Brake Failure - ABS - VSC Trac - VSC Off - Alarm - diagnosis

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buddysharp

buddysharp

Joined
Jul 2, 2010
Threads
9
Messages
112
Location
Monterey, CA
Read all threads. Similar problem to some but hoping I'm missing something. OBDC scanner doesn't do ABS codes unfortunately. Failure came on suddenly; no prior issues. Lights and alarm now; no brakes. No pump action; only the ABS Mtr2 relay in the fuse box under the hood clicks intermittently with key on. Assume that means the actuator pump is switching on but not working. Have the FSM out now and jumping pins to decipher blinking lights\codes. Seems like most have sucked it up and just bought the new unit at the dealership. This is our DD so not a lot of time to diagnose so help is much appreciated. Only one dealership locally so not a lot of leverage.
Edit: 100 has about 145K on the clock with slotted rotors and fancy pads 1 yr old (thanks Cristo)
 
Hey superdawg, exactly why I posted. I live about 6 hours away from the shop you mention, but great excuse to go to Disney with the kids. Just wanted a little diagnostic help to ensure I wasn't missing something simple. I removed front wheels, checked abs sensors and wires, cleaned abs contacts at MC (they were clean), removed and re-seated ABS motor relays, but am having a hell of a time with the fault codes via blinking lights. We have considerable other vehicle expenses pending (tires, brakes, etc.) so looking to DIY myself through this.

Hoping one of the gurus can guide me to any other diagnostic steps to take before taking multi thousand dollar plunge.
 
buddysharp said:
Hey superdawg, exactly why I posted. I live about 6 hours away from the shop you mention, but great excuse to go to Disney with the kids. Just wanted a little diagnostic help to ensure I wasn't missing something simple. I removed front wheels, checked abs sensors and wires, cleaned abs contacts at MC (they were clean), removed and re-seated ABS motor relays, but am having a hell of a time with the fault codes via blinking lights. We have considerable other vehicle expenses pending (tires, brakes, etc.) so looking to DIY myself through this.
Click to expand...

On mine, the booster motor started to work intermittently then quit. I drove it to the dealer using the parking brake to stop the veh. I paid $65 to have them read the codes. I borrowed a car for a week so I could work on the LX brakes in the evenings. Tim wanted the whole master brake unit so he could make sure the booster motor fits. You might be okay if you mailed him the old one and he could match it up. Tim said it was rusted and worn out. So far, the new one works well. Good luck, I know what its like to drive used cars lately....
 
Thanks, again! I'm sleeping on it tonight. I have a long list of other maintenance and repair items (tranny flush, new shocks and rear springs, finally install my ss brake lines, new spark plugs, etc so this may be the time to put it up on blocks and go for it. Wife can drive the '88 in the meantime (although THAT list of deferred stuff to fix is a mlle long). I"ll give the shop a ring tomm and see if we can make it work.
 
Went to the dealership to have them read codes today. Faults on ABS pump and accumulator. No pedal, fluid topping out reservoir, etc. Service manager and sr. tech offered to do just abs pump but noted that if that failed, then it was full assembly and labor all over again. Roll of the dice, too far to drive to SoCal to the shop superdawg suggested, no assemblies in local junkyard so biting the bullet. Quoted 2400 for parts and labor misc total about $3000. Holy crapola, Batman. Even tried to local indie shop; he said he'd done 3 and had nothing but problems on the backend and recommended dealer. So much for the OME setup and bumpers...

Going to keep the old assembly and figure out exactly how to fix this thing properly without spending $1000's as superdawg did on his.
 
Mine was 250 for the pump
70 m/c rebuild kit
plus brake fluid
 
yer killing me. called every local shops I could find; couldn't find anyone in this part of CA that would install a new pump if I took the assembly out. tried to find one in junkyard so I could ship it down. no luck. first repair since we bought it so I'll just suck it up and have my only reliable vehicle back on the road quickly.
 
Call @beno and get it at a discount and expedited. Saved me $$ last fall when I had mine replaced.
 
IMHO, these complete brake failures on the Land Cruisers need to be reported by each affected owner to the NHTSA vehicle complaints web site. Most of the time when one of these failures comes on MUD, there is reference to several others (in this thread an indie shop had done 3). I'm not a "The sky is falling" type of person, but this is looking more and more like recall time for Toyota on the booster motors.
 
^^^
I agree. My alarm and brake light are going off. I have never lost the brakes and the screeching sound I had last year has not happened again.

www.toyotaonlineparts.com has the complete unit for a 1999 model priced at $1950. when I last checked. Says they will price match anyone.
Have not checked with Cdan or Beno yet.
 
buddysharp said:
Hey superdawg, exactly why I posted. I live about 6 hours away from the shop you mention, but great excuse to go to Disney with the kids. Just wanted a little diagnostic help to ensure I wasn't missing something simple. I removed front wheels, checked abs sensors and wires, cleaned abs contacts at MC (they were clean), removed and re-seated ABS motor relays, but am having a hell of a time with the fault codes via blinking lights. We have considerable other vehicle expenses pending (tires, brakes, etc.) so looking to DIY myself through this.

Hoping one of the gurus can guide me to any other diagnostic steps to take before taking multi thousand dollar plunge.
Click to expand...

If it is just the accumulator/booster pump, expand your search on the used ones to include 2000-2002 4Runners also - those model year used the exact same pump. The rest of the assembly and electronics is different so not a direct swap. Mine hadn't failed but was making the most awful noise. Found one off a 2000 4runner that had been wrecked at 70k. Think total including shipping was about $220. Once you get the assembly out swapping the pump not hard out all - use the same flare nut wrenches as the ones needed to remove the other lines. While you have it all out spend the $50 on the new plunger assembly and you'll basically have a rebuilt assembly. Best of luck!
 
Thanks all. Sandroad, totally agree and reported today. Told it was better to call and register complaint than to do online. Scottb4857, was unable to determine if just accumulator\booster as multiple codes generated. Svc mgr also happens to be a cycling buddy and was willing to try just booster\accumulator but shop foreman recommended against due to 156K on clock. It's our daily driver so we ran out of time and had to bite the bullet. $2389 for unit, $520 for labor. Very first repair on our LC so happy to say that BUT - piercing audible interior alarm and total brake failure - no pumping helped - minimal pedal completely insufficient for stopping. Toyota obviously knew this failure could happen - thus the alarm.

Held on to old unit - will take apart, diagnose and repair for future.

If this has happened to you, call NHTSA and report - and hold on to your receipts in case there is a recall.

Worst part is now wife doesn't trust the truck - and she doesn't change her mind easily.

Muchas gracias to the community for the advice.
 
Sandroad said:
IMHO, these complete brake failures on the Land Cruisers need to be reported by each affected owner to the NHTSA vehicle complaints web site. Most of the time when one of these failures comes on MUD, there is reference to several others (in this thread an indie shop had done 3). I'm not a "The sky is falling" type of person, but this is looking more and more like recall time for Toyota on the booster motors.
Click to expand...

It's been dead silent on this thread for a while but today it will be resurrected. My wife was driving the kids to school and called to tell me that her '05 LX was screaming loud alarm and all the lights lit up on the dash. The usual suspects, ABS, VSC, TRAC, etc... I thought she'd bumped the Center diff lock switch. She pulled over and pressed the switch. Coincidentally the alarm silenced but lights remained lit, then all cleared. Thinking it was related to the same electrical gremlin that kills the gauges she drove to work. All seemed fine. Then and she left for her lunch break the alarm started back. Then I get an oh**** phone call and she says she has no brakes to stop the truck. Thank God for the e-brake.

I have to agree... this is some BS Toyota! (ranting) A vehicle with an original sticker of over $70,000 should not have absolute brake failure without a more significant warning. Luckily she was in the parking lot at Walmart. Had she been driving on the highway at 70 miles an hour with my kids that would be a whole different story. WTF Toyota?!?! (more ranting), this is far worse than carpeted floor mats in a Camry.
 
Brakes went out on our 2000 LC last week w/ 256,000 miles. 4 lights came on and the buzzer was going off. Fluid level was way too high w/ zero brakes. Towed to dealer and they first wanted to replace the entire MC assembly for $4k. I pushed back and told them it only needed the booster pump. Dealer said they normally replace entire MC but would do just the pump for $2k. Dealer quoted pump for $1200, labor $600. I found the part online at Conicelli Toyota for $860. Pump fixed the problem.
 
ltpipper said:
So was it just the motor that was bad ?
Click to expand...
Indirect reply to your question: I kept my unit after replacement and tore it down. FWIW, the pump disintegrated and I found metal shavings elsewhere so just replacing the pump would have been a mistake in our case. Your situation of course may differ..
 
buddysharp said:
Indirect reply to your question: I kept my unit after replacement and tore it down. FWIW, the pump disintegrated and I found metal shavings elsewhere so just replacing the pump would have been a mistake in our case. Your situation of course may differ..
Click to expand...
When you say pump which part are you talking about ? The motor on the bottom of the MC ?
 
Yes, there is a high speed motor and pump and it appeared that the pump basically disintegrated. Shavings\debris kind of went everywhere.
 
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