 meth/water mix when ambient temperatures are less than 15 degrees Celsius.. In our summer season, I can only run 30/70 meth/water mix maximum. 25/75 is even safer. If I run 50/50 mix in our summer, I definitely get pre-ignition of the methanol. It is very audible and sounds like a pinging/knocking sound. The sound gets worse the hotter the engine is (sounds exactly like pre-ignition in a gasoline engine). This is very dangerous for your engine and should be avoided at all costs! Piston failure WILL happen under these circumstances.

Second: if you run far too high a flowing nozzle (or a poorly placed nozzle), with it turning on early in the rpm range, you could cause hydro-locking type problems which might impact the head-gasket (or bend a con-rod, wreck big end bearings, etc). This would be a pretty far fetched scenario, and you would probably quench the ignition long before this happened. I'm running a D04 252ml/min nozzle. It's a perfect and safe size for this motor. If your nozzle is around that size I think you will be fine.

The third problem that could occur is if you inject before the turbo, you could erode the compressor wheel over time so is not recommended. Also, make sure you inject AFTER the intercooler (when you install one).

In our winter when I run 50/50 meth/water mix, I gain probably in the region of 20hp at the flywheel. A massive difference in power and a lot of fun around town; feels like a big V6 or small V8 (with the addition of my other modifications). When I run the summer 25/75 meth/water mix, there is far less power (maybe 5hp), but I use it mainly when towing to cool the combustion chambers. When the water turns to steam during piston compression stroke it absorbs heat energy helping to control EGTs.

Basically, the meth is extra fuel and provides more power, and the water is for cooling the combustion temperatures. There is no point in adding the extra fuel if your air fuel ratios are already at their limits (rich). The 2LTE injection pump can inject a fair amount of fuel and is totally adequate until you've intercooled the motor. Once I intercooled I simply could not get enough fuel into the motor. EGT's were very low. The injected methanol was able to take advantage of all the extra air to make some extra power while still having low EGTs.
 
Hi Touie, thanks for posting here. Nice work on your LJ78!

Generally these little motors have a lot of torque in the low rpm range (out of boost), especially when the throttle plates have been removed and the motor can get all the air it wants. Low rpm torque is good because they have a very conservative cam grind that flows very well at low rpms (perhaps Toyota did this to make up for the laggy turbo). I never run out of power in the low rpms. Dougal is right that the turbo does take a long time to spool on these motors (not only is the turbo an old design, but it is actually a bit big for the displacement of this motor), but I don't think that is the problem you are describing. Especially if it is a new problem that did not previously exist. I've never been able to stall my engine.

A few things come to mind:

The first item I would be wary of is the wiring work that was done to convert to LHD. Does your check engine diagnostic light work? You can jumper the T1 to E1 pins in the diagnostic connector in the engine bay and turn your key to the 'on' position. Look at the flashing pattern of the check engine light in the instrument cluster. Record the patterns and see if there are any sensors out of range. The hilux surf au website has a list of the patterns and what sensor they correspond to in their tech section.

Check all the wiring visually and repair any poor splicing or work that was done.

Is your transmission shifting right? Even with the shifter in 'D' position, the transmission should start off in 1st gear. If it does not, there is something wrong with the electronic control (done by the Engine computer). Again this could be a wiring problem.

Is the injection system limiting fuel off boost? When you are having this problem and you have the accelerator pedal all they way down, do you see any smoke? I know if I stomp on my accelerator in the low rpms with no boost, I will get some black smoke. Does this happen to you? Did you change the injection pump calibration resistors? This could reduce fueling and cause problems. Also, when you turned the spill control valve screw, did you turn it in, or out? Maybe you reduced the fueling? By the way, I would not recommend turning up the fueling until you have intercooled the motor (or at least have a pyrometer gauge)....you are pushing your luck. I turned down the fuel until I had an intercooler.

When you removed the throttle plates did you also remove the throttle position sensor? This needs to be adjusted very carefully with feeler gauges to get the right setting. If this is out, it can cause the problem you are describing, although it would be very consistent (not random).

Some of the other Denso pumps (mechanical) can have issues under certain circumstances when the vehicle is on an incline. So there is a remote chance that for some reason your fueling is being limited. Have you checked for fuel leaks or air getting into the system? When you pump the hand primer does it get stiff quickly? The top cover does start leaking on these injection pumps after time. I had to reseal my whole pump. Resealed my rotary injection pump

OK, a couple comments on the water/meth injection. I've been using it for a few years now with no problems. I've had my cylinder head off (carefully inspected top end), and also have replaced my big-end con rod bearings (carefully inspected bottom end) after running the meth injection for years. There were no indications what-so-ever that it was causing any damage to my engine. Big end bearings looked brand new (204,000kms) and no indication of being hammered by the meth (Did my BEB...). So if properly used, I don't think you should have any concern. Improperly used, Dougal's concerns of engine damage are valid, although I personally feel the piston ring lands will go long before the head or head gasket.

There are a few things that can go wrong with the meth/water:

The first problem which is most likely is cracking or shattering the piston ring lands. This will occur from pre-ignition of the meth/water mixture before the piston has reached TDC. This is a VERY REAL RISK and can be controlled by using the appropriate mix of water/methanol. The idea is to have the methanol burn only when the injected diesel ignites, and not auto ignite before this time. Methanol auto-ignites at 470C. These temperatures can occur in the pre-combustion chamber. I have found that in the winter season where I live, I can run a 50/50 meth/water mix when ambient temperatures are less than 15 degrees Celsius.. In our summer season, I can only run 30/70 meth/water mix maximum. 25/75 is even safer. If I run 50/50 mix in our summer, I definitely get pre-ignition of the methanol. It is very audible and sounds like a pinging/knocking sound. The sound gets worse the hotter the engine is (sounds exactly like pre-ignition in a gasoline engine). This is very dangerous for your engine and should be avoided at all costs! Piston failure WILL happen under these circumstances.

Second: if you run far too high a flowing nozzle (or a poorly placed nozzle), with it turning on early in the rpm range, you could cause hydro-locking type problems which might impact the head-gasket (or bend a con-rod, wreck big end bearings, etc). This would be a pretty far fetched scenario, and you would probably quench the ignition long before this happened. I'm running a D04 252ml/min nozzle. It's a perfect and safe size for this motor. If your nozzle is around that size I think you will be fine.

The third problem that could occur is if you inject before the turbo, you could erode the compressor wheel over time so is not recommended. Also, make sure you inject AFTER the intercooler (when you install one).

In our winter when I run 50/50 meth/water mix, I gain probably in the region of 20hp at the flywheel. A massive difference in power and a lot of fun around town; feels like a big V6 or small V8 (with the addition of my other modifications). When I run the summer 25/75 meth/water mix, there is far less power (maybe 5hp), but I use it mainly when towing to cool the combustion chambers. When the water turns to steam during piston compression stroke it absorbs heat energy helping to control EGTs.

Basically, the meth is extra fuel and provides more power, and the water is for cooling the combustion temperatures. There is no point in adding the extra fuel if your air fuel ratios are already at their limits (rich). The 2LTE injection pump can inject a fair amount of fuel and is totally adequate until you've intercooled the motor. Once I intercooled I simply could not get enough fuel into the motor. EGT's were very low. The injected methanol was able to take advantage of all the extra air to make some extra power while still having low EGTs.


Hi Nick!

Thank you for the very comprehensive response!

I think I may have finally resolved the problem, Dougal mentioned above that I should check the ground terminals from the battery to the alternator so I did. I gave them a good cleaning and made sure to tighten them properly. I didn't stop there though, I found 2 more ground terminals on the chassis underneath the body and voila! One terminal was black(burnt) because the nut was loose. I cleaned that up too and re-tightened it. My volt meter is now very consistent and I tried a particular ramp that I always get stuck at using D. I can't climb it like a V6 or a V8 but at least I can climb it on D, period :)

Its nice to be pointing out the turbos on our rigs because it actually bothers me seeing surf guys in their forums saying they get to full boost(9psi) at 2,200rpm. Is it the same for you? I get to 9psi maybe at around 2,900rpm push it a bit more then I can get to 12.5psi. I'm pretty much satisfied in this aspect but hey, if I can replicate what the surf guys get with their turbos why not? Anyway back to answering your questions so that you get to know more about my rig(Asian version of yours) :P

So, I bit the bullet and hired the best 78 Electrician here in the country and paid him around 400USD to rewire my truck even if I feel I have solved my problem. Benefits are as follows --- faster windows going up and down, reducing the hidden gremlins that may come out in the future, making the wires LHD (best current), and most probably healthier ECU, IP so on and so forth. So yes, for a converted vehicle, I think this should have been on top of my list. The whole harness is out and being attended to at the moment, It will then be reinstalled some 5 days from now.

To answer your question re the diagnostics. Sadly I just found out today that this has been disabled. Due to the conversion, they may have disabled this because they couldnt figure out how to make several lights go out I'm guessing. So my check engine feature will be back as soon as they reinstall my LHD harness in the coming days.

Transmission - This I have yet to test once I have ruled out all electrical related work.

I had my rig dynoed at Berrima diesel here in the Philippines (its an Aussie company that specializes in diesel) and initially they did tell me that I needed to have my IP checked because the results say I was running too lean. They mentioned that my ratio was 23:1. No matter how hard I floor my rig I have never seen any black smoke. You know how people are so wary of black smoke, its the other way around for me. I actually look for it hahaha. I havent changed the resistors and this might be one modification I might not touch on because for one IPs are so expensive and I'm probably the dumbest in electronics here in the forum. I tried reading threads with ohms, and what is standard in the UK and advancing timing etc and I just gave up, I didnt have a clue on what I was reading. I turned the spill valve clockwise(more fuel) and yes I do have the Pyro gauge. This was the first ever thing I bought for my 78, like I said I have been reading this thread since mid last year from when I got my rig. I do know that I'm supposed to keep my temperatures below 500 deg Celsius(I keep mine under 400 to be extra safe). The intercooler would be the last mod I would do if ever I still have the thirst for power because I was quoted around 1500USD here in the Philippines and that is indeed pricey. I could buy alot of different essentials with that kind of money(but heck I am definitely just delaying this and not ruling it out).

I did a visual inspection of my Denso pump and it was pretty darn dry. I also brought it to a Denso office here and they told me nothing is wrong with my pump and to have all the wirings sorted first(because they also saw that my diagnostics were not working at all).

RE: Meth Injection

Currently I am running an M3 nozzle attached on the "b" on Turbo on my crosspipe in the engine bay. I just followed what dvldoc said in one of the surf forums. My system is not progressive and I only have the 6-30 psi controller(I have ordered an M2 nozzle and a 2 - 10psi controller already as it may help my bottom end rev range further) Currently I am only running on 80percent distilled water and 20percent Isopropyl Alcohol. It was just yesterday that I got to buy 2 gallons of Meth. (Let me know if my setup is pretty much OK - 6psi - M3 nozzle - placed on letter B)

All of what you have explained re the injection system I read too in other threads from you, Terry_Syd and Raboyco? So yes, I am fully aware of what the dos and donts are with regard to this. My experience so far even without Meth is that I can keep a steady boost and power on inclines which is pretty awesome, what more if my 20 percent was actually methanol. :) To be honest I did buy this for the "cooling effect" especially that the WAIC quote was quite expensive.

I think I have yapped too much for now so I'll call it the day. Hope to hear from you again soon!

Cheers,
Touie
 
Hi Nick!

Thank you for the very comprehensive response!

I think I may have finally resolved the problem, Dougal mentioned above that I should check the ground terminals from the battery to the alternator so I did. I gave them a good cleaning and made sure to tighten them properly. I didn't stop there though, I found 2 more ground terminals on the chassis underneath the body and voila! One terminal was black(burnt) because the nut was loose. I cleaned that up too and re-tightened it. My volt meter is now very consistent and I tried a particular ramp that I always get stuck at using D. I can't climb it like a V6 or a V8 but at least I can climb it on D, period :)

Its nice to be pointing out the turbos on our rigs because it actually bothers me seeing surf guys in their forums saying they get to full boost(9psi) at 2,200rpm. Is it the same for you? I get to 9psi maybe at around 2,900rpm push it a bit more then I can get to 12.5psi. I'm pretty much satisfied in this aspect but hey, if I can replicate what the surf guys get with their turbos why not? Anyway back to answering your questions so that you get to know more about my rig(Asian version of yours) :p

So, I bit the bullet and hired the best 78 Electrician here in the country and paid him around 400USD to rewire my truck even if I feel I have solved my problem. Benefits are as follows --- faster windows going up and down, reducing the hidden gremlins that may come out in the future, making the wires LHD (best current), and most probably healthier ECU, IP so on and so forth. So yes, for a converted vehicle, I think this should have been on top of my list. The whole harness is out and being attended to at the moment, It will then be reinstalled some 5 days from now.

To answer your question re the diagnostics. Sadly I just found out today that this has been disabled. Due to the conversion, they may have disabled this because they couldnt figure out how to make several lights go out I'm guessing. So my check engine feature will be back as soon as they reinstall my LHD harness in the coming days.

Transmission - This I have yet to test once I have ruled out all electrical related work.

I had my rig dynoed at Berrima diesel here in the Philippines (its an Aussie company that specializes in diesel) and initially they did tell me that I needed to have my IP checked because the results say I was running too lean. They mentioned that my ratio was 23:1. No matter how hard I floor my rig I have never seen any black smoke. You know how people are so wary of black smoke, its the other way around for me. I actually look for it hahaha. I havent changed the resistors and this might be one modification I might not touch on because for one IPs are so expensive and I'm probably the dumbest in electronics here in the forum. I tried reading threads with ohms, and what is standard in the UK and advancing timing etc and I just gave up, I didnt have a clue on what I was reading. I turned the spill valve clockwise(more fuel) and yes I do have the Pyro gauge. This was the first ever thing I bought for my 78, like I said I have been reading this thread since mid last year from when I got my rig. I do know that I'm supposed to keep my temperatures below 500 deg Celsius(I keep mine under 400 to be extra safe). The intercooler would be the last mod I would do if ever I still have the thirst for power because I was quoted around 1500USD here in the Philippines and that is indeed pricey. I could buy alot of different essentials with that kind of money(but heck I am definitely just delaying this and not ruling it out).

I did a visual inspection of my Denso pump and it was pretty darn dry. I also brought it to a Denso office here and they told me nothing is wrong with my pump and to have all the wirings sorted first(because they also saw that my diagnostics were not working at all).

RE: Meth Injection

Currently I am running an M3 nozzle attached on the "b" on Turbo on my crosspipe in the engine bay. I just followed what dvldoc said in one of the surf forums. My system is not progressive and I only have the 6-30 psi controller(I have ordered an M2 nozzle and a 2 - 10psi controller already as it may help my bottom end rev range further) Currently I am only running on 80percent distilled water and 20percent Isopropyl Alcohol. It was just yesterday that I got to buy 2 gallons of Meth. (Let me know if my setup is pretty much OK - 6psi - M3 nozzle - placed on letter B)

All of what you have explained re the injection system I read too in other threads from you, Terry_Syd and Raboyco? So yes, I am fully aware of what the dos and donts are with regard to this. My experience so far even without Meth is that I can keep a steady boost and power on inclines which is pretty awesome, what more if my 20 percent was actually methanol. :) To be honest I did buy this for the "cooling effect" especially that the WAIC quote was quite expensive.

I think I have yapped too much for now so I'll call it the day. Hope to hear from you again soon!

Cheers,
Touie

Hi Touie,

Congratulations on finding the problem so quickly! This is why posting in the forums is a good idea; more people means more ideas.

I've decided that the CT20A turbo on our engines is actually not really that bad. At one point I was thinking of upgrading it, and had already bought a turbo from a Subaru WRX (TD04L-13T 6cm). This turbo would have spooled much faster and been more efficient. But at the end of the day, it is nice to have a factory turbo setup and not custom adapters etc. Also, at least the CT20A is too large and not too small. Too small would be worse I think. I hit 12psi by 2000rpm and 17psi by 2300rpm. It holds 17psi as high as I dare rev the motor. I find that under high boost the engine is un-happy at less than 2300 rpm anyhow; feels like it is lugging. Maybe this is because of how Toyota programmed the ECU fuel/timing maps.

Generally, the trick to making power with a small displacement engine is having the torque curve peak at higher rpms (hp is a function of torque and rpm). I don't mind having a bit of lag and then getting lots of power in the mid rpm. Also, I think there is an advantage for this motor with such a free flowing turbine. Less exhaust back pressure is probably a good thing for the cylinder head. I like that the turbo doesn't loose boost at high rpm (flows well). The turbo also seems capable of high pressure ratios for the long term. Doesn't seem to wear or fail at these high boost levels. I have heard of a number of people now running 20psi (no intercooler) for many years with no issues (not that I recommend it; the point is that the turbo seems to be able to take it). Just my two cents. I'm sure Dougal will have something different to say...haha.

Very soon I will be installing a 3L/5L camshaft. This camshaft shifts the power up by about 400rpm. Apparently is a huge improvement for the 2LTE with it's very conservative camshaft profile. I'll report on this soon. Should better match the turbo, so I am very excited.

I'm glad you are having the wiring checked in your truck. Hopefully it is all good. That is a lot of money!! Maybe he can fix the diagnostic system for you? Should not be that hard. It's just a jumper and an LED; could be wired direct from the ECU.

Sounds like you are being very careful and thoughtful with the tuning of your engine! I'm glad to hear it. Sounds like it has a safe tune. The stock setting of the injection pump resistors is actually very good. I would recommend never touching the timing one. The fuel one can be played with, but it sounds like yours is ok. The spill control valve is definitely the easiest way to change the base fueling.

Most 2LTEs do not have intercoolers, so do not worry about it. The only reason I did mention it is that it does make a huge difference for the motor and really increases safe power potential. That is a huge amount of money you were quoted. I would not spend that much either!! Maybe you can learn to do the work yourself and install your own air/air intercooler system? Should cost only around $150-200 in parts if you are careful.

Sounds like you have also done your research and been very careful with the water injection. Good work! You are definitely doing all the right stuff.

Do you have a forum in the Philippines that you and other cruiser enthusiast talk on? Would be cool to see pictures of the rigs you guys drive and any trips you do. I know there is a club in Malaysia that seems to really like Prados (or Landcruiser II as they call it).

Cheers!
 
Hi guys

Has anyone here done or considered installing a 3L cam? The extra lift and duration would let more air in would it not?
 
Yes, it's sitting on my bench waiting for me to have the time to install it. I can't wait! From my measurements the new 3L/5L cam has 0.7mm more intake lift than my old worn 2LTE cam, and looks to have more duration from the round shape of it. From what people on the surf forum have said, it makes quite a big difference.
 
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Hi Nick,

I noticed my rad fan(the big one) makes a really loud sound when accelerating kind of like progressive as i go faster. I feel that it may be heavy on the engine and robbing it of power?

The reason why i say this is because my fan kind of turns on when my temp is at 70 ish deg celcius and before that it is really quiet and not to mention VERY resoponsive and fast.

You think its a good idea to source a brand new fan? Maybe my current fan is not up to spec anymore?

Cheers!
Touie
 
Hi Nick,

I noticed my rad fan(the big one) makes a really loud sound when accelerating kind of like progressive as i go faster. I feel that it may be heavy on the engine and robbing it of power?

The reason why i say this is because my fan kind of turns on when my temp is at 70 ish deg celcius and before that it is really quiet and not to mention VERY resoponsive and fast.

You think its a good idea to source a brand new fan? Maybe my current fan is not up to spec anymore?

Cheers!
Touie

Hi Touie,

That loud sound is your fan working well! Better that than overheating your engine. The fact that it is quiet when it's cool means it is working right. You could adjust the hub (if its the original one) to raise the turn-on temperature a bit. But with these motors, better safe than sorry I say.

Mine really roars when it's hot too, and does a good job of cooling even when I'm towing.
 
Installed the 3L camshaft yesterday (I had ended up buying a brand new Toyota OEM one along with new Toyota bearings for it). My valve clearances were all to spec except one which was 1 thou out. I just left it for now as I don't think it's a big deal and I don't have a shim kit or the tool to do anything about it right now anyhow.

Initial impressions are disappointing. The differences are so subtle I could barely tell a difference. I would say it's probably the worst cost/benefit thing I've done to my vehicle. So I'd only recommend doing it if you're already into your motor doing a timing belt or something and have a 3L cam sitting around. Anyhow, that was just after 15min of driving around. Maybe I'll notice more differences while towing etc. I'll report back on the long term.

EDIT: Did a bunch of driving today with the new cam. I am starting to notice the differences more now. It definitely is different. To be honest I'm not sure it's what I want. It is very smooth and nice while cruising on the highway, and definitely flows better off boost or during low boost. Means less throttle and smoother operation while cruising at low or medium loads. The things I don't like about it, is I could swear it makes less power under high boost. Truck just doesn't seem to pull the same as it used to. Also, I'm pretty certain the EGT's are higher (maybe different timing and exhaust is opening earlier?) Could just be my imagination. Another subtle thing is engine compression braking seems better...again could just be my imagination, or maybe the cam is letting more air in meaning more compression. I think this cam would be great for a lot of more stock 2lte motors, but if you are pushing the motor hard like i am, i think the 2lte cam might make more power. Still trying to wrap my head around it. I think at the end of the day the 3L/5l cam makes a better normally aspirated cam and the 2lte makes a better turbo cam. Just as Toyota intended. Might be pulling the 3l cam and put the 2lte one back in. Expensive lesson.

2nd EDIT: OK, after more driving my opinions are changing. I think what I was missing above was the high torque I had low in the power band. I'm getting used to that being gone now, and am starting to appreciate the smoother mid range. I think it actually does make more power in the mid-high rpms now. Definitely pulls higher into the rev range than it did before. I do still miss the low torque I had, but am adjusting with time. I think I'll keep the cam in the motor. Don't feel like another day of wrenching on the truck anyhow...tis a bit of a crappy job swapping cams.

Couple pics of the two cams:

IMG_20160610_145733120_zpsdjgtweq7.jpg


IMG_20160610_145712942_zps9ijokiry.jpg
 
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Installed the 3L camshaft yesterday (I had ended up buying a brand new Toyota OEM one along with new Toyota bearings for it). My valve clearances were all to spec except one which was 1 thou out. I just left it for now as I don't think it's a big deal and I don't have a shim kit or the tool to do anything about it right now anyhow.

Initial impressions are disappointing. The differences are so subtle I could barely tell a difference. I would say it's probably the worst cost/benefit thing I've done to my vehicle. So I'd only recommend doing it if you're already into your motor doing a timing belt or something and have a 3L cam sitting around. Anyhow, that was just after 15min of driving around. Maybe I'll notice more differences while towing etc. I'll report back on the long term.

Couple pics of the two cams:

IMG_20160610_145733120_zpsdjgtweq7.jpg


IMG_20160610_145712942_zps9ijokiry.jpg
Hi every one all of you have done marvelous jobs here, and i have done mine too, here is what i will share with .for the past 4 yrs or more i had tested on the road with light and full throttle on every mods that made and found out the hard way.i normally pushing it to the limit and go from there.overheating issues are solved by installing a much bigger flow thermostate at lower operating temp (76 degree -c )yet winter is still crank up to 28 cel room temp. engine temp is 1/4 at all time and might spike to 1/3 max and came right down to 1/4 with high boost at 26-28 lbs, highflow michanical injection pump dial in with 12mm plunger,with2.65mm stroke lift cam, 3l camshaft profile ,hardened valve seats inlet and exhaust,smaller water pump pulley,custom inlet manifold, upgrade TD05 with billet impeller, external wastegate-at38mm.at maximun rpm on the third gear my egt shows 800 degree post temp up hill.using factory red coolant ,syntatic oil-MOTUL ESTER OIL WITH additives Microlon-100. with all these mods i had pull over 5000 lbs load in a 1200lbs trailer to moved my ATEB shop equitments, tools and many others shop stuff for storeage at 100 km on the highway without any problems on 33" tires size. i hope to down load some vodeos test run these few days and post it up soon. thanks for reading my post.
 
Hi every one all of you have done marvelous jobs here, and i have done mine too, here is what i will share with .for the past 4 yrs or more i had tested on the road with light and full throttle on every mods that made and found out the hard way.i normally pushing it to the limit and go from there.overheating issues are solved by installing a much bigger flow thermostate at lower operating temp (76 degree -c )yet winter is still crank up to 28 cel room temp. engine temp is 1/4 at all time and might spike to 1/3 max and came right down to 1/4 with high boost at 26-28 lbs, highflow michanical injection pump dial in with 12mm plunger,with2.65mm stroke lift cam, 3l camshaft profile ,hardened valve seats inlet and exhaust,smaller water pump pulley,custom inlet manifold, upgrade TD05 with billet impeller, external wastegate-at38mm.at maximun rpm on the third gear my egt shows 800 degree post temp up hill.using factory red coolant ,syntatic oil-MOTUL ESTER OIL WITH additives Microlon-100. with all these mods i had pull over 5000 lbs load in a 1200lbs trailer to moved my ATEB shop equitments, tools and many others shop stuff for storeage at 100 km on the highway without any problems on 33" tires size. i hope to down load some vodeos test run these few days and post it up soon. thanks for reading my post.

Right on!!! Thanks for sharing your experience and wisdom! Undoubtedly you've pushed the L series more than anyone else on this continent! Nice work. I was always curious about the modifications to your motor. Thanks again for sharing. What part number thermostat do you use if you don't mind me asking?

I also have been experimenting with bigger thermostats (after comparing the stock 2LTE one to the 3B one I realized how much too small it is!!). I put in a high flow Tridon one, and also bought a 3RZFE one that I am going to try for even more flow! I honed out the thermostat housing for some better flow too.

I tow regularly all summer! 9000lb total truck/trailer weight. My truck is faster towing this trailer than it was stock not towing at all when I first bought it, haha!

Personally I like the L series when they are tuned up!


IMG_20160605_110858954_zpslibwobnr.jpg
 
Right on!!! Thanks for sharing your experience and wisdom! Undoubtedly you've pushed the L series more than anyone else on this continent! Nice work. I was always curious about the modifications to your motor. Thanks again for sharing. What part number thermostat do you use if you don't mind me asking?

I also have been experimenting with bigger thermostats (after comparing the stock 2LTE one to the 3B one I realized how much too small it is!!). I put in a high flow Tridon one, and also bought a 3RZFE one that I am going to try for even more flow! I honed out the thermostat housing for some better flow too.

I tow regularly all summer! 9000lb total truck/trailer weight. My truck is faster towing this trailer than it was stock not towing at all when I first bought it, haha!

Personally I like the L series when they are tuned up!


IMG_20160605_110858954_zpslibwobnr.jpg
the thermostate is out from 1kz motor and you need to adapted an adaptor to accomodate it ,michine down the diameter and changed longer bolts to make it works nicely.
 
Hi Touie,

Congratulations on finding the problem so quickly! This is why posting in the forums is a good idea; more people means more ideas.

I've decided that the CT20A turbo on our engines is actually not really that bad. At one point I was thinking of upgrading it, and had already bought a turbo from a Subaru WRX (TD04L-13T 6cm). This turbo would have spooled much faster and been more efficient.

I just checked the turbine sizes. I think the TD04L-6cm turbine is about 15% bigger (flow wise) than your current turbo. Yes it would be a more efficient design but would not have spooled any faster. Likely spool about the same point because it's slightly bigger but the better efficiency makes up for that.

I would use a TD04-4cm. As used on Mitsubishi 4D56 and BMW 2.5td engines.
 
I just checked the turbine sizes. I think the TD04L-6cm turbine is about 15% bigger (flow wise) than your current turbo. Yes it would be a more efficient design but would not have spooled any faster. Likely spool about the same point because it's slightly bigger but the better efficiency makes up for that.

I would use a TD04-4cm. As used on Mitsubishi 4D56 and BMW 2.5td engines.

Thanks Dougal!
 
I did the 3L cam change awhile back. I noticed that it felt a bit slower around town, but more "free" on the highway. Seems like the engine flows better at higher RPMs. I'm not sure i would recommend it to everyone.
 
I did the 3L cam change awhile back. I noticed that it felt a bit slower around town, but more "free" on the highway. Seems like the engine flows better at higher RPMs. I'm not sure i would recommend it to everyone.

That was my experience too. I'm getting more used to it now though. Seems to give a bit better mpg on they highway also. I found one of my main issues was I needed to retune a bit for it. As it was letting more air in, the ECU was actually detecting too much boost and limiting fuel (it starts doing this even before the 'over boost' light turns on. So I had to open my boost sensor bleed valve a bit more to continue tricking the ECU into thinking the boost was lower. Now I'm getting solid peak power again. I've been running 17psi or so for the last few years now. Engine likes it. :lol:

In my 2LTE/2LT-II research I discovered that the 1998-2001 European LN165/LN170 2LT-II came factory with the 3L camshaft and some other significant differences. It also came with a newer head that uses 1KZ valves, and instead of the CT20, it uses the CT9 turbo. So basically Toyota used a less laggy turbo, and used a better flowing camshaft to make up the difference at higher rpm. Would be cool to compare the head (and whole engine) to the other L series. I'm thinking it must have some other significant differences. The coolest thing though is that Toyota did actually use the 3L camshaft in a turbo motor from factory.
 
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Good read guys! I feel more smarter already ;) I am still working out some of the bugs in my 2l custom turbo setup. I am getting a some black smoke at low rpms and when I shift at higher rpms. I might have to fuel cranked up a little too high.

What is this spill control valve?
 

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