Help: Need a survey of LX470 owners having any engine noises upon cold starting

[Toylexmods]

Help: Need a survey of LX470/LC100 owners having any engine noises upon cold starting

Hey everyone,

I seem to be having a problem with Lexus and the tech assist department. Can any owners post some documentation please.

99 LX470 with 75,000 miles.

Started last winter in Colorado. Engine knock when started in cold temps. Sounds like a diesel truck....ie knock, knock, knock....lasted for 30 seconds or so. We didnt leave the truck outside that often...but the noise was worse the colder the temps. I really noticed it when I had to move the truck in the driveway after a cold start....it sounded like a diesel. on accel....knock, knock, knock.

Winter 2002 there were no abnormal cold start noises heard...45k on the odometer.

Winter 2003 Our LX sounded like this with around 60k on the odometer. see below

10 degrees....it would make noise even at idle on start up.
20 degrees....less noise but could still hear it.
30 degrees....hard to tell, but if you put it in gear and loaded the engine it would knock.

Ok, fast forward to this year winter 2005 in Oregon with 75k on the odometer.

30 degrees...much, much louder knock....same knock as last year just louder at a warmer temp. Also, the knock will last for 2-3 minutes...or if you drive the truck it sounds like a constant knock, knock with engine speed. You can hear it outside, inside and all around the truck. Stand fifty feet away and listen as the truck takes off. Yes, you hear it just like a diesel truck taking off.

40 degrees....less knock noise that 30 but its very clear and lasts for the same 2-3 minutes.
50 degrees....I heard it this week on a cold start. Put the truck in gear and moved it in the driveway....there it was the diesel knock noise.

So, the trend is getting worse and I made the appt to have it looked/listened to. I had to leave the truck overnight. Got the call...and Lexus techs said could not duplicate. Ok, leave it again....same response. 3rd day I come to pick it up and take the techs out on a 49 degree morning. I start it, put it in gear and there is the knock. Two techs heard it....jumped out and listened. It lasted for about 2 minutes and the techs said they would have to call tech assistance. I told them that the noise was about a 3 on a scale of 1- 10 because it was farily warm that morning. Ok, now the round and around with Lexus customer service. Tech assist says its piston noise and normal. Lexus customer service says that the dealer is saying its normal piston noise. .....round and around general passing the buck.

So, I come to find out that the Tundra/ Sequoia group have been having this problem for a couple of years but on a much higher/ louder scale. Nothing is mentioned in the Landcruiser circles....nor here in the LX40s circles. These are different engines than the Tundra and should not have this clearance issue with the pistons.

Bottom line, noise is wear...and its getting worse. And, its not several pistons...it is just one piston. The knock is one piston, period.

There it is gang, if you can document your LX age, mileage and climate that would be great. Oh, and if your hearing any abnormal knocking when you put the truck in gear and or take off from a cold start. My argument is simple....if this is normal, then any number of similar aged/mileage LX470s will have this noise. Simple, right? Well bring me some trucks that make the noise.

So, post if your hearing the knocking and/or post if your not hearing any noises.
__________________
Cheers,

Dave Hall
99 LX470....special knocking diesel model. We were thinking about a new GX470 but forget it now.
92 SC400
00 LS400

 

[Cruisin'Carolina]

Dave Hall
99 LX470....special knocking diesel model. We were thinking about a new GX470 but forget it now.
92 SC400
00 LS400

Now now....I know you are frustrated, but I would not let this experience affect your judgement---by judging from your other cars-----on switching brands or something crazy like that....You think you have problems now? Try an Expedition or Yukon on for size!!

Stay after them they will fix it! Only problem sounds like you will have is a warranty issue, since you didn't indicate that you reported the problem to them while it was still in effect......(or is it?)

Search the Forums here extensively, and do other internet searches as well....If there is a larger problem, you will find it.

Good Luck!

 

[Pitbull]

Dave, I've also read about this on the Tundra Solutions sight. It is piston knock and it is just as you stated "noticed at low temp's and only lasts a couple of minutes at most". Just to clear something up, I posted this same question several weeks ago on this site and on the Lexus site. Only one person had ever noticed the piston slap and he was on the Lexus site. Also they make all of these 4.7 V8's in the same factory in Japan for the Lexus, Landcruiser, 4runner, Tundra and Sequoia. I think that the only reason that most don't notice it is because the Lexus/LC is better insulated and kept in heated garages. I think it is a quality control issue, not many owners have it and I agree if you have it, it seems to get worse. I still think you could get 150K miles out of your engine even with the start-up knock. But one that doesn't knock will last for twice that mileage. You will never get Lexus to do anything about this issue. If I were you I would trade it and get another. The odd's are in your favor that it won't happen too the new one.

Good luck

 

[Toylexmods]

Cruisin,

Nope, my LX470 was a Certified Lexus with 100k warranty. I still have one more year and 25k of warranty. I have searched and as a result here is my poll. I would like others experience on this problem. I will come to the table with Lexus and say....ok, I have found x number of owners with this problem and y number of owners without this problem. If you "Lexus" are telling me that this is normal...why do I not see it out in the real world?

Thanks for the heads up about US big 3 automakers. Dont worry, I will not now nor ever buy one of those. Really, Lexus/Toyota have a problem with these pistons and it will result in failures...it will just take some time.

Thanks for the feedback.

 

[Toylexmods]

Pitbull,

Yes, that was my vote when you posted that piston slap question over on the Club Lexus site. My goal here is simple....gather some facts. If Lexus says this is normal....I should see this out in the real world. If I gather 100 owners and none have this problem...I should have a leg to stand on with my argument. Agreed?

Also, I dont think this engine is the same as the Tundra/Sequoia/4 runner. Different specs, different hp and torque and I think different assembly plants. The LX470/Landcruiser 100 engines are however the same. I dont see this noise on the LX or LC boards. So, here I am taking names and numbers.

I hope we all speak up and get counted. I will hold Lexus accountable on this issue. I will get this truck fixed or I will put a new engine in it myself. I will not trade it and lose 20k for a hope and prayer that the next truck wont knock. We paid for this truck....it has a piston out of spec and I want it fixed. Period

Thanks for the feedback. Oh, and if anyone knows more information on engine specs or assembly plants...please speak up.

 

[Pitbull]

All of these engines are built in the Hino assembly plant in Japan. Same engine tuned different for different applications. Example the Lexus GX470/LX470/LC and 4runner V8 all put out the same HP and Torque in the 2004 model year.

 

[Toylexmods]

Pitbull,

Thanks for that info. Hey, just thinking here...there was no Tundra in 98 or 99. Nor was there a V8 4runner or GX470. Also, I dont think the LC/LX engines were the same in 00,01,02 between the Tundra and LC/LX, different cams and heads...ect.

The 4.7 V8 was LC/LX only in 98/99, right?

In response to your assumption of...150k miles. I dont know if this engine will make it. I dont think it will. I do understand your logic and the logic that maybe more of the LC/LXs are sitting in heated garages. Ours usually sits in a heated garage.

 

[Toylexmods]

Pitbull,

It may or may not make any difference but our LX gets used the way a real Landcruiser should be used. Its not just the soccer mom hauler back and forth to school. Doh!

We lived smack in the middle of the Rocky Mountains and any and all driving was mostly heavy loads up and down mountain passes. That said, the truck was maintained like no other with fluid and service on a very tight schedule.

The type of service duty may have brought the piston problem along much faster than your average LX. I dont know.

 

[Cruisin'Carolina]

Glad you are still covered. I think you may need to dig a little (you may already have) into the "certified" warranty issue. That is a dealer only-thing, right? To get an above average-retail price? Are those things backed by Lexus? If not, what do you think they would say? Sorry, I just do not trust "stealerships" as they are sometimes called here. I do recall from reading another site it took years for the dealerships to own up to some type of sludge/build-up issue for mid 90's es models (I think IIRC)....Press them until they open it up! Get some second opinions!

Good Luck!

 

[Cruisin'Carolina]

Oh, and have any press releases come out or does any documentation exist to back up their claim this is normal? Sounds like they might be just playing dumb and putting some type of burden on you......My advice is to keep the ball in their court at all times....

 

[Toylexmods]

Cruisin,

You hit the nail on the head. Lexus is just calling this condition "normal" but I am saying...you people could call anything normal and expect the consumer to just take it and walk away. Show it to me in writing, bring me other vehicles that make the same noise, make me change my mind. I was not born yesterday.....I have built race engines, I have built street engines, I have road and drag raced several vehicles. I have pushed my equipment to the limits on several occasions. I know what is good from bad. This is bad.

Lexus "Certified" is actually a nationwide warranty backed by Toyota Financial if I am correct. "Good" at any Lexus dealer across the country....or Toyota dealer for that matter.

 

[Pitbull]

I hope they back you up. Good luck.

 

[jjbodean1970]

Lexus Certification is basically an extended warranty for certain years and mileage vehicles, good only through your Lexus dealer, not Toyota dealers

it has nothing to do with Lexus Financial Services, it's through the manufacturer

it's for a period of 3 years from your date of purchase, or 100,000 on the odo, whichever comes first

for more info go here: www.lcpo.com

 

[Toylexmods]

JJ,

Have you ever owned a Lexus Certified veh and had a repair done? The statement backed by Lexus is just that....a branch of the motor division like an extended warranty. And yes, a Toyota dealer has done work under the warranty. We have 2 Certified Lexus vehics right now.

 

[r3run33]

hello toyle i have a 99 lx with 57k on it and no knck yet and its been cold here for the past few days 15 to 20 in the mornings anyway keep at it this may not help ya but i got a toyota for the reliability after being with jeep for a long time no products are problem free but the 100 series has excellent reliability ask around here with milage i personally have seen 180 to 200k milage on several vehicles and some one in particular only changed the oil once a year yes once a year no for some other news if the vehicle is working proberly the dealership may not fix it if the knock goes away and does not really affect the performance and actually goes away after warming up i really dont think they will fix it but keep trying i had to fight with jeep for close to 8 months and our grand cherokee actually kept stalling. the biggest problem we had was actually getting them to admit there is a problem at least you got them to notice the knock.

 

[Cruisin'Carolina]

Wow my eyes are tired and I'm out of breath after reading that one!

 

[jjbodean1970]

sure, i've had several certified Lexus vehicles and had repairs done at the dealer, not too many, not many problems.

and yes, you're right, under unusual circumstances a Toyota dealer can handle some warranty items for a Lexus with prior approval from Lexus and normally only if there is not a Lexus dealer close by. it's usually minor easy stuff they will let Toyota fix for them.

 

[ShadyJC]

Toylexmods,

2001 LX470 with 40K miles, bought it new in November 2000, in Northern NJ so it went thru NY/NJ weather cycles until Spring 2004 when we moved to Los Angeles. It is my wife's DD and our long-distance cruiser (trips over 1 hour) but no off-road and no towing. No knock or unusual sounds at all... actually the closest thing to a perfect vehicle we have had. (knock on wood!)

Sorry to hear of your problem, hope you get it resolved. My exp with Lexus CPO was on a 93 SC400 and they took good care of me for the few issues I had. Maybe try a different dealer?

 

[Toylexmods]

R3run,

Thank you for the reply. I am working on a master list for the Lexus people. If I reach a minimum of 50 replies and none with any knock noise I will go to Lexus with the results. I will not accept my engine sounding like a diesel for the first 5 minutes after a cold start. The entire Lexus Customer Service group are a bunch of idiots. My god people, what are you thinking. This is not a 30k Chevy....its a 65-70k piece of engineering. Make it so.

 

[jjbodean1970]

have you spoken directly with the dealership service manager? if not, i would highly recommend that you do.

if you already have, i would set an appointment with the district service rep from Lexus, they typically travel to each dealer on a monthly basis or so.

as an aside, is this the same dealer you bought the vehicle from? and do you do your normal servicing work with them as well? just curious...