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- #421
I swapped E and F wires (black and green) and it blows the 15A ENGINE fuse. So, I just unplugged it for now. But, it didn't blow the fuse when I had it setup, hmmmm.
dmaddox's 1981 BJ42 restoration and information thread!
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- #422
New problem. EDIC Seems to be wired wrong too.
When I turn the key to "START" the edic opens.
When I let the key sit in the "RUN" position, the edic closes and shuts the motor off.
Hmm...
When I turn the key to "START" the edic opens.
When I let the key sit in the "RUN" position, the edic closes and shuts the motor off.
Hmm...
Dallas the Edic is a special monster. It over injects on start which moves the arm towards the fire wall when you turn the key to start. When in run mode the arm is centered and shut off is full forward. Is that what's going on with yours ? Or is it moving the other way ? if so then yup your wired backward and she will never start.
Dallas, did you get it to run?
OK.... I'll return to this alternator wiring argument now (just to add to the confusion there .... ha ha
)I think I've figured it out Dallas.
No-one is likely to ever be able to convince me that the earth wire isn't the "odd man out" prong .... So, despite blowing your engine fuse, I think you now have this one right.
I think the solution involves swapping your other two connections (ie the WG and WL wires to your F and N prongs).
I say this because this is how the FSMs say the prongs are situated:
As you can see, they say N is at the top and F is at the bottom.
But in reality my BJ40 alternator is wired the opposite:
As you can see, F is at the top and N is at the bottom.
Sorry to muck you around further ... but I suggest trying that.
Not sure what you mean by "edic opens" Dallas. So let's clarify exactly what you're saying first here (before we suggest EDIC wiring changes/checks).
When you key is off, the EDIC arm should push the little lever on your IP "far forward" like this (to shut off the fuel):
And when the key is in simply in the "ON" position (with the engine running), the EDIC arm should have the lever sitting in a "sortof midway point" like this:
And when you're cranking (and it is best to test this key-position with the connector for your starter-solenoid on your stater-motor unplugged so your engine doesn't actually crank) ... the EDIC should pull the IP lever further towards your firewall (than shown in the last photo) to supply additional fuel.
Edit: Ooops. I see I'm really just repeating what Bandit_guy has just said.
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- #427
We are working on this real-time, so THANKS for posting up so quickly.
When I turn my key to "on". nothing happens with the edic. It is full forward. When I crank it - it moves full backward (toward the firewall). So, after the motor is sputtering started (video after I sort this out), and release the key back to the RUN position - the EDIC moves fully forward and kills the fuel.
Hm......
When I turn my key to "on". nothing happens with the edic. It is full forward. When I crank it - it moves full backward (toward the firewall). So, after the motor is sputtering started (video after I sort this out), and release the key back to the RUN position - the EDIC moves fully forward and kills the fuel.
Hm......
That is interesting. It does start though right ? How long does it last before it quits ? I'm thinking oil pressure sending unit might be your culprit. No oil pressure tells the EDIC to go straight back to off. Sometimes after an oil change you don't get oil pressure fast enough and the EDIC shuts it off after about three seconds of running. It's a place to start looking
Pretty sure that this in itself indicates a fault.
I believe the IP lever should be moved to the "midpoint" as soon as the key is turned on.
Edit: Correction .... - My statement here applies only if the oil switch is disconnected. (See posts below.)
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I Just ran outside to check that very point on my truck, and the arm stays in the off position ( full forward) until I turn the key to start and then it goes to over inject ( full aft) and then centers and soon as I release the key.
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- #431
Mine...just checked again. . .does this
It goes to fully open when I go to start, and then when I go to run, it goes to fully off.
So, the engine starts, and then when i release from start, it dies.
I checked the oil sending unit/etc.... fuse (20A heater circuit) and it's good, the unit is plugged in, etc..
It goes to fully open when I go to start, and then when I go to run, it goes to fully off.
So, the engine starts, and then when i release from start, it dies.
I checked the oil sending unit/etc.... fuse (20A heater circuit) and it's good, the unit is plugged in, etc..
Pretty sure that this in itself indicates a fault.
I believe the IP lever should be moved to the "midpoint" as soon as the key is turned on.
And you are SOOO right Bandit_guy.
I've just been double-checking too.
What should happen is the following:
- turn your key to "on" with the oil switch disconnected and your IP lever gets moved to "run/mid-way position".
- turn your key to "on" with the oil switch connected and your IP stays where it is (in the STOP position)
Here's my thoughts on the issue the order I write them is the order they come to mind none more likely then the other just things you check.
Hypothesis #1 The EDIC relay is faulty and doesn't want to send the power to the motor to stay in run. Check that there is voltage on the green wire coming from the EDIC relay.
Hypothesis # 2 EDIC relay thinks the key is turned top ACC or OFF when on RUN and shuts the engine off. Check that the Black and yellow to the EDIC relay have 24 volts when the key is on Run.
I'm going to see what I get off my magic relay box right now and I'll post results
Hypothesis #1 The EDIC relay is faulty and doesn't want to send the power to the motor to stay in run. Check that there is voltage on the green wire coming from the EDIC relay.
Hypothesis # 2 EDIC relay thinks the key is turned top ACC or OFF when on RUN and shuts the engine off. Check that the Black and yellow to the EDIC relay have 24 volts when the key is on Run.
I'm going to see what I get off my magic relay box right now and I'll post results
So my revised reply is
Yes. That's normal with the oil switch connected.
However, if you disconnect the oil switch (just pull the connector off) the lever should then get moved to the mid position by the EDIC motor. (And this is a useful check to perform right now.)
I agree totally with what Bandit_guy says above (except it is the oil switch rather than sender).
And I believe one should never attempt to start a new-to-you engine without having a trustworthy (preferrably mechanical-type) oil pressure gauge fitted Dallas!
you may have zero oil pressure (which I think could account for everything)!
Yes. That's normal with the oil switch connected.
However, if you disconnect the oil switch (just pull the connector off) the lever should then get moved to the mid position by the EDIC motor. (And this is a useful check to perform right now.)
I agree totally with what Bandit_guy says above (except it is the oil switch rather than sender).
And I believe one should never attempt to start a new-to-you engine without having a trustworthy (preferrably mechanical-type) oil pressure gauge fitted Dallas!
you may have zero oil pressure (which I think could account for everything)!
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- #436
So my revised reply is
Yes. That's normal with the oil switch connected.
However, if you disconnect the oil switch (just pull the connector off) the lever should then get moved to the mid position by the EDIC motor. (And this is a useful check to perform right now.)
When i disconnect the oil connection (both the sending and pressure) the edic in the ON position still stays all the way forward (off), there are no changes.
That makes sense.
The wiring diagram picture below will help with the explanations of what should happen. From what you posted above I'm going back to oil pressure problem.
Either switch or broken wire or no actual pressure.
The "g" wire should have power only when the " yb" shows 12 volts even in the 24 volt truck. g and r wires are opposites in the relay. one has the power when the other dose not. For g to get power the yb has to be powered and is only, when oil pressure closes the switch.
Only once the engine is running do you get the voltage on the wires.
If you are sure you have oil pressure you can disconnect the EDIC arm and see if you get power eventually once the engine is running. But if it's doing it's job and shutting off because no oil pressure, well I don't want to think about that.
Let do some more digging to see if you can test the switch without swapping it out for another you know is good.
The wiring diagram picture below will help with the explanations of what should happen. From what you posted above I'm going back to oil pressure problem.
Either switch or broken wire or no actual pressure.
The "g" wire should have power only when the " yb" shows 12 volts even in the 24 volt truck. g and r wires are opposites in the relay. one has the power when the other dose not. For g to get power the yb has to be powered and is only, when oil pressure closes the switch.
Only once the engine is running do you get the voltage on the wires.
If you are sure you have oil pressure you can disconnect the EDIC arm and see if you get power eventually once the engine is running. But if it's doing it's job and shutting off because no oil pressure, well I don't want to think about that.
Let do some more digging to see if you can test the switch without swapping it out for another you know is good.
Here's the only thing I could find for the oll pressure switch to test
Maybe it will bring you the info you need I'll keep thinking away
The White Russians will help I'm sure
Maybe it will bring you the info you need I'll keep thinking away
The White Russians will help I'm sure
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- #439
Im afraid to start the motor now.....but I did check (a) above, and I do have continuity with the engine stopped as shown.
I feel I am SO close here. I heard it run for a few seconds... So I know we are just dealing with a few electrical gremlins.
I feel I am SO close here. I heard it run for a few seconds... So I know we are just dealing with a few electrical gremlins.
Well I differ from Bandit_guy now in that I think this indicates a fault that's unconnected with "engine oil pressure".
How did you go with the alternator Dallas?
Can you see why I now think swapping the F and N connections could sort that out? (Because I now realise that my 1979 BJ40 is wired with those prongs located in the opposite way to how they are shown in the FSM images we've posted.)
But then I guess it makes sense at the moment to get your engine running ahead of fixing your alternator wiring because it is easier to check the alternator with a running engine.
I'll have another think
... but I've got to get ready to leave for work soon.