BC government is at it again

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Well, OK...thanks for the Japan info. Very useful.

With respect, what is needed is an avalanche of correspondence, emails, phonecalls and face to face conversations with the politicians.

By all means somebody start an organization for registered dealers - and exclude everyone else if you want. They won't be hurt; only the organization and the cause will be. No one at TC, CVSE, or ICBC etc. could care much about some dealer’s organization unless it actually lobbies politicians with $$$ or electoral/PR threats - the only things they listen to.

Those who own, import, deal in, part out, work on, 'might own one day' a JDM or other imported vehicle all have an interest in this fight and being divisive is helping the enemy. Feel free to pursue curbers through your provincial regulatory bodies. Not relevant to this issue or discussion IMO.

I'm in this because I like (my) freedom and I like JDMs and want to be able to buy the kind of vehicle that suits me, or others, now or in 10 years, whether it be a Unimog or Suzuki Carry.

I've called three importers about this today, and I can see one of those calls is going to pay off.

Don't forget to CC the PMO. Some people say we're going to have an election next spring.:rolleyes:

I move it be called, "The Imported Vehicle Owners Association" (IVOA) To be organized on a provincial and national basis.

Dealers would be most welcome of course, but as they have a direct financial interest in this issue, I suggest it is politically advantageous not to have the organization appear to be a dealer's group.

Any seconders?
 
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this thread was to motivate owners of RHD units in BC to get off their butts and take action against the goverments move to 25 year ruling, not for a preaching pulpit for Louis's dream organization.
so far this thread has caused more stir than ever before and that is a good thing, we need quick action starting yesterday. this is not something that an organization like Louis is pushing that can be accomplished in quick order. we do not have the time for a lengthy and costly battle at this point. once we can put up a road block on the 25 year ruling then we can invest the time needed for a importers exclusive club (if it is needed).

i really do not care what name is attached to the organization Prieva, what i do care about is that it stays focused on the task at hand. i do not care if an importer chooses to join or not but he will have one vote only and no special power over a JDM owner. i do feel it is in our best interests to have a non-vendor lead the revolt, contrary to my earlier posting. someone that has the time and desire to see this to completion. (are you stepping up to the plate?) it might be a good idea to have a person from each province on the board, no?

more later
 
some interesting reading:
http://bb.bc4x4.com/showthread.php?t=88487

Mermaide.5 is a gov. vehicle inspector who is dead set against RHD vehicles. He is also the new moderator on the Highways and Motor Vehicle Laws section.

canucksafari is an the owner of a 1991 Nissan Safari Gran Road. A number of the Canadian Safari owners hang out at http://www.patrol4x4.com/forum/. John would be glad to help out on the lobbying effort and could coordinate with the Safari owners.

so we have help in the Safari goup.

anyone else secure help from other groups?? if so post it up so we all can keep motivated.

cheers
 
Hi Wayne,

"hummm, so no fees to the members and you are going to pay for it? lengthy and costly...hummm... interesting"

No I won't pay for it - but I am willing to pay a fee, that is how associations are funded. Do I want to run it - NO definatly not, does someone have to help organize it - yes.

My "Dream organization" definatly not, "pulpit" not interested. This is the kind of thing that Greg might have been talking about.

Previa diesel - "Feel free to pursue curbers through your provincial regulatory bodies." This isn't about pursuing curbers. Under the MVDA a licensed dealer can't basically have anything to do with a curbsider - don't know specifically where it is but it's there. Quite frankly I don't much care about curbsiders anymore, don't have time for them and they don't affect my business. An organization can hardly seem legitimate if it is made up of people who are curbers - lawbreakers. For you an organization of RHD owners would be a great idea - just my opinion.

From previa diesel "No one at TC, CVSE, or ICBC etc. could care much about some dealer’s organization unless it actually lobbies politicians with $$$ or electoral/PR threats - the only things they listen to."

This is what an association does - kind of, they know where to hit and how to get things rolling.


Anyway, I am going to continue to help some people out with this if they want it . And like I said, I think that since this is mainly a situation that will be affecting importers businesses I won't rely on the people who buy from me to fight for the rights of my business and my financial interest - others can - but not me.

Wasn't Mermaid 5 on this board at one time - didn't some people basically run him off - or was that another inspector guy?

BTW, the yahoo group has over 70 members now,a pretty huge number that has alot of non cruiser owners. We shold keep this group growing - let other car forums know about it.

Regards,
 
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i am not interested in an association due to watching associations milk their members for their own goals for much too long. unless the organization has huge memberships which this one can not due to the basic demographics it does not have the power it needs to change laws or govern itself.

where is the benefit for the customer? do this organization have the power to fix a situation that might arrise? this is what the different goverment organizations are for, AMVIC is a complaint activated goverment run organization that is actually working to get misrepresentations under control. there is one for each province.

what is the benefit to the businesses involved in the association? if crooked dealers, shops etc are still allowed to be part then the ones with morals then in reality the moral shops are getting punished and mixed in the soup with the poor ones.

what kind of pull with the goverment(s) do you think you will achieve with an association? it can cost hundreds of thousands to have a lawyer(s) to take on a heavy case this would drain the coppers real quick.

by the time the dust settles what is achieved? only time will tell...

the only real power an association has is with it's own members and even then, the power is very limited.

i wish you the best with the association.
 
AMVIC, OMVIC etc. are only there to help the consumer, they do so in disputes with new and used car dealers, and to ensure that dealers live within the guidelines of the MVDA, consumer prot. act, business practices act etc. They do not act on behalf of groups or people when dealing with gov't - that is not their purpose. AMVIC is not a government run organisation - they are a public org. with an elected board. The government got out of the dealer policing business.

Where is the benefit for the consumer? Well, that is a good question - why do you insist that this is a consumer problem? This is a dealer/importer/customs broker etc problem. We are the ones who stand to lose the most. If we lose then the customers lose, we are basically the front line for our customers - no one else will look after them. You canmaybe arrange a petition paper, get a couple of hundred signatures - lets say 1000 signatures - how far will that bring you?

Does the asociation have the power to make change - if properly represented - yes. Not by me though - i can barely type.

What is the benefit to the businesses involved? More business, continued business etc. You think A & A customs brokers has an interest in this? How about the shipping companies? How about the Japanese exporters? Ask A & A how big vehicle importing is to them. You are in the business - is it important to you - or if they shut the doors is that ok?

How are "moral" dealers being punished by belonging to a group that may have some dealers who are scammers? I see that Alberta doesn't really have a Used Car Dealers Association - and now I can understand why you see that this could turn into a bit of a scam. I see the Edmonton Dealers Association - it is a group of dealers basically listing their cars.

In Ontario we have the UCDA - they were formed to act as the watch dog for the dealers - against OMVIC. When OMVIC started they just hammered away at the used car dealers as there were a bunch of used car dealers giving all dealers a bad name. So OMVIC with a broad sweep hammered all dealers and left the good guys out in the cold. UCDA was formed to fight that - there are no used cars offered on the UCDA site - no dealerships mentioned at all - in fact it is a very good assn at the becon call of the members. I am not a member anymore as it doesnt really offer much for an importer, but I will probably join again soon.

http://www.ucda.org/

A legally registered assn, with a board, and members is subject to the laws of the land - corporate laws, so much scamming is not advised. Funds have to be accounted for by yearly audit etc - everyone is accountable.
 
crushers said:
i do feel it is in our best interests to have a non-vendor lead the revolt, contrary to my earlier posting. someone that has the time and desire to see this to completion. (are you stepping up to the plate?) it might be a good idea to have a person from each province on the board, no?
Click to expand...

Wayne:

So, you are now in favour and will support the Yahoo group (which is designed and has been created to do everything you have said needs doing)? Will you send your customers there, and will you pimp it in the background to other groups which have RHD's and might have an interest? Or, will you continue to withdraw your support publicly, and not send anyone to a group that is trying to move forward and do exactly what you are started this thread for?

If you are interested is seeing something happen, then why not support a list that is trying to get all interested parties together? Is it because there is no advertising allowed? Is it because of who started it? Is it because of who is registered in it? Why would you throw the party ball out there, then take it back...right when you ask that there be no bickering? Lead by example my friend. It perplexes me because I know you, and know you really do want to see something positive happen. Mud is a great site and will continue to be imo: I pimp it to all Cruiser owners I meet. I pimp Mud and the Yahoo list to all RHD Cruiser owners I meet.

The dealer association is a totally separate issue though, and is a good idea. Tough to make happen as people can now see, however hopefully enough leaders step forward, put differences aside and can make something happen.

Peace...out.

hth's

gb
 
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Greg_B said:
Wayne:

So, you are now in favour and will support the Yahoo group (which is designed and has been created to do everything you have said needs doing)? Will you send your customers there, and will you pimp it in the background to other groups which have RHD's and might have an interest? Or, will you continue to withdraw your support publicly, and not send anyone to a group that is trying to move forward and do exactly what you are started this thread for?

If you are interested is seeing something happen, then why not support a list that is trying to get all interested parties together? Is it because there is no advertising allowed? Is it because of who started it? Is it because of who is registered in it? Why would you throw the party ball out there, then take it back...right when you ask that there be no bickering? Lead by example my friend. It perplexes me because I know you, and know you really do want to see something positive happen. Mud is a great site and will continue to be imo: I pimp it to all Cruiser owners I meet. I pimp Mud and the Yahoo list to all RHD Cruiser owners I meet.

The dealer association is a totally separate issue though, and is a good idea. Tough to make happen as people can now see, however hopefully enough leaders step forward, put differences aside and can make something happen.

hth's

gb
Click to expand...

Greg,
i NEVER mentioned to anyone not to join the RHDTLC yahoo group. i said i would not be a vocal contributor. that is all. i have nothing against the site and i only advertise on Mud and a couple mags. i do not need to advertise on the yahoo group or ever desired to. Word of mouth is my main advertising.

I have nothing against you or what you do. i respect you and your morals, you are someone that many, including myself, can look up to.

what i can do is add the RHDTLC yahoo group to my main page so all visitors can choose to visit or not with out any influence from me. i will go a step further, i will promote the site on my main page.

i do not have a problem with those tht join the yahoo site and if you are the one hosting it i do not have a problem there either. i do have an issue but it has no place on this thread.
i wish you the best with the Yahoo site.
 
crushers said:
what i can do is add the RHDTLC yahoo group to my main page so all visitors can choose to visit or not with out any influence from me. i will go a step further, i will promote the site on my main page.

i do not have a problem with those tht join the yahoo site and if you are the one hosting it i do not have a problem there either. i do have an issue but it has no place on this thread. i wish you the best with the Yahoo site.
Click to expand...

Cool.

I've no idea if the RHD group will take off. It was created the last time you mentioned frustration with all talk and no action...so I took some action and created a list where all can get together and plan. It sat relatively idle, however there are over 70 members now. A driving force is needed to bring it to the next level. Some have tried, others have sat back and done nothing.

In the end it may not go anywhere. As you've alluded to with this issue "It will only be as active and productive as the members make it"...

However, maybe though this issue, it will galvanize more and more RHD folk to band together and take action. It has started already thanks to this thread, so in fact the intent wanted by starting this thread is happening. Don't take your ball away. Keep it in play and support all avenues that are attempting to do something. You never know where it will lead.

gb
 
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Good idea Wayne, I'll add it to my website page as well, and add a link to my signature.
 
This is my first post and I had hoped it would be under better circumstances. I have posted a notice and link to for the Canadian Nissan Safari Owners. I have also posted a link for the Canadian Delica owners on their web page. They have also been discussing it but have not talked about any action: http://delica.ca/forum/viewtopic.php?p=918#918. As you can see, I ("elbosque" on this forum) have asked them to start writting their MLAs and MPs. Coincidently, I had just fired off a letter to my MP last night regarding the impact of the new ULSD on pre-1996 injector pumps as mine is getting new seals refitted because of ULSD.

I am not an importer - nor do I have any expectation of wanting to import in the near future. I would just like to see more RHD Safari's here as I believe it will make getting parts easier and cheaper.

I firmly believe that we need one web site to act as an information clearing house and a place to coordinate the campaign against this threatt. So far I have directed the Canadian Safari and Delica owners to this thread.

One thing I would like to point out is that the automotive delares industry in New Zealand tried the same thing there to combat JDM imports. They lost the battle. As far as i could find out, they never were able to prove their safety claims and were only out to try to scare and mis-inform.

Cheers, John
 
Another dealer to include.

Previa Diesel said:
Has anyone sent an email or called all those importers listed in the 'importers thread'?
Click to expand...

You can also add Karim at Silk Roads Autos in Surrey BC to this list: http://www.silkroadautos.com/.

I bought my safari from him. However, he doesn't know much about the vehicles he sells. It is his brother who is a mechanic. So far I am happy with my truck I bought from him. I went with him because of Wayne's recommendation on going with licensed dealers and I am not a big risk taker.

John
 
Sounds like we need a dedicated message board for this ASAP.

We need a bulletin board in phpBB or similar format. Mailing lists, while secure are somewhat cumbersome and obsolete technically.
At least an information/introduction part of the list should be public. IMO the main area should be restricted to members for posting and perhaps viewing How much information to request from members can be decided later. Inclusiveness is more important than security however.

Material which needs more security could be distributed via a mailing list

Anyone have experience running a bulletin board? I believe freeware is available on the net. Certainly, free BBS hosting is; may or may not be suitable.

The important thing is not to have information scattered around in different places where it's not easy to find and cross-reference.

Once there is a central collection point we can refer all interested parties to it and get some critical mass/fusion happening.
 
i sent a request to update my main page with the yahoo group link and recomendation to join...
 
a bit of good news:

Wayne,
We learned through our experience with Transport Canada over the
Marine Liability Act, you can indeed get action if you are reasoned,
well prepared and, as you say, not panicked.

The wilderness tourism sector (i.e small boats, canoes, rafts) knew
nothing of the MLA and how it affected our industry until *after* it
was passed into law. To make a long story short, the MLA had lumped
the insurance requirements for small tourism operations renting a few
canoes in with multinationals operating supertankers and cruise
ships. Since we had proof they did not consult with industry ahead of
time (at all), and the results were patently ridiculous, we were
ultimately able to get the law changed to reflect reality.


so the battle could be won...
 
I have just sent the following note to the Honorable Kevin Falcon who is the BC Minister of Transportation via his Constituency Web Page: http://www.kevinfalconmla.bc.ca/?section_id=1457. I had read in an article somewhere that biodiesel was one of his pets which he hoped would expand in BC. I plan on writing my MLA and the Federal Minister of transport this weekend.
John

Dear Mr. Falcon,
I am writing you about the recent CBC news story (http://www.cbc.ca/consumer/story/2006/12/22/japanesecars.html) regarding right hand drive vehicles.
I am quite dismayed at the accussations made by Mr. Woods while having no proof that these vehicles are a safety concern. It is true that passing can take extra care and attention but no more than that of a small car trying to pass a larger vehicle they can not see over. As the story points out, generally speaking these RHD imports from Japan are in much better condition than their North American counterparts. I am an owner of such a vehicle who uses it to transport my family.
I only decided on the purchase of the vehicle after a detailed research which included safety. Another big plus for with most of the diesel RHD vehicles is that they are able to use biodiesel while many North American diesels can not. Therefore, I am able to help ensure emmissions are reduced.
I would hope that in the future people under the guidance of your ministry would take more care in making accusations without providing supporting evidence. I suspect, as do many RHD vehicle owners, that this action from Mr. Woods may have more to do with the automotive lobby interests than legitimate safety concerns. I would suggest Mr. Woods spend his time looking at more urgent saftey concerns with Transport canada, such as HID head lights and vehicles operating in snow and ice without proper winter tires. I am sure Mr Woods will be able to find data to support corrective action with Transport Canada regarding these issues.
Thank you for taking the time to consider my letter.
Sincerely,
John Gabor
 
crushers said:
i sent a request to update my main page with the yahoo group link and recomendation to join...
Click to expand...

Wayne, I remember why I don't visit this group, you can't see the posts on-line. I don't subscribe to have posts e-mailed to me ever. I get way too much e-mail as it is now. Is there any way to set it so the members can view the posts on-line?

Cheers, John
 
Hi John,

Excellent letter. You should be able to see th eposts on line - i see them - just click on the "messages" section. That will bring you to the latest messages. That type of board is different to what you are probably used to - but doesnt take long to get the hang of.

If you don't mind, I have copied and pasted your post to the yahoo group board.

Also, MLA's are one of the best resources available to the public - they are the Liaison between the public and the gov't basically. I used the MLA's, ombudsman, and MTO special inquiry unit to rectify the registration issue here in ontario last february.

Regards,
 
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