blow by advice needed (6 Viewers)

[VTCDN]

Enough of silly talk.. you couldn't keep oil in it.

My 200,kms 3B crank pressure with the Audi crankcase pressure tool measured 34 millibar or 6 oz at 2300 rpm was max , It also went -8 millibar or less than one oz on decelerate down from the plain to sea level , about a 1 km drive drop going down the 2500 rpm drive up to the village.

Pressure was taken off the valve cover , draft tube open to atmosphere, stock 3B @ sea level to 300 meter max.

Glad i did that, Now I have something to go against for the Turboed 3B and the Oil trap venting system ..

VT

 

[AJAEbj42]

holy crap, you have 8L of oil in there and you are concerned about a liter drop over 5000 km?

Wayne, I think he's wondering why he has a puddle of oil on the ground in a townhouse complex that frowns on oil messes, when he didn't have one before the turbo.

I still like Eric's idea (somewhere back in this thread), drop the oil to mid point on the dipstick or wherever and see if the blow-by is reduced.

 

[Fantom]

Interesting suggestions, idea, once again, thanks guys. I will check the operation over the next couple weeks and let you know what happens.
VTCDN - thanks for the readings you got, I'll have to look into testing mine just to see what happens - need a gauge for that now.

Rob, I don't care about the town house people (don't talk to most of them anyways), I'm just concerned about the engine, and yes, 2 litres is not the end of the world when I have just under 8 in the pan, my issue is that I'm a perfectionist and want everything running right.

 

[crushers]

take apic of where the oil return line enters the oil pan. i am curious about something. try to get as much of the oil pan side as you can in the pic.
perfectionist - land cruiser = frustration.
i have met a number of perfectionists over the decades, usually after a while (especially with the land cruiser) they lower their standards. it seems to help with the blood pressure.

 

[VTCDN]

Mat R

Take readings great .
DO NOT plug the draft tube with a gauge ,and read from there, It MUST have a Crank vent.
Mine was open , and with the oil cap removed and plugged / adapted to fit the Tool. The tool is an electronic sending unit that is just meant for drive testing. It sends info to a hand held display via wires.
Nice Tool $$$.

Next would be a much easier way for those without Crankcase / evap pressure sensors.

I would use the DIPSTICK tube and make a tube adapter for 11mm on the tube down to a small size and pass that into the cab , NO leaks and it must seal well for good readings.

Now here is most of the problems for home use, the gauge ..
Lets make a standard for all that can be cheap. A water manometer
Vinyl tubing and the wifes/moms food colouring for a few drops to stain the water , a meter stick , Voila`, now the specs to transverse into Millibars or Oz's

From that , all should around the world , have a simple standard way of measuring pressures.


If you get it wrong Water evaporates .

Just a thought
VT

 

[crushers]

this is all greek to me so walk me through this ...
first you say you measured at the tappet cover which kinda makes sense but to measure at the dipstick tube makes me wonder how you can do an accurate reading when the crank spinning at 2300 rpm is going to create pressure...
how do you determine the blowby pressure?

 

[VTCDN]

There is NO spec or set rule of thumb of pressure to blow-by BUT !! where dose crankcase pressure come from on a 4 stroke ,wet sump , internal oil system engine? Cyl leak down tests internal cyl compression holding , compression for what the cyl can compress .

I have a dipstick measuring gauge also (different euro manufacture & there is a service bulletin on just checking that before you shoot the car) This one is a static running and rev check , not for driving conditions , But the dip stick tube is used because pressure is pressure, and the crankshaft webs & throws are not a fan blade , plus there internal.
I have to check that a few times without any tools like that (someone used the gauge on checking the argon bottle'broken .) So a quickie is nitrate glove , one finger over dipstick tube the rest of the glove hanging around , rubber bands to seal the one finger to the dipstick tube well, start engine/idle , IF YOU Get the FINGER hard , Then the crankcase venting system is plugged, on rev it will grow ..If it gets sucked in the tube (now this is not a 3B im referring to ) the venting system PCV diaphram / vacuum regulation has failed . Kinda common on a few euro makes.

I do have a M Benz dipstick driving gauge tool , but it's a royal hassle because it needs there size and room to place it. Audi's is an expanding type for a few of there oil filling hole sizes.

So on my stock 3B , those are the measurements I found, My internal valve train looks nice and clean No sludge like Mr Dans recent posts of his 3B. So with that in mind my lifter cover / push-rod area should be clean as well as the oil shields and draft tube . 200,kms on it tested.

Mr Mat is oil level is dropping , but only after 4000kms , so if it is all good before 3000kms and the consumption starts heavy after that , I first would now lean on OIL , do a oil test @ 1000, 3000, 4500, kms, that will tell you with documented proof .

I use Euro 5W40 Diesel oil imported, not Re-badge here..
Big difference I found out a while back.

VT

I logged into a euro site and grabbed 1 page of info on this.Each Manufacture has many pages on just there checking.
Here is one , VT

 

[eleblanc]

I once checked the pressure through the dip stick. I'm sure i could dig the thread about it somewhere on the board but the numbers where low, something like 1/4 or 1/2 a inch of water(not sure tho), well under what is acceptable in the diesel world. Still when my dip stick says full, it leaks like crazy until the level is in the lower half of the dip stick level. Then it completely stop. Why it does that...i have no clue.

EDIT: and i did that test under load, therefore driving and holding the gauge in my hand.

 

[VTCDN]

Good Points eleblanc.
So Quebec hasn't got a cell phone / texting law ?? but holding a Manometer is good-2-go

Joking eleblanc.


Your oil consumption (or is it a real leak ? ) is totally opposite than what Fantom / Mat posted ,If in my reading , i'm getting it correct. I took it as with longer time the oil consumption gets worse.

Since I have one 3B still on the engine stand , and the oil pan has not been bolted up permanently ,(waiting on new flanged serrated bolts) I will take a few pictures of dipstick oil depth into the pan and the crankshaft web and throw dipping deepness.

A few new 2010 and later blue tech toys have a wet sump still but have a oil deflection plate the allows the main oil amount out of splashes way ?? Thats my take on it, But now that eleblanc has brought up the level having a large consumption effect. Ill see where this level sits from the cranks position.

I'm also really assuming here that the rear main seal (rear crankshaft seal is dry and were all on the same 3B engine and alls dry with seals and gaskets , no gushers ).

I'll see if I can post a pix of the baffle .

Explanation of plate :
Under the crankshaft there is an oil scraper plate that is to prevent the oil from following along with the crankshaft in the crank movement. The plate is updated and is now located closer to the crankshaft and has integrated drain pipes. With these changes it has been possible to reduce the oil volume.

Notice how short those skirts are? that's not built FORD tough
Sure to have piston wobble .



VT

 

[eleblanc]

Good Points eleblanc.
So Quebec hasn't got a cell phone / texting law ?? but holding a Manometer is good-2-go

Joking eleblanc.


Your oil consumption (or is it a real leak ? ) is totally opposite than what Fantom / Mat posted ,If in my reading , i'm getting it correct. I took it as with longer time the oil consumption gets worse.

VT

Here, if they stop you driving a 40 it is for a inspection, nothing else.

If i fill my truck up to high level on the stick, my truck will leak from the blow by pretty bad. (6" diameter stain on the garage floor, after every usage). It will do this until the level of oil go down to about half level on the oil level stick, once it as reach that level it will completely stop leaking and oil level stops going down.

I had even made a catch can for my truck but never got it installed. It seem the leak have slowed down even when the level is higher and like i said, it will not come out of the blowby at all when level is low.

I mean by leak, oil dripping from the blowby on the front drive shaft and obviously the stain is always perfectly aligned with the front axle pinion side u-joint of the drive shaft.

EDIT: and as the level of oil goes down the size of the stain on the garage gets smaller. Take note that even if the level on the stick show "low" you might still get stain on the floor (due to accumulated oil on front drive shaft). So don't fill it up right away. My guess is that the level will stop going down and in a few days your floor stain will be gone. I extensively checked all that with cardboard under the truck day after day....

 

[VTCDN]

More good info eleblanc, I read your link , 3B turboed and Intercooled .
So what boost are you pushing ?
Fantom was 13, and down to 10 PSIg I think he posted.
I'll pull the Pan in the next few days and measure where dipstick and crank web are in relationship.
Thats the only thing I can see. So much oil in crankcase mist (airborne inside crankcase )from being kept in mist form from the crankshaft webs.
Some of my friends / dudes / colleagues are into pro racing (not me , job is enough) they either have dry sumps or the wet sump oil pan is made deeper or to hold the oil lower away from the spinning crankshaft. These gents measure everything in nano seconds , and they don't want the oil to interfere with the crank speed or cause excessive mist , I have been told @ 18 grand . I don't even wear a watch.

So you could be on to something there. I'll have one of my 3B's turboed and running this summer.
With all of the experience from the gents here , I'll have more to base my tuning of the fuel/turbo/PCV system .



VT

 

[eleblanc]

So what boost are you pushing ?
Fantom was 13, and down to 10 PSIg I think he posted.

VT

I run 10 psi and i have a manual boost controler set to 14 psi. But rarely use it. And never notice more dripping when using it.

 

[Wedg3]

I read a lot about that those days... and

A blow head gasket, valve guide and cracked head can do blow by,
Bad piston rings, liners or piston pin can also do this.

After that you need new bearings.. and Hop !! your engine is rebuild and no more blow by... but my B engine do blow by after rebuild.. so maybe my 600 000km engine is just to mutch tire running hard all those 33 year.

 

[VTCDN]

I sealed up the bottom end of the crankcase , But B4 I did , I took a few pictures of where the OIL level sits on my stock 3B .
The full oil level mark is 1/8' 0r 3mm below the #4 crankshaft web.
I'm wondering if the oil is let to run @ the lower level , if the oil mist is decreased ? Red is full mark, Yellow is add or lwr stick marking.
Remember Its upside-down on a engine cradle .
VT

 

[BC40]

When it's running there is probably the better part of a liter circulating in the engine and splashed onto internal surfaces. Starting a liter low looks like there isn't that much reserve above the pump pick up. A windage tray might be the better choice.

 

[VTCDN]

My Oil pan has 3 baffles , Im seeing 8L of oil ? from MT to full mark.

One gent said that when his level runs half way down on the stick , his oil consumption has dropped, this could be the reason.

I'm going to see if there is a difference , but I don't drive my truck hwy style.
Yet ! when I have a chance , I'll try.

The hwy rod runs oil @ .75 L over full mark .New Car and I don't want to add .

I use a whispering bullet car on hwys.


VT