Head Chunks

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate
links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

gmog

gmog

10 Year 15 Year
Joined
May 20, 2010
Threads
4
Messages
39
Location
Albuquerque, NM
Hey Cruisers,

Check out this image. It's from the #1 exhaust valve seat area. Does this mean my head is toast? This cylinder was pushing 150 PSI and there are no marks on the cyl walls to indicate those pieces came loose while the head was on the engine.

How did I get here? :-)

Went in to do valve stem seals, to hopefully correct oil consumption, and discovered all new seals. So did a leak-down test and when I pressurized #2 the cooling system bubbled and gained pressure.

Off came the head, just a little while ago, in fact. Third bolt back on the driver's side was loose, and the leak was between the #2 cyl and water passage just inside that bolt. The head checks flat, according to my simple straight edge.

Assuming I find no cracks after a good cleaning, do I re-lap the valves and call it good? Or would it be best to take it to a shop and let them go through it? If a shop would be best, which local shop do you guys like? I searched and fond mention of Budlong Motorsports. They the ones? Other suggestions?

Thanks!

Greg
chunks.webp
 
Wow, cool pic. Casting defect at the factory? I know there was a time when all japanese products had some QC issues - I rebuilt a honda head out of a motorcycle that had some very unusual QC issues. If there is no indication of damage on the cylinder walls, it might have been there before the head was installed. I have also had a plug electrode break off and pass through the valve without any damage. So I guess my answer is I have no idea how it ended up like that. What does the piston top look like?

What to do about it? Depends. If it is holding compression, lap it and call it a day. If it bothers you, now is a great time to get a new head - I am not a machinist, but I don't think that a shop could do a lot with that. Plus since it is holding pressure, they might be hesitant to touch it. Used heads are pretty cheap and a rebuild is pretty doable in a weekend with some rent a tools from checker and a 6 pack of root beer.
 
I would consider having the head CC'd which would removed material from the chambers and polish things up. That might, at least cosmetically, deal with the missing chunks. Then the valve seats and valves could be reground and the head surfaced to increase compression. Compression on a 2F is very low (7.8:1) and it would help a whole lot to kick it up. If anything I would take advantage of the head removal and get the bottom shaved.

Need a head? There are two FJ60s listed at the U-Pull on Broadway.
 
I would be worried about the missing metal encroaching on the valve seat (can't tell until you remove the valves). If it does, I would junk the head.
 
Not encroaching on valve seat, and valve does not look particularly burned more than usual; I would do like Pappy says and polish the broken casting and re-use the head as long as it is otherwise OK (flat, no cracks).
 
Cracks Etc.

Where do these heads like to crack? Per my VW experience I look between the valves, and between the valves and spark plug hole.

I'll get a good look inside the ports after it's clean. Any place they like to crack in there?
 
Where they crack really doesn't matter. When you take the head in for machining they will check it chemically for cracks. That really is the only way to be sure.
 
Head Work

Pappy,

Which shop do you like? Got any idea of what the service would cost, assuming all they do is clean, check for cracks, cc the chambers, re-grind valves and seats, and the suggested re-surface?

Assuming the missing pieces don't spoil it . . .

Thanks!
 
I'm going to let Ali answer that one. He had work done recently on his 1FZ, along with a bunch of other folks and they were pleased with the result. Other than that, the only shop I've used is Edwards (flywheel and manifold surfacing), and they are very proud of their work.
 
pappy said:
I'm going to let Ali answer that one. He had work done recently on his 1FZ, along with a bunch of other folks and they were pleased with the result. Other than that, the only shop I've used is Edwards (flywheel and manifold surfacing), and they are very proud of their work.
Click to expand...

I used Edwards as well for my 1FZ and have been very happy with their work.
 
beno said:
I used Edwards as well for my 1FZ and have been very happy with their work.
Click to expand...

I used Edwards for most of a SBC bracket car motor and was extremely satisfied with their very expensive work.
 
I've used both Budlong motorsports and Edward engine shop for head and block work. Robbie the landcruiser expert used Budlong motorsports on multiple heads and one block and he was satisfied with their work.

Not sure if that helped!

Ali
 
I'll second Budlong, Todd has always done nice work, I trust him with my Mercedes and Toyota heads and blocks, I see him 6 or 8 times a year now.

PS: What kind of oil consumption? My 2F was drinking oil to the tune of 1 qt per 200 miles, 140 compression across the board with 2 cracked pistons.
 
Last edited:
Hey 505,

My Cruiser was eating oil to the tune of a gallon in 500 miles. 166K miles. Compression ranged from 150 at the ends, down to 110 in the middle. Oil pressure looks great, even at hot idle. I believe the engine was heated up but not run out of oil.

The #1 and #6 cylinders still have a little bit of the cross hatch pattern visible, while those in between are all smooth/glazed.

Still need to pull the rods/pistons to see what I'm dealing with there.

Thus far I plan on replacing the rings and rod bearings, re-honing the cylinders, and putting it all back together with fresh gaskets from Toyota.

The head is still my question area. I'm going to remove the valves and have a look at their sealing surfaces. If none are too badly burnt I'm leaning towards lapping them back in myself.

I've got a straight edge, and find the head to be flat. I can cc the chambers myself (done it with VW heads many times).

I'm thinking to use a shop to clean it and check it for cracks, give an opinion on that missing material, and perhaps shave off a tad. I believe I can handle the rest. Sound reasonable?

I used Edward's Engine for some VW work. They balanced a Type IV engine and did flywheel work for a '74 Bus.

Another friend recommended a shop: Automotive Machine Services on 2nd at Aspen. Any opinions on these guys?

I'm holding out hope that the head is basically OK. Thanks for the thoughts and opinions!
 
Last edited:
pappy said:
Where they crack really doesn't matter. When you take the head in for machining they will check it chemically for cracks. That really is the only way to be sure.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I was going to recommend you find a machine shop that can either do a dye penetrant or magnetic flux test to see if there are any hidden cracks.
 
Update

Well, a "simple" job has turned into a complete rebuild. Saturday I pulled the pistons and found more than one cylinder that needs more than honing.

I'm working on getting the block out now. I'll be hauling everything down to a machine shop for them to check and do what all is needed for the head and block. It'll be a complete rebuild going back in. Not what I planned for now, but it'll give some peace of mind, and save some oil!

I'll keep you posted! And thanks for all the input on the head.
 
perhaps it's time for a Chevy 350? :-)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page

Back
Top Bottom