Diesel engine for 200 series in USA

[pagemaster]

Funny how an engine with 38% more peak power can only shave 10% off acceleration times.
The average power to get a 3 ton lump to 100km/h in 7.8 seconds is 148kw.
The average power to get the same 3 ton lump to 100km/h in 8.6 seconds is 135kw.

Funny how there are other things than just torque helps with performance.

Weight, gearing, drivetrain loss etc.

An unloaded Sahara Land Cruiser weights about 300lbs more than an unloaded USA 5.7 spec Land Cruiser

What's the 0-100time for the 4.7?

The 4.7 is an obsolete engine than is no longer in use in North American markets there is no real point to this set-up as the 5.7 is clearly superior than both the 4.5 and 4.7. Other places in the world, the 4.7 is still used along with other that the rest of the world sometimes gets a little later.

Also, the 4.7 has complete different gear and rear set-up compared to the 4.5/5.7 which are the same

 

[Dougal]

My ignore list just got one more entry.

 

[tempestv8]

What's the 0-100time for the 4.7?

According to this website

TOYOTA Land Cruiser 200 / V8 4.7 V8 2007 - Present - autoevolution

it is 9.2 seconds.

Personally, I'd say that the very early torque on the 4.5 TTV8 makes up for the higher power of the 5.7 and what's really good is that a $1300 chip can produce up to 800 Nm of torquie for the oiler.

The 5.7 would need to have a supercharger to beat a chipped TDV8....

 

[pagemaster]

My ignore list just got one more entry.

Chicken $hit!

 

[pagemaster]

According to this website

TOYOTA Land Cruiser 200 / V8 4.7 V8 2007 - Present - autoevolution

it is 9.2 seconds.

Personally, I'd say that the very early torque on the 4.5 TTV8 makes up for the higher power of the 5.7 and what's really good is that a $1300 chip can produce up to 800 Nm of torquie for the oiler.

The 5.7 would need to have a supercharger to beat a chipped TDV8....

Not so sure a chipped with outperform the 5.7....perhaps get it close, yes....Supercharged 5.7 motors push over 500hp.

 

[Carl L]

You need a petrol that's way bigger to deliver any meaningful torque.

Close to being the worst point of this entire thread, and that's takes some doing as there's been some bad ones.

Go take the turbo off a diesel and get back to me on specific output.

 

[Dougal]

Close to being the worst point of this entire thread, and that's takes some doing as there's been some bad ones.

Go take the turbo off a diesel and get back to me on specific output.

Without a turbo you're talking specific output of 70-75Nm per litre on a diesel. The V6 4 litre petrol does 86 Nm/litre.

Given that all diesel hiluxes are turbocharged and none of the petrols are I'm not sure what your point is.
Turbo or supercharge the petrol to get more torque and the fuel economy takes a massive hit. Hence the factory options of a petrol engine that's 25% bigger.

 

[Carl L]

Without a turbo you're talking specific output of 70-75Nm per litre on a diesel. The V6 4 litre petrol does 86 Nm/litre.

Given that all diesel hiluxes are turbocharged and none of the petrols are I'm not sure what your point is.
Turbo or supercharge the petrol to get more torque and the fuel economy takes a massive hit. Hence the factory options of a petrol engine that's 25% bigger.

It's clear you have little to no mechanical knowledge and simply enjoy arguing on the internet. No one's talking about the V6 while the reasons for not turbocharging the gas V8 option and instead enlarging it is not to conserve fuel. Good grief, I feel like I'm taking crazy pills.

I've been one of the few who has posted about merits of both engines but it's clear you're just as ridiculous as Shotts in blindly arguing about something you know nothing about. Ignorance is bliss though, so at least you must be deliriously happy.

Over to you and your 3,000 posts for the last word...

 

[Dougal]

It's clear you have little to no mechanical knowledge and simply enjoy arguing on the internet. No one's talking about the V6 while the reasons for not turbocharging the gas V8 option and instead enlarging it is not to conserve fuel. Good grief, I feel like I'm taking crazy pills.

I made a comment on torque requirements and resulting engine sizes in the hilux range, you questioned it so I elaborated.

At which point you start getting personal.
It's not a difficult concept, if you're struggling to understand then it can explained again.

But yes a larger petrol engine can be more fuel efficient than a smaller boosted engine. It's due to the reduced compression ratio of a boosted petrol (which reduces efficiency) coupled with higher throttling losses which again reduce efficiency.
A larger engine does have higher pumping losses from the throttle than a smaller engine, but not higher than a smaller turbocharged one.

Diesels don't require air throttling and spend little time off boost so there are no such downsides to boosting. In fact the same diesel engine with a turbocharger is more efficient and uses less fuel than without.

I've been one of the few who has posted about merits of both engines but it's clear you're just as ridiculous as Shotts in blindly arguing about something you know nothing about. Ignorance is bliss though, so at least you must be deliriously happy.

Over to you and your 3,000 posts for the last word...

Another personal jab.

 

[pagemaster]

I made a comment on torque requirements and resulting engine sizes in the hilux range, you questioned it so I elaborated.

At which point you start getting personal.
It's not a difficult concept, if you're struggling to understand then it can explained again.

But yes a larger petrol engine can be more fuel efficient than a smaller boosted engine. It's due to the reduced compression ratio of a boosted petrol (which reduces efficiency) coupled with higher throttling losses which again reduce efficiency.
A larger engine does have higher pumping losses from the throttle than a smaller engine, but not higher than a smaller turbocharged one.

Diesels don't require air throttling and spend little time off boost so there are no such downsides to boosting. In fact the same diesel engine with a turbocharger is more efficient and uses less fuel than without.

Jesus chri$t....Nobody in America who buys a Toyota Land Cruiser gives a flying $%$% about all this. All they care about is power, power, power...oh yeah, they do care about tq somewhat and the 5.7 has that in spades.....More people will take 101 more hp than 80 extra lbs of tq and lower power.

Just an FYI..the 5.7 and 6 speed were designed for TOWING...yes TOWING....towing in the Tundra and Sequoia.....payload was secondary on the 5.7.........

As for the 4.5..yes, great engine for the entire world but it would D.O.A. if ever brought to the USA in its current form. And since you are talkng about diesel Hilluxes....well LMAO at the a diesel Tacoma in the USA.....Never, ever, ever going to happen.


Just curious.....What ever happened to the Jeep Grand Cherokee Diesel...if I did my math correctly, it competed agaist the 5.7 HEMI and turned out to be a EPIC FAIL


Now you can turn on your ignore button.....

 

[Pskhaat]

Nobody in America who buys a Toyota Land Cruiser gives a flying $%$% about all this. All they care about is power, power, power...

 

[pagemaster]

just curious..are you driving a diesel LC in the USA?

 

[Pskhaat]

Damned sure wish I was.

 

[pagemaster]

Damned sure wish I was.

Keep wishing....Toyota needs a 350hp, 600 lb tq diesel to be taken seriously in the US.

The 4.5 puts out about 480lb if I am not mistaken.

 

[pagemaster]

Looks like some crazy Arabs are importing the 5.7 Land Cruise to the Middle east

Land Cruiser 200 5. 7l Automobile Petrol Automobile JP products

 

[pagemaster]

Absolutely SICK

Supercharged Land Cruiser 5.7

531HP
592 ft-lbs

Toyota Land Cruiser 5.7 Liter V8 TRD SuperCharged 530 HP |Souq.com Motors

Who knows if it is really true...but damn

 

[Pskhaat]

I've read every post and I hear you. Here's my point: I know many desert rats who love the power, power, power but these dimwits aren't buying Toyota. The lux buyers are presently purchasing diesel SUVs from other manufacturers. There has never been an engine option in the US to prove anyone's point one way or the other and Toyota USA marketing is not known to be stacked with necessarily the brightest in the industry.

This is an off-road/highway forum, right? It ain't about towing 5th-wheels or the best 0-100 at the local track. I'm struggling to find a single argument that the 5.7 is a better off-roader than their world-offered diesel counterparts. I've driven the 5.7 and it hauls ass and gets me from point A-to-B screaming up the mountain highways great...but...I'll change my mind if someone can show me the torque rise in the off-highway drivable RPM range and the fuel economy to take me 'round Canyonlands.

 

[pagemaster]

I'm struggling to find a single argument that the 5.7 is a better off-roader than their world-offered diesel counterparts.

Fair enough, however there is almost nothing you can do off-raod in a 4.5 diesel that you can't do in a 5.7...

Now, if I were going on a cross African safari for 40 days with not much connection to the outside world...I would take a Toyota Land Cruiser 70 series or Land Cruiser 200 4.5 diesel over the 5.7..there is no doubt about it!

If I were driving from Canada to Mexico....It would be in a 5.7 Land Cruiser...I would maybe trade it in for a diesel Land Cruiser when I get to South America

 

[Pskhaat]

...there is almost nothing you can do off-raod in a 4.5 diesel that you can't do in a 5.7...

With enough right foot, you are absolutely right. I could get'er'done with a smile on my face all day. Truth be told I don't pull that kind of coin to be able to afford anything with a 5.7 anytime soon, but the argument goes I certainly wouldn't be able to afford a diesel variant either

I gotta find me one of those posh jobs where I a good title, get to play golf and buy toys and laugh at the proletariat with my 200 cruising around and Starbucks in hand.

 

[pagemaster]

With enough right foot, you are absolutely right. I could get'er'done with a smile on my face all day. Truth be told I don't pull that kind of coin to be able to afford anything with a 5.7 anytime soon, but the argument goes I certainly wouldn't be able to afford a diesel variant either

I gotta find me one of those posh jobs where I a good title, get to play golf and buy toys and laugh at the proletariat with my 200 cruising around and Starbucks in hand.

Right, posh jobs for those who buy Land Cruiser in the US...medium income according to Toyota is $240,000 for owners of the 5.7...that is why 381hp matters and a diesel would never work...as for the down under/south africa and Asia....the 4.5 is offered and used in the 70s for those who truly need a diesel work truck..I think some 4.5 comes without turbos but I not a 100% on that.

A Land Cruiser outside of the NA is similar to what Sequoia is to Americans...a full line SUV with bare bones models as well as top of the line models with mulitple engine options/different transmission etc.