Body lift - pics + parts

[Roark]

is there a reason to leave the oem rubber body mount. why not just make one larger body mount instead of having the old factory one and the new one.
I am thinking of doing the same lift but was going to just cut the boat roller to the total height i need.
Is this a bad idea or am i missing something.

 

[VTCDN]

Part # 90540-17002 mount from 1980--11/84 has gone NLA this month.
Mount Positions #3 & 4 .

So that means only 6 of 12 mounts can be had as OEM.

I Must re-bush the upper mounts due to collapsed and rotten.
Lookig at the posted pix , the roller squish has let the bolt to seem loose also. Another question thought ,was if the spacer thats internal of the upper and lower mounts lets the body vibrate also on the frame, due to the bushings / mounts are loose.

 

[Spook50]

Part # 90540-17002 mount from 1980--11/84 has gone NLA this month.
Mount Positions #3 & 4 .

No longer manufactured, or is the stock completely gone too?

 

[VTCDN]

Don't know spook , I was building my parts order list , (Takes hours to make sure ) so checking from the work i did in January before i bought the trucks. If i run a check on mount 522101-25020 that has a PNC to 90540-17002 making the total for that amount of mount now 6 of those in area 3 & 4 . From January #'s they were different.
I was using a few part sites.
I was trying to get all of the upper mounts due to 25 + on compressing them , the lower ones all seem ok.

Some folks here are very much in the know of where to find OEM parts. I'm just letting you know what I'm stumbling over, since i read your mount posting..

VT

 

[transporterjr]

I'm also curious if the strength of the body mount bolts is an issue, as I'd like to use all stainless hardware when I do the job, if possible. Just another thing to help resist future corrosion.

I used grade 8 bolts, which in various threads on this subject seems to be the recommended strength.

Hope I'm quoting OK, 1st post newbie, soon to have FJ60 -

Note that (300 series) stainless steel bolts will not be nearly as strong as the Property Class (PC) 10.9 bolts, probably around 90,000 psi.

Also note that Grade 8 is for inch size bolts and is the same strength as PC 10.9 metric bolts (~150,000 psi/1040MPa). I mention this so no one mistakes metric PC 8.8 bolts (~120,000 psi) with Grade 8 bolts. I was hoping to clear things up, maybe I making it as clear as mud (I hate mud).

Bottom line, if PC 10.9 bolts were there before, I say stick with same property class.

John

 

[VTCDN]

Hope I'm quoting OK, 1st post newbie, soon to have FJ60 -

Note that (300 series) stainless steel bolts will not be nearly as strong as the Property Class (PC) 10.9 bolts, probably around 90,000 psi.

Also note that Grade 8 is for inch size bolts and is the same strength as PC 10.9 metric bolts (~150,000 psi/1040MPa). I mention this so no one mistakes metric PC 8.8 bolts (~120,000 psi) with Grade 8 bolts. I was hoping to clear things up, maybe I making it as clear as mud (I hate mud).

Bottom line, if PC 10.9 bolts were there before, I say stick with same property class.

John

Great Points John.
Welcome , Thats all ya get here , no freebe stuff, not even old grease or mud
Im also new (here !) old as dirt it feels somedayz .
Fill out your profile , so we know where your area is , and the truck you have / are inquiring about. Makes things flow.

VT

 

[Spook50]

Still trying to figure out if the OEM rubber bushings and sleeves/spacers can be substituted by an appropriate length of solid boat roller material (with spacer between the roller and bolt if needed) to act as both a lift and as a replacement for the OEM rubber. Problem is figuring out what length you'd need to cut the rollers to in order to compensate for how much they'd compress under the weight of the truck and to match the length of new, compressed OEM bushings. Then you'd be able to remove the rubber bushings and simply replace them with the boat roller material and bolt it all back together. Bam.

Maybe I'm just being anal about keeping it all even, but that's a good thing, right?

 

[lovetoski]

Spook, I am with you on wanting this mod to be perfect (and cheap). It's bugging me that some of the boat rollers might deform. I have a mod that I will do later this week and will post up. Stay tuned.

 

[Spook50]

Spook, I am with you on wanting this mod to be perfect (and cheap). It's bugging me that some of the boat rollers might deform. I have a mod that I will do later this week and will post up. Stay tuned.

Roger roger, same Cruiser time, same Cruiser channel!

 

[Kurtis]

I did a 2 inch out of round aluminum. I picked the correct size for all the mounts as well so they all sit nicely. It honestly doesn't cost much more than the boat roller and it will defiantly never deform. A local metal shop should be able to cut it for you. I had them cut to 2 inches and then used a drill press to put the holes in them. Grade 8 bolts and that was it. I want to say it cost about 80$ total.

 

[Spook50]

I did a 2 inch out of round aluminum. I picked the correct size for all the mounts as well so they all sit nicely. It honestly doesn't cost much more than the boat roller and it will defiantly never deform. A local metal shop should be able to cut it for you. I had them cut to 2 inches and then used a drill press to put the holes in them. Grade 8 bolts and that was it. I want to say it cost about 80$ total.

I'd be concerned about bimetallic corrosion over time due to the aluminum being in direct contact with the steel. Plus if I used aluminum blocks, it would negate my wanting to keep with something semi-soft (ideally, OEM rubber) for the bushings to retain a comfortable ride. Honestly though, it looks like I might just have to suck it up and go with a set of poly body mount bushings and deal with the harsher ride. If that's the case, I'd probably just order a whole 1" lifted body mount set from 4Crawler.

edit: here's a question, on Roger's site he says you need to specify how many small, large, and medium upper poly bushings you'll need for a 60/62. I know you need twelve total, but does anyone remember what sizes they needed for their wagon? If I end up ordering a kit from him, I'll go ahead and get the poly bushings, "ultimate" lift blocks for a 1" lift, and standard hardware which I'll get some 10.9 metric bolts to use instead.

 

[Spook50]

Hey check this out

I was doing some research on what options are available concerning body mounts, whether for a lift (like I'm wanting to do), or even for just OEM width if your factory ones are shot. I came across the same boat rollers (technically called "side guides") as Doug, only in polyurethane flavor. This may help with longevity and stability (thinking as far as preventing bulging over time) of the material being used. I'm not sure if poly Vs. rubber in this case would make the ride feel better or just harsher overall, but we're not exactly driving Cadillacs here so as long as it's not super uncomfortable, I can deal

Anyway, here are the rollers, it's item RP-212. A difference between these and the rubber ones though is the center hole is 5/8" as opposed to the 1/2" on the rubber side guides. If a sleeve can be found (thinking stainless steel for corrsion resistance) that'll hold the bolt in place I don't see this as being a problem though.

STOLTZ Roller at West Marine

Any thoughts, fellas?

 

[sl33py]

Good info here and helping me plan for eventual BL (i'd like to clear 35's as well). I'm not opposed to a kit if there's a good one out there. But like the simplicity of the rollers you found. thinking minimum of 1" maybe 1.5" max?

The original rollers are rubber, vs the ones spook found being poly?

 

[haryv]

Do these body mount pucks get hard with age?

 

[Spook50]

Good info here and helping me plan for eventual BL (i'd like to clear 35's as well). I'm not opposed to a kit if there's a good one out there. But like the simplicity of the rollers you found. thinking minimum of 1" maybe 1.5" max?

The original rollers are rubber, vs the ones spook found being poly?

The Roger Brown kit comes out to ~$200, which gives you 2.5" dia UHMW blocks, hardware and poly body mount bushings. The problem is that you need to specify which size (diameter) upper body mount bushings you need from him, since he buys them in bulk and sells based on what sizes people tell him they need. I don't know if he's got all the needed bushing sizes for 60/62 trucks recorded somewhere. I would think something around 2.5" would fit all around the truck, or maybe 2.5" in the front most "cups", and 2.75" maybe in the others. I just don't know for sure. I sent a PM to Georg at Valley Hybrids since he's usually got some frames sitting there that can easily be measured.

Honestly I think the poly rollers/guides would be a great way to go, and could also be used in lieu of the OEM bushings (just cut an extra 1/4" or however thickness is needed to match a new OEM bushing in addition to however much lift you want). The hangup I see with the poly is that the hole is 5/8" and I'm not sure how large of a bolt you can fit through the holes in the body or frame. If you've got to get sleeves, you're adding to the effort needed to do the job and adding to the overall cost.

 

[disassociative]

I am just finishing a complete replacement of the body mounts on my rig, and given all the useful information I get from the folks on this site I figure I should give back a bit and save some others from unnecessary headaches.

I chose to go with the Energy Suspension universal body mounts, the softer ones (manufacturer # 9.4102) for some of the same reasons people are interested in the OEM rubber. I didn't realize when I ordered them that the OD on the recessed part of the upper mount (the part that fits through the cup and is lined with steel to protect from any sheering of the soft poly material) is larger than the hole on the mounting pedestals. Luckily (or unluckily) most of the cups had completely rotted apart and by the time the rust was cleaned up the holes were close to the requisite 1.25" mark, the ones that were not had to be widened

The OD of the bushings themselves are 2.5", which fits fine in 2 of the 6 mounting cups per side. The others are the medium ones at 2.25" and the small at 1.75" (not positive on second one, but this is close). The next thing I need to do is go and shim the body mounts that have no cup to match the spec height all around, but I'm at least initially happy with the new ones.

Good luck!

 

[Spook50]

I am just finishing a complete replacement of the body mounts on my rig, and given all the useful information I get from the folks on this site I figure I should give back a bit and save some others from unnecessary headaches.

I chose to go with the Energy Suspension universal body mounts, the softer ones (manufacturer # 9.4102) for some of the same reasons people are interested in the OEM rubber. I didn't realize when I ordered them that the OD on the recessed part of the upper mount (the part that fits through the cup and is lined with steel to protect from any sheering of the soft poly material) is larger than the hole on the mounting pedestals. Luckily (or unluckily) most of the cups had completely rotted apart and by the time the rust was cleaned up the holes were close to the requisite 1.25" mark, the ones that were not had to be widened

The OD of the bushings themselves are 2.5", which fits fine in 2 of the 6 mounting cups per side. The others are the medium ones at 2.25" and the small at 1.75" (not positive on second one, but this is close). The next thing I need to do is go and shim the body mounts that have no cup to match the spec height all around, but I'm at least initially happy with the new ones.

Good luck!

Great info there. So the cups on the pedestals aren't all 2.5" huh? Damn, there goes my idea for how I was going to redo my bushings and get a bit of lift at the same time. I suppose it might be possible to trim the bottom portion of the mounts I was going to make to fit into the cups, but that might not work out too well I'm thinking. What'd you do to get the ES mounts in place in the smaller cups (that were still on the pedestals)?

 

[disassociative]

There were only two of the smaller cups that were still connected to the pedestals. In part for simplicity and--in part because I'm anal about symmetry--I cut/ground them off. The only cups still in place after the changeout are the large cups, 2 on each side.

I did a little bit of research about the risk associated with not having the cups, and what I found was that there is more of a risk of the bushings sloshing around and eventually tearing without them. That said, I talked to the guys at ES and they basically said that this is not as much of a concern from their bushings. In fact, not having a flush mating surface (such as too small a cup) for the bushings can cause them to age more quickly around the perimeter due to increased loading on the outside edge.

Also, from practical experience changing them out (and the mistake of removing ALL the bolts at the same time) I found that it is actually pretty difficult for a solid body to shift much at all on any single body mount. In other words, I'm pretty confident that the 12 mounts will hold the body in place when properly shimmed.

 

[Slowerthanu]

I did a 2 inch out of round aluminum. I picked the correct size for all the mounts as well so they all sit nicely. It honestly doesn't cost much more than the boat roller and it will defiantly never deform. A local metal shop should be able to cut it for you. I had them cut to 2 inches and then used a drill press to put the holes in them. Grade 8 bolts and that was it. I want to say it cost about 80$ total.

I can tell you from personal experience that the grade 8 bolts are now intimately involved with the aluminum puck, unless you absolutely coated them with anti seize (I did and it still is gonna take a sawzal or my plasma for removal).

 

[Kurtis]

I wonder if it is the weather? I'm in AZ and the cruiser sits in the garage a lot but I just pulled one the other day to measure it and it was still free. They've been in there 2 years. I painted the blocks when I did the install not sure if that made a difference. They are out of billet aluminum and the grade 8 hardware is zinc plated. We have a very low moisture content in the air here so corrosion in anything is minimal. I thought to get bimetallic corrosion between these two materials you needed an electrolyte present especially when the hardware is zinc plated. Chemistry wasn't my best subject but I'm pretty sure that's how it works. The nobility of aluminum zinc and steel are relatively close when compared to say that of copper where the voltage difference is great in the presence of the electrolyte. Stainless hardware and aluminum would run a pretty high risk of corrosion because unlike normal steel or zinc they are fairly far apart on the scale but again only with a high moisture content in the air or the area is hit by water constantly. Even in constant moisture the alluminum would last much much longer than the boat rollers. If I did anything other than Billet alluminum it would be Roger Browns kit which uses a better material. As far as ride the aluminum provides the same ride as factory unless your remove the rubber portion of the mount.