Help request for removing broken bolts_Rear bump stops (1 Viewer)

[Mike NXP]

Hey. Thought I'd pick a quick easy upgrade and swap out my bump stops and try out a set of front and rear stops from Perry Parts. The front oem bumps were in tight but did come out with relative ease.

The rears were not as forgiving. I made the mistake of rushing , not taking a tire off, and not letting PB soak long enough. I reach up from down below with 1/2 ratchet and proceed to snap 3 of the 4 bolts , doh! I saved the 4th bolt by the time I finally wised up, removed the tire, and took my time. It still came out very slowly and took some in-and-out and lots of pb blasting.


OK so now what? I assume there's a small welded nut in the frame or maybe the frame has threads on it? I can't imagine getting lucky enough to somehow save the nut / threads and back out the bolt. Tomorrow I plan to go to HF and get a corded right angle drill, a s*** load of drill bits, and a handful of M8x1.25 taps. Or will I destroy the M8 and need to go a size up or maybe over to SAE

I don't think there is really any other option unless I have someone weld the originals back in place, which may be my eventual destiny.



The one bolt that actually came out, next to a snapped bolt. I have a decent amount of space and was able to get a center punch in there but its too tight for a normal drill.

 

[GOLIGHTLY]

A lot of heat, let it cool, smack it a couple times by way of a brass punch, then try a splined extractor. If that doesn’t work, might be a drill and tap job man. Someone will probably have a better method, but I’m a simpleton.

Edit: link Multi-Spline Screw Extractor Set, 15-Piece - https://www.harborfreight.com/multi-spline-screw-extractor-set-15-piece-59194.html

 

[Mike NXP]

A lot of heat, let it cool, smack it a couple times by way of a brass punch, then try a splined extractor. If that doesn’t work, might be a drill and tap job man. Someone will probably have a better method, but I’m a simpleton.

Edit: link Multi-Spline Screw Extractor Set, 15-Piece - https://www.harborfreight.com/multi-spline-screw-extractor-set-15-piece-59194.html

Funny, just added that to my cart few minutes ago ..Good tip thanks.

I don't have any way to apply heat so will just have to rely on loads of PB

So just center punch , and then start with a small drill bit. Then after getting enough drilled out I go in with an extractor and hope it bites ?? Otherwise keep drilling and try again

 

[GOLIGHTLY]

Funny, just added that to my cart few minutes ago ..Good tip thanks.

I don't have any way to apply heat so will just have to rely on loads of PB

So just center punch , and then start with a small drill bit. Then after getting enough drilled out I go in with an extractor and hope it bites ?? Otherwise keep drilling and try again

Exactly. At least that’s my process and I’m probably batting 0.700 on success rate lol. If you pick up a benzomatic torch though, go straight to the MAP gas.. burns a little hotter than whatever is in the blue bottle

 

[Mike NXP]

Exactly. At least that’s my process and I’m probably batting 0.700 on success rate lol. If you pick up a benzomatic torch though, go straight to the MAP gas.. burns a little hotter than whatever is in the blue bottle

Ha, shoot ...Yeah not looking forward to this but hopefully it works out.. ....would you start with the smallest option for the extractor or take the time to drill up a few sizes right from the get go?

Now that they've been soaking I've got more faith it'll come out, I just rushed in to removing....the truck isn't too rusty and ive never had an issue on previous repairs , just bad luck and dumb technique here

 

[GOLIGHTLY]

Ha, shoot ...Yeah not looking forward to this but hopefully it works out.. ....would you start with the smallest option for the extractor or take the time to drill up a few sizes right from the get go?

Now that they've been soaking I've got more faith it'll come out, I just rushed in to removing....the truck isn't too rusty and ive never had an issue on previous repairs , just bad luck and dumb technique here

I just kinda eyeball, “what size can I do that would let me do one more size larger if it doesn’t immediately work” if that makes any sense. Feel like after two attempts with extractors, it’s probably just gonna require more than an extractor. You could probably apply that same logic to an argument for just using the largest size you can. I apparently have problems with commitment haha

 

[Mike NXP]

I just kinda eyeball, “what size can I do that would let me do one more size larger if it doesn’t immediately work” if that makes any sense. Feel like after two attempts with extractors, it’s probably just gonna require more than an extractor. You could probably apply that same logic to an argument for just using the largest size you can. I apparently have problems with commitment haha

Makes sense , I'll do some youtube'in so I get the hang of the technique before getting after it .

What's the deal with left handed drill bits, anyone out there have experience using? I assume they are useless for anything that's rusted enough to snap a bolt head .

The fourth bolt that didn't break , didn't come out all that easy either . It took some patience for sure , so I suspect the 3 busted bolts r in there pretty good

 

[GOLIGHTLY]

Makes sense , I'll do some youtube'in so I get the hang of the technique before getting after it .

What's the deal with left handed drill bits, anyone out there have experience using? I assume they are useless for anything that's rusted enough to snap a bolt head .

The fourth bolt that didn't break , didn't come out all that easy either . It took some patience for sure , so I suspect the 3 busted bolts r in there pretty good

I actually haven’t used left handed bits. But if you’re worried about those ones, I’ll just plug the heat route one more time, does a lot of work for you.

Let us know how it works out, we’ll be here for tapping intel if needed lol

 

[AARONTLC]

I don't have any way to apply heat

Mike, I don’t know if you are remote right now or you just don’t have a heat source at your home but this handles 99% of rusted nuts and bolts. Trust me you won’t be disappointed with this.

Bernzomatic Advance Performance Torch Kit with 14.1 oz. Map-Pro Cylinder and Premium Blow Torch TS4000KC - The Home Depot

The Bernzomatic Advanced Performance Hand Torch is the ultimate tool for precision heating and soldering tasks. Known in the industry as model TS4000, the Advanced Performance Hand Torch features an instant

www.homedepot.com

 

[Mike NXP]

Ok sounds like I need to stop being cheap and buy the torch too....I don't want to take any chances, it just sucks having to spend money on right hand drill, bits, extractor , torch, etc....but life goes on


So at what point is the heat involved .... Do you just do it and let it cool down before extracting , with the hopes that it broke rust free . Or do you do it and hammer in the extractor while it's still hot ?

At least I have some space to work and not much around to screw up

 

[AARONTLC]

Broken bolt extraction is one of those things where everybody has their favorite way of doing it. I just mentioned the torch because if I see a bolt with rust, I don’t do anything until I break out the MAP gas and heat up the bolt or nut for about 30 to 40 sec. The surrounding metal will suck the heat right out of it so you can get right on it with a wrench and start applying pressure. If it doesn’t budge apply again + 5 to 10 sec.

I will be honest with you to this day it has never failed me. I see you give out lots of good advice on here so this was a chance to return the favor. Happy “Blue” Wrenching! Lol

P.S. The best part is that it is so quick and easy to use.

 

[bigredmachine]

What's the deal with left handed drill bits, anyone out there have experience using? I assume they are useless for anything that's rusted enough to snap a bolt head .

the left handed bits are good if the bolt isnt rusted in, going slow the bits will bite into the bolt and walk it out much like an extractor. if it dosnt walk out they come in a set with extractors and you can try to use the appropriate size for the bit that you used. im personally not a of spiral extractors as ive never had any luck with them and when they break in a bolt that your trying to remove in the main oil pan it makes a bad job even worse. and the extractors are harder than the bolt so you wont be able to drill it out, youll have to grind it out with carbide burrs. as for not having enough clearance you can get a right angle drill, its one of those tools that you will rarely use but when you need it it was worth every penny you spent on it

 

[AARONTLC]

FYI, probably the best path for your bolts is not out but in. You probably pulled some corroded threads into the weld nut and it jammed. I think the path of least resistance is up into the frame. Take your time, and mark the center of each bolt with a sharpie and then center punch. I would simply use conventional drill bits. Keep it simple. Good luck!

 

[Mike NXP]

FYI, probably the best path for your bolts is not out but in. You probably pulled some corroded threads into the weld nut and it jammed. I think the path of least resistance is up into the frame. Take your time, and mark the center of each bolt with a sharpie and then center punch. I would simply use conventional drill bits. Keep it simple. Good luck!

Good idea, I think you're on to something . I'm going to try just that....local HF doesn't have stock of the extractor kit so may have to look for an alternative, but the standard ones kind of suck with the square ends so I may order and wait it out

The bolt I took out wasn't that rusty and the others didn't feel bad at first, bit then just got tight and I stupidly just kept going ...... Pulled some debris into the threads for sure ....

 

[Mike NXP]

Only problem I see with the screwing it inward , aren't extractor bits made to grip and twist anti clockwise ? Will have to just get in there and see how it goes

 

[AARONTLC]

I see with the screwing it inward , aren't extractor bits made to grip and twist anti clockwise ?

Absolutely.

The way I typically handle your situation is to center punch and drill out (use cutting fluid) starting small getting larger. If you take the time to locate and center punch by the time you get to the larger size drill bit (just before the threads in the welded nut) the remaining bolt screws up ward. Stop your drill and pull down and the remains of the broken bolt will fall into the frame.

Now, extractors or “Easy outs” can be successful if used when the hole you drilled is at its absolute largest diameter. I would say 9 out of 10 extractor failures are due to using too small of an extractor. Either the hole is drilled severely off center and the operator cannot drill a bigger hole or simply impatient and doesn’t want to take the time to enlarge the hole.

Broken extractor or drill bit is next level difficult. You mentioned you were going to HF to grab a bunch of drill bits. Just me but I would look at some higher quality bits here. You don’t want a mildly difficult situation turning into purchasing some diamond burrs for your Dremel to grind out a broken extractor or drill bit.

Good Luck! You can do it!

 

[Mike NXP]

Absolutely.

The way I typically handle your situation is to center punch and drill out (use cutting fluid) starting small getting larger. If you take the time to locate and center punch by the time you get to the larger size drill bit (just before the threads in the welded nut) the remaining bolt screws up ward. Stop your drill and pull down and the remains of the broken bolt will fall into the frame.

Now, extractors or “Easy outs” can be successful if used when the hole you drilled is at its absolute largest diameter. I would say 9 out of 10 extractor failures are due to using too small of an extractor. Either the hole is drilled severely off center and the operator cannot drill a bigger hole or simply impatient and doesn’t want to take the time to enlarge the hole.

Broken extractor or drill bit is next level difficult. You mentioned you were going to HF to grab a bunch of drill bits. Just me but I would look at some higher quality bits here. You don’t want a mildly difficult situation turning into purchasing some diamond burrs for your Dremel to grind out a broken extractor or drill bit.

Good Luck! You can do it!

All good info , thanks . My heads in the same place, I have 2x DeWalt drill bit sets waiting at lowes along with the map gas torch thing and m8 tap . Hope to not need more drill bits and taps, but probably will....

HF for the right angle drill and extractor set. I see they have some sort of cutting oil in stock, sounds like I should add that too

Figured I'd start by drilling up to a big enough size to try the extractor. If I get lucky and it grabs , good stuff . If not, then I keep drilling bigger going with the method you outlined here

 

[2001LC]

3 methods:

1. Best method, I've never done. As I don't have any welding equipment. Weld a bolt or nut onto busted bolt shaft and turn it out. The heat from welding results in expansion and contraction. Helping to breaking threads free. It would save a ton of time, contract a welder. See some YouTube searches below.
2. Next I see Slee often do. Drill out, up size to work with Nutsert. This is fast and works well. I recommend POR-15 painting the hole, before Nutsert inserted.
3. Method I most often use, is slow. Idea is restore back to factory. Drill out, starting with small bit, working up in size. Start by grinding top flat, if you can (some of bolt, sticking out). Center punch. First drill a small dimple. Then move up in drill bit size, angle drill bit to center. Keep increase size working to center as you increase size and depth of hole. Centering is key. Try easy-out as you go, but most will be to frozen in. Easy-outs exert outward/sideways pressure on threads, locking in threads. So most effect when only a small hole drilled through center, with lots of shafts metal remaining. Which means using a small easy-out. So only little torque can be applied to easy-out, or they'll snap. Almost always, I end-up just keep on drill with larger and larger bits. The last bit is sized, so most of thread remain in the capture nut, with only it's (busted bolt) shaft removed. The idea is to cut away very little to non of capture threads. Then, clean out threads, with a thread chase. Sometime I do start the cleaning, with a tap. PITA job, as one must take their time. Two keys: Center, and final drilled bit size, just leaving enough threads. Here again; Best to paint threads of capture nut with POR-15. If it new bolt, holds factory torque spec, your done. If not oversize and tap, or Nutsert so same size bolt can be used.

You'll find many weld techniques in YouTube. Here's a few:





Remove Broken Studs or Bolts With A Welder - Step by Step - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gz_cv38xT_I

 

[Mike NXP]

Good advice.

I don't have a welder and the bolt broke flush with the frame .

Figured I'd start by drilling and try a small size extractor. If I'm lucky it'll break loose....if not move up and try a bigger size ..... If that still doesn't work , keep drilling and try to maintain the m8 diameter .

Otherwise sounds like a rivnut will be my last hope. Or maybe weld the original back on . Wil cross that bridge later , well hopefully not

 

[2001LC]

Good advice.

I don't have a welder and the bolt broke flush with the frame .

Figured I'd start by drilling and try a small size extractor. If I'm lucky it'll break loose....if not move up and try a bigger size ..... If that still doesn't work , keep drilling and try to maintain the m8 diameter .

Otherwise sounds like a rivnut will be my last hope. Or maybe weld the original back on . Wil cross that bridge later , well hopefully not

Bolt busted in deep, not an issue for a good welder. If you google, you'll see guys building up welds, even on bolts busted in very deep.

Good luck on the drilling. It's how I've done it more times than I can remember. It's worked for me, 100% of time on rust in bolts.