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FR Tank Installed - the Good and Bad - No Ugly (2 Viewers)
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but it is now. 
This might help
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- #23
^ yikes, is it just one part or more - can't tell from that. I did pm mobi-arc and he gave me some leads, thanks. In thinking about the OEM part, because how this set-up is designed to transfer gas, I would have to modify the OEM neck, I think. I would have to add that transfer line into the Y part that goes to the main tank. I would think this could be accomplished by decent welder... I think? I do like the valve concept in the OEM neck, prevents having to worry about your angle of the gas nozzle to fill on tank vs the other. Plus the fit and finish of the OEM neck is 100% better than the FR (at least how mine currently fits). Here is a pics of mobi-arc's, who also sourced and used an OEM sub switch - I am jealous!
Here are two pics of the rear from ground level or actually a little below since the driveway slopes away from the truck.
Since laying underneath is in such close proximity to the tank, I couldn't really get good pics from there, but I did take pics of each rear bracket to give you a sense of it's distance from the rear most cross member/frame thing on the truck
The is the passenger side, obviously looking up - tank at the top of the pic and rusty cross member at the bottom - should have spent my money dealing with all the rust! The bracket is longer on this side at it needs to span farther to connect
Here is the driver's side. Remember I a laying underneath the truck looking a little back and up at this bracket. Clearly closer on this side.
While the filler cap/neck are perfectly functional, I am not at all happy with how it's oriented. It's up and left, partially to allow the gas door to close, however I think it could be moved to be more centered and still allow door clearance. However, it's up/down angle (vs more facing you as the OEM one is) can't be changed as all the pipes connected to it are so close to the top totally preventing that.
Here is about a minute or less of video of the pump activated and gas squirting out into the aux main line (transferring from aux tank to main) - clearly having a tight fitting cap is essential. It's not the most exciting stuff to watch, but at around 30 to 40 seconds, I get a decent angle with camera and flash light to illustrate things. As you might be able to see, since the transfer line coming into the aux main line is so close to the "v" in the "Y", so gas actually bubbles up and goes back into the aux tank! I wonder why they placed the transfer line so close to the "V" and not farther down into the aux line to ensure the transfer is 100% - just watching it for this minute video I estimate maybe 3.892% goes right back to the aux tank, maybe less but it's a strange design
Here are two pics of the rear from ground level or actually a little below since the driveway slopes away from the truck.
Since laying underneath is in such close proximity to the tank, I couldn't really get good pics from there, but I did take pics of each rear bracket to give you a sense of it's distance from the rear most cross member/frame thing on the truck
The is the passenger side, obviously looking up - tank at the top of the pic and rusty cross member at the bottom - should have spent my money dealing with all the rust! The bracket is longer on this side at it needs to span farther to connect
Here is the driver's side. Remember I a laying underneath the truck looking a little back and up at this bracket. Clearly closer on this side.
While the filler cap/neck are perfectly functional, I am not at all happy with how it's oriented. It's up and left, partially to allow the gas door to close, however I think it could be moved to be more centered and still allow door clearance. However, it's up/down angle (vs more facing you as the OEM one is) can't be changed as all the pipes connected to it are so close to the top totally preventing that.
Here is about a minute or less of video of the pump activated and gas squirting out into the aux main line (transferring from aux tank to main) - clearly having a tight fitting cap is essential. It's not the most exciting stuff to watch, but at around 30 to 40 seconds, I get a decent angle with camera and flash light to illustrate things. As you might be able to see, since the transfer line coming into the aux main line is so close to the "v" in the "Y", so gas actually bubbles up and goes back into the aux tank! I wonder why they placed the transfer line so close to the "V" and not farther down into the aux line to ensure the transfer is 100% - just watching it for this minute video I estimate maybe 3.892% goes right back to the aux tank, maybe less but it's a strange design
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Good write up, thanks for the 911 help
Great write up and images, thank you. Too bad Long Ranger isn't interested in shipping their products over here. I had their 44 gallon tank in my 80 and loved it. Parts fit perfect, used some OEM items and worked very well.
I then contacted Long Range Automotive, but trying to get them to return a shipping price was a lesson in futility.
Even with all the little "Things" with this tank, at least their interested in the U.S market. I don't know if I want the big one again or not. Their was noticeable yaw in the vehicle platform when the aux was filled. I was very diligent regarding fuel transfer to the main tank to combat the yaw and once the aux tank was about half full, I could not detect it anymore.
Good on you for the write up and good on them for supplying the need.
I then contacted Long Range Automotive, but trying to get them to return a shipping price was a lesson in futility.
Even with all the little "Things" with this tank, at least their interested in the U.S market. I don't know if I want the big one again or not. Their was noticeable yaw in the vehicle platform when the aux was filled. I was very diligent regarding fuel transfer to the main tank to combat the yaw and once the aux tank was about half full, I could not detect it anymore.
Good on you for the write up and good on them for supplying the need.
I definitely see some ugly there!
Re: "FR Tank Installed - the Good and Bad - No Ugly"
I definitely see some ugly there, compared to my 1998 LX470 with replacement 182 litre Longranger auxilary fuel tank.
Of course, my Lexus had a "small" auxilary tank to begin with, so it was a simpler fitment. I also don't need a transfer pump, I just switch between tanks at will. My filler is a Type B from the diagram above, and it works great. I can fill the main tank, and leave it at that, or fill the auxilary, or fill both. The AU$350 complete fills hurt though.
A theoretical 1390 Km (865 mile) range, but realistically 1250 Km.
Re: "FR Tank Installed - the Good and Bad - No Ugly"
I definitely see some ugly there, compared to my 1998 LX470 with replacement 182 litre Longranger auxilary fuel tank.
Of course, my Lexus had a "small" auxilary tank to begin with, so it was a simpler fitment. I also don't need a transfer pump, I just switch between tanks at will. My filler is a Type B from the diagram above, and it works great. I can fill the main tank, and leave it at that, or fill the auxilary, or fill both. The AU$350 complete fills hurt though.
A theoretical 1390 Km (865 mile) range, but realistically 1250 Km.
Re: "FR Tank Installed - the Good and Bad - No Ugly"
I definitely see some ugly there, compared to my 1998 LX470 with replacement 182 litre Longranger auxilary fuel tank.
Of course, my Lexus had a "small" auxilary tank to begin with, so it was a simpler fitment. I also don't need a transfer pump, I just switch between tanks at will. My filler is a Type B from the diagram above, and it works great. I can fill the main tank, and leave it at that, or fill the auxilary, or fill both. The AU$350 complete fills hurt though.
A theoretical 1390 Km (865 mile) range, but realistically 1250 Km.
How well does AHC handle all that extra weight?
Great job on the write up. I was thinking about this and now I am not sure about it. It looks like that filler is a real pain in the backside. Then going to get a fill and WHOA! But that is what you get when you fill up that much space with gasoline. When you wrote about it going "somewhere", I was thinking... "so, are the seats floating?" LOL.
Keep up informed if you modify the install!
Jonathan
Keep up informed if you modify the install!
Jonathan
The AHC handles it fine, but that is because I am running OME 862 springs in the rear and tightened up torsion bars. There are a few posts around here where I explain some of what I did, but I haven't done a full writeup.
Actually, I am now running the AHC with a lower than standard pressure, which means less stress on the pump and other components, when the truck isn't loaded up. I achieved this by using the stiffer 862s, tweaking the torsion bars up, and installing B&B Suspension spheres with lower custom pressures. This way the springs hold more of the weight when the truck isn't carrying a load, and the AHC less. When it is carrying a load, the AHC carries the extra weight, but the pressures don't get anywhere near as high as with standard springs and spheres, and I still get full travel of the suspension dampers. I haven't changed the ride height.
If the above doesn't seem to make sense, try this: If I had installed the 862s and tweaked the TBs without using lower pressure spheres, the oil pressure would never get high enough over small bumps to compress the gas in the spheres, when the truck was unloaded, so I would get little or no suspension travel, and hence a hard ride.
The ride isn't as good as it was when the Lexus was new and in standard form, but it weighs 3200+ Kg now, unloaded, versus the standard weight of 2550 Kg or so. The shock absorber functions of the AHC handle this fine. Of course, when I'm not carrying a load, and the tanks are empty, the rear is a bit stiff, but the ride is pretty good. With a load on board and full tanks, the Lexus rides smoother.
PS: The Longranger tank has been great for long desert runs, and it is pretty tough. I slipped off a rock during a river crossing and landed the edge of the tank onto the rock. It was dented, but has never leaked. Those guys did excellent welds!
take your shackles off and put them inside before A: someone steals them B: they get rusted and seize up
Have any MUD members had issues with their FR tanks?
On my 105 the FR 185 litre developed a weld failure during a trip in Namibia which could have potentially compromised our safety given the remoteness of the area where it happened.
This was unfortunately not an isolated incident and I know of a sizeable number of FR tanks on 105's that have failed in South Africa.
I replaced the FR with an Aussie Long Ranger and have had no issues since.
As a matter of interest, the 105 has the OEM dual filler neck as it comes out of the factory with a 45 litre auxiliuary tank.
On my 105 the FR 185 litre developed a weld failure during a trip in Namibia which could have potentially compromised our safety given the remoteness of the area where it happened.
This was unfortunately not an isolated incident and I know of a sizeable number of FR tanks on 105's that have failed in South Africa.
I replaced the FR with an Aussie Long Ranger and have had no issues since.
As a matter of interest, the 105 has the OEM dual filler neck
as it comes out of the factory with a 45 litre auxiliuary tank.I am definitely wanting some extra fuel carrying capacity but from all you have described, FR has some major fitment and usability issues. Looks like many things would be easy to fix (for FR) with some TLC. Minor adjustments would make their product MUCH better for the end user.
Hey Robert,
Great write up on the install of the auxiliary tank. You have brought up some very good points about the install concerns and I will most definitely pass this link along to Front Runner. Here are a couple other thoughts.
The comments on the small gauge and bend in the filler line is valid. Give it a try and see. The pump supplied with the kit is a low volume unit, so I believe that in spite of the decrease in diameter at the bend you will be fine. It does take a while for the fuel to transfer. As long as it is faster than the truck consumes it, all is well.
Here is how I gauge the fuel I have in the rear tank. Fill it full. That will sting. Drive on the main tank until the fuel light comes on. Turn on switch and the main tank needle will slowly rise. Turn the switch off once the needle gets a little above the 3/4 mark. Drive until low level light turns on again. Repeat process once more. That will just about empty the aux tank.
The inlets are designed to fill each tank individually, not both at the same time. So you need to angle the fuel nozzle to point correctly into each of the inlets. This will take a little practice to find the angle that works with your install. The odd thing is that not all nozzles are created equal. It gets easier as time goes by.
The main tank inlet with the filler line tubing in it is a bit trickier as well. You might find that getting a filler nozzle past the tube is tough. On mine, I had to tap the tube a couple time to move it over enough to get the nozzle past it. That might very well be an international nozzle diameter issue for the UN to negotiate. Who knows there.
The locking cap is a bit unique as well. Please let me (us) know if you find a good alternative. I too worry about the key thing. The spare is in my ashtray with the other spare keys I worry about.
The clearance on the tank hasn't been a worry for me. It actually seems to be higher than the spare tire was before. Perhaps that is not saying much. I wheel my 100 fairly hard, and I have hit the tank a few times. Enough to think I might now have a 44-1/2 gallon tank instead of the quoted 45 gallons. It is a tough tank. The bottoms are extra thick for this reason, and CR12 stainless. The can take a beating. But with the taper at the back of the bottom of the tank, it is rare that I hit it before the bumper on the departure.
I have had my tank in place for over 3 years now. I absolutely love it. Long after the challenges of the install, I would absolutely do it again. I'm on 315s, weigh way more than I should, and have the aerodynamics of a brick. I'm getting around 10-12 mpg with the trailer. With 72 gallons on board, I can drive from Salt Lake City to LA on a fill up. Thank God for Costco. Not fuel cans, no spills, low center of gravity, etc. It was worth the effort.
Again, thanks for sharing your install. Great work.
cheers,
Great write up on the install of the auxiliary tank. You have brought up some very good points about the install concerns and I will most definitely pass this link along to Front Runner. Here are a couple other thoughts.
The comments on the small gauge and bend in the filler line is valid. Give it a try and see. The pump supplied with the kit is a low volume unit, so I believe that in spite of the decrease in diameter at the bend you will be fine. It does take a while for the fuel to transfer. As long as it is faster than the truck consumes it, all is well.
Here is how I gauge the fuel I have in the rear tank. Fill it full. That will sting. Drive on the main tank until the fuel light comes on. Turn on switch and the main tank needle will slowly rise. Turn the switch off once the needle gets a little above the 3/4 mark. Drive until low level light turns on again. Repeat process once more. That will just about empty the aux tank.
The inlets are designed to fill each tank individually, not both at the same time. So you need to angle the fuel nozzle to point correctly into each of the inlets. This will take a little practice to find the angle that works with your install. The odd thing is that not all nozzles are created equal. It gets easier as time goes by.
The main tank inlet with the filler line tubing in it is a bit trickier as well. You might find that getting a filler nozzle past the tube is tough. On mine, I had to tap the tube a couple time to move it over enough to get the nozzle past it. That might very well be an international nozzle diameter issue for the UN to negotiate. Who knows there.
The locking cap is a bit unique as well. Please let me (us) know if you find a good alternative. I too worry about the key thing. The spare is in my ashtray with the other spare keys I worry about.
The clearance on the tank hasn't been a worry for me. It actually seems to be higher than the spare tire was before. Perhaps that is not saying much. I wheel my 100 fairly hard, and I have hit the tank a few times. Enough to think I might now have a 44-1/2 gallon tank instead of the quoted 45 gallons. It is a tough tank. The bottoms are extra thick for this reason, and CR12 stainless. The can take a beating. But with the taper at the back of the bottom of the tank, it is rare that I hit it before the bumper on the departure.
I have had my tank in place for over 3 years now. I absolutely love it. Long after the challenges of the install, I would absolutely do it again. I'm on 315s, weigh way more than I should, and have the aerodynamics of a brick. I'm getting around 10-12 mpg with the trailer. With 72 gallons on board, I can drive from Salt Lake City to LA on a fill up. Thank God for Costco. Not fuel cans, no spills, low center of gravity, etc. It was worth the effort.
Again, thanks for sharing your install. Great work.
cheers,
- Thread starter
- #36
^ Paul, thanks for the help during the install.
As many have said, Paul if a first class guy - and in this case demonstrated it again: I purchased from Fernando at Campinglabs because of the special deal he had going on, but despite that Paul was more than willing to help me out, even crawling under his truck for some real time help.
While I only have filled it up once, it went pretty smoothly given the right angles. The angle to fill the main was easy, and the angle to fill the aux just took once or twice to adjust before getting the pump not to stop.
Paul, are you using the FR switch or did you get the OEM sub switch to work?
As many have said, Paul if a first class guy - and in this case demonstrated it again: I purchased from Fernando at Campinglabs because of the special deal he had going on, but despite that Paul was more than willing to help me out, even crawling under his truck for some real time help.
While I only have filled it up once, it went pretty smoothly given the right angles. The angle to fill the main was easy, and the angle to fill the aux just took once or twice to adjust before getting the pump not to stop.
Paul, are you using the FR switch or did you get the OEM sub switch to work?
Trunk Monkey
Moderator
Paul's truck is the same way.
I'm sure Paul, Kurt, and Christo love all of the calls from people that bought elsewhere for cheaper and now need their help because where they got it from can't help them.
to them for being stand up guys.
Thanks for the kind words Robert. Much appreciated. I am using the same switch as they supply, but with a red light instead. I located mine in the same spot you put yours. I have several other switches going on in that area for lights on front and top. I'm starting to run out of room.
cheers,
cheers,
Also, if you tap down on the end of the filler tube a couple times with a flat blade screw driver and a hammer, it will flow better into the main tank. Not enough to kink the tube, but redirect. Mine did the same thing.
Cheers,
Cheers,
