are 80 oem recovery points ok for strap recovery? (1 Viewer)

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I'm just saying Idaho Doug carries a 27,000lb strap. Alot of people carry 30,000 lb strap. I'd rather have my strap have a lower rating than the hook, and have it fail before the hook.

Have you found anyone that sells a 30,000 lb working load rated shackle mount? I have an 18 ton shackle. It weighs about 10 lbs and has a 1.5" diameter screw pin. I have it for my 30,000 lb snatch block running on my 12,000 lb winch. It won't fit through the holes on the ARB.

Page 062 of the Crosby catalog.
http://www.thecrosbygroup.com/productcatalog/maininterface.htm

If you look on page 151 there IS a swivel shackle mount rated at handling 29,000 lb working load. It weighs 25 lbs and mounts via a single 2" diameter bolt that has a torque spec of 1100 lbs.

Now that we've covered the rediculous...

What would the working load rating of the Toyota loop recovery points be?
 
The hitch actually makes an excellent rear recovery point with a stinger (inserts in hitch) and shackle such as Warn sells, and would be my preference for a massive stuck. That's what I carry and a couple years ago is what I used for a CNN satellite truck stuck in the mud (mild) I yanked. The hitch on the 4Runner pictured in this thread does not at all look like a factory hitch, nor a Class III hitch - looks like an aftermarket of the type I regularly rail against. Sounds like it did not do well in the recovery. Also, never use the ball on a hitch as an attachment point.

I'll see if I can find a Toyota standard for the recovery points though it may be something that's not going to be provided as some things manufacturers don't want in the public realm. Would be very interesting, though.

On the comments about the factory loop not being allowed at an event. I've never heard of this, in fact the events I've been at the organizers preferred vehicles with factory hooks versus unknown aftermarket ones.

On the ARB points - I have heard and subscribe to the point made here a while back that they were designed by ARB for high lift jacking, not recovery. They are simply too thin and seem like they'd fold sideways in any recovery that's not straight ahead. Mine seem to have a bit of reinforcement, but if ARB went to the trouble of this extra work and intended them for recovery they would have put much thicker metal on. So, I would not use them for recovery. The comments about putting a recovery point out on the wings are, IMHO, not a good idea as they're out beyond the attachment points to the frame where leverage to bend the bumper/frame can be generated. I feel an ARB modification for recovery should be in the center of the bumper and not outboard of the frame mounts. A thick backing plate BEHIND the center section, with a pivoting attachment point for multi directional use would be a great setup.

I should also state that if I were helping someone in a serious stuck where I'm going to be banging my strap to its max (15mph hit is rating at the 80's weight) I would only do it after personally padding and wrapping the strap around the stuck's axle. Yes, I'd require the owner to shovel it clear (heh). That much force is simply too much for me to freely volunteer to risk my life in front of. A recovery point coming off a stuck truck at that level of force would tear through the passenger compartment of an 80 end to end - through the rear hatch, all three rows of seats, you, and the firewall.

A quick story. Was once on a friend's boat that became disabled and we were under tow. The assisting vessel became antsy and began bumping up the tow speed to an unreasonable force level despite our signalling. The deck cleat began bulging the foredeck up and we realized it was going to fail so I grabbed a knife to cut the towline (first mistake was jumping in when it was not my vessel). Opened the windshield and leaned out for a quick slash I knew would instantly part the line (tow vessel was well over 100 feet off). Just as I had my hand out, the cleat tore free and the 2 lb chunk of stainless laid my knuckles bare as it launched. Before the pain hit, I recall the humming sound as it left - indicating a near speed of sound. It disappeared toward shore over a half mile away and we never saw a splash, so we assumed it made shore. I was extremely lucky I'd been trying to stay out of the trajectory (miscalculation as it came upward far more than I expected) and the cleat only grazed my hand, because if it had hit my hand I'd be typing with one hand today.

Since, I've seen a few "overbuilt" pulling systems fail and am always amazed at the forces unleashed. So, whatever you use and whatever the circumstances keep safety at the forefront even if you're supposed to be back in town for dinner reservations, want to get a straggler up a rocky face, or some other self imposed deadline looms. Recovery may be the most dangerous thing you ever do in your lifetime. Far better to leave someone stuck overnight than to place lives in danger trying to avoid it.

DougM
 
So, last winter I tried to pull a Tacoma out of a ditch, but the only place to pull from was an iced over road............I couldn't get enough traction to break a kite string........


And since Doug's point may have been lost in the depths of his novel....



THE FACTORY HOOPS ARE FINE!!!
 
:idea:
My 1988 Toyota sr5 pickup had a single OEM tow hook in the front that was the same design as this one. Wonder if it was the same hole spacing as an 80?

fyi in case anyone was curious -- the OEM hook I mentioned above does NOT fit. The hook hole spacing is too narrow.
 
The hitch actually makes an excellent rear recovery point with a stinger (inserts in hitch) and shackle such as Warn sells, and would be my preference for a massive stuck. That's what I carry and a couple years ago is what I used for a CNN satellite truck stuck in the mud (mild) I yanked.

It also helps keep the bumper free of parallel parking dings, I keep mine permanently planted in my reciever.... If you don't like the factory points, get one of these:

http://www.4by4connection.com/recshacbrac.html

I've used the shackle in the reciever on my 4R offroad and at Steamboat for tow duty with my 80, in fact I left the strap attached and snaked it thru the tailgate (see videos) for 4 days.

The best setup I've seen yet (IMO) is a class III+ reciever built into the front bumper with the shackle protruding only when offroading. The rest of the time, the black square plug was barely visible.

Since, I've seen a few "overbuilt" pulling systems fail and am always amazed at the forces unleashed. So, whatever you use and whatever the circumstances keep safety at the forefront even if you're supposed to be back in town for dinner reservations, want to get a straggler up a rocky face, or some other self imposed deadline looms. Recovery may be the most dangerous thing you ever do in your lifetime. Far better to leave someone stuck overnight than to place lives in danger trying to avoid it.

DougM

Doug, good points throughout. Somewhere I have a pic of a pickup truck with the chain that imbedded itself in the roof and hood after an unsuccessful snatch with a 1/2in chain. The damage was beyond comprehension, and very sobering. Here's hoping folks listen to your reason Doug, this shouldn't be a 'must do' to believe.

I take more passes on tows than I used to these days. More than a tug, I'll just donate the beach towel for the center tow wrap of someone elses rig...

ST
 
Yeah, it can be dicey helping people on a slick road, too. In the heat of the moment, it's easy to forget that the person landed there because of the slick conditions. And, uh...it's still slick and the next car to lose it due to the distraction of you would land, uh..well..right about on top of you.

Be safe.

DougM
 
I don't think anyone has mentioned the 4Plus option.

http://www.man-a-fre.com/parts_accessories/shacklerec.htm

My brother has a set mounted on the back of his 4Plus bumper on his 60. They look to be extremely beefy.

Of course, they need something to bolt to. . . .

Jared


amazingly, they suggest to use the pintle holes. But these are just the crossmember. May be OK for light towing but I don't think I'd use them for snatch recovery...
 
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I agree with Doug, these are more than adequate for recovery. As an example of how tough they are, I happened upon a stuck 2002 Chevy Z-71 half ton 4x4, buried in mud up to the axles in a ditch. For effect, I locked my axles and drove 360 degrees around them to "survey the situation.";p Then I backed up behind them and jumped out and attached their 50' of log chain. Suddenly, Beavis and Butthead in the Chevy couldn't find the keys to the Z-71. So I asked them if they wanted me to go ahead and pull it out or leave them. They laughed and said, "Yea right." So fully locked in low I gave myself about 3' of bump room and hit that chain...and drug the Chevy out of its hole and up the embankment and onto the road shoulder...while it was turned off and in park. So they've always worked okay for me.

Bad@$$!
 

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