Anyone running a full suspension replacement?

[CarcaineProblems]

Including UCAs and shocks? Not like the simple collar lift from Westcott, but the whole setup?

Toyota Land Cruiser 2024-CURRENT LAND CRUISER 250 LIFT KIT W/ FRONT & REAR 2.5 INCH DIAMETER ADJUSTABLE KING SHOCKS | TOTAL CHAOS FABRICATION

2024 Toyota Land Cruiser 250 front lift kit that includes TOTAL CHAOS upper control arms, adjustable KING 2.5" front coilovers and 2.5" rear shocks with remote reservoirs.

www.chaosfab.com

Seems like ALL THE MONEY!

 

[Jstawgn]

What is the question again?
Many are similar with 300 series and Sequoia. Some saya even 24 Tacoma are the same. Only the weight are different. Many suppliers already have the hardware and only need to select appropriate spring rate and fine tune the valving.

 

[CarcaineProblems]

Is anyone running a full suspension replacement?

That’s the question

Not asking about an 80 or 200 or 100. BTDT. Asking about a 250 or GX, hence the reason I posted it here

 

[Oakleyguy]

I've only seen folks running the Icon prototype setups right now.

Edit:
Specifically it was Ben from Dissent's truck. Also Slee looked to have a Radflo setup on the LC250 they just finished a couple weeks ago for Peterson Toyota.

 

[turbo8]

See @Dixon Santana thread

LC250/GX Suspension Thread

As aftermarket suspension options are slowly rolling out, figured it's best to get a specific thread for suspension modifications. If you have completed any suspension modifications please add to the thread. We'll start with my personal 250 (1958 Edition) Stock height measurements from the...

forum.ih8mud.com

 

[CarcaineProblems]

Thx @Oakleyguy and @turbo8 I will look there

Much appreciated

 

[NY2LA]

It's very hard to get info on suspension options right now. I've emailed most of the manufacturers, but the people answering the emails aren't able to answer basic questions. Even things like shock stroke and effect on the electronics/dash error messaging in the gX550 overtrail model, which has an electronic variable suspension... no answers. Seems you have to order blind right now without knowing the precise details and implications of what you're installing.

 

[Dixon Santana]

See @Dixon Santana thread

LC250/GX Suspension Thread

As aftermarket suspension options are slowly rolling out, figured it's best to get a specific thread for suspension modifications. If you have completed any suspension modifications please add to the thread. We'll start with my personal 250 (1958 Edition) Stock height measurements from the...

forum.ih8mud.com

Will have an update on overall impressions after a couple thousand miles soon.

 

[LCOceans]

I am very new to this but right now interested in either just leveling the front with the Toytec leveling kit or doing the Westcott 2.5 front and .75 rear preload collar lift with 285/70/18 tires. To me this would be great and probably overkill for my needs.
For those w/ experience here, is there anything detrimental to these two types of lifts? I read about CV joint stress and other drawbacks.

 

[OffRoadScott]

Westcott on one of their builds actually used TRD Pro Tundra shocks front/rear. The rear spring was an ICON spring and the collar for the lower front mount had to be custom made to fit over the mount on the lower control arm.


Westcott Land Cruiser TRD Pro shocks

 

[ryanjl]

I am very new to this but right now interested in either just leveling the front with the Toytec leveling kit or doing the Westcott 2.5 front and .75 rear preload collar lift with 285/70/18 tires. To me this would be great and probably overkill for my needs.
For those w/ experience here, is there anything detrimental to these two types of lifts? I read about CV joint stress and other drawbacks.

Westcott lifts artificially compress the spring to create lift. I wouldn't even use that kind of lift on a Tonka Toy.

 

[LCOceans]

Westcott lifts artificially compress the spring to create lift. I wouldn't even use that kind of lift on a Tonka Toy.

Ok got it. No good. So if I just want to fit 285/75/18's, slightly under 35" diameter, what is best to retain highway ride quality and not messing with gears, transmission, etc? Would that Toytec front leveling kit be OK? there is a video out there that makes it look easy and LC looks great to me.
Thanks,

 

[ryanjl]

There are people running that size tire on stock suspension.

Only caveat is you won't be able to stuff a full sized spare in the stock location.

 

[LCOceans]

There are people running that size tire on stock suspension.

Only caveat is you won't be able to stuff a full sized spare in the stock location.

OK thank you!

 

[LCOceans]

Westcott lifts artificially compress the spring to create lift. I wouldn't even use that kind of lift on a Tonka Toy.

Hello,
You obviously know what you're talking about and I do not. Can you tell me if a front leveling kit is better than this Westcott kit? I think you can fit 285/75/18 on the 250, but it looks so stuffed in there that I would rather have some space.
I would like a small lift without disturbing the suspension or modifying too much. Do you have any recommendations of what I should look at?
Thank you,

 

[ryanjl]

Hello,
You obviously know what you're talking about and I do not. Can you tell me if a front leveling kit is better than this Westcott kit? I think you can fit 285/75/18 on the 250, but it looks so stuffed in there that I would rather have some space.
I would like a small lift without disturbing the suspension or modifying too much. Do you have any recommendations of what I should look at?
Thank you,

I am no expert. I most recently come from Land Rover world, where I didn't even mess with springs and the suspension just levelled itself.

But my opinion on "levelling kits" is that, in a vacuum, they are an admission that you never intend on carrying any weight in the back.

I'm sure there are some versions that are better designed than others. And I'm sure there are entire systems that include stiffer springs in the back to accommodate heavier weight. There is someone on this subforum (forget who) who has been experimenting with a very small front levelling spacer that would probably be great. But I'd stay away from anything that goes too far.

EDIT: the @turbo8 spacer linked below is the one on this subforum I was thinking of that seems to be the best.

 

[cruisergreen]

Any Vendors with LC 250 aftermarket stuff yet?

While doing a little research, I found this. Formula 4x4 is getting ready to release an eKDSS compatible lift for the GR300. I imagine this will translate for the GX550. https://4x4show.com.au/Brisbane/blog/land-cruiser-300-series-gr-sport-lift-kit-coming-soon Funny: I was just thinking about...

forum.ih8mud.com

I have been testing out my 1/4" thick spacers over the last few days, no issues so far.

The spacers gave me an additional 1/2" of ride height. So with my larger tires I have 10" of ground clearance.

Any thicker spacer, you will probably want to limit your bump travel.

 

[tacoshawn]

I’ll share as well. Where the spacer is placed within the suspension stack matters.

Spacers that go between the shock/spring top hat (aka the coil over) and the vehicle chassis achieve lift by pushing down the entire coil over which can lead to all kinds of interference and damage at extreme travel. This is because the fundamental geometry is changed and the suspension travel and the bump stops have not.

Spacers that go within the coil over add preload, but do not change overall travel. So they don’t have the same problem with damage as the suspension is operating normally. Here moderation is the key. A plus of this approach, if you have not added weight, is a linear spring rate coil maintains that factory spring rate and behaves normally.

A big spacer within the stack-up can/will cause coil bind (where the coils touch each other on full compression). Coil bind = infinite spring rate = broke parts. So a moderate spacer inside the coil over can be OK. Frankly, this is how adjustable coil overs work when you adjust their preload collar.

People put the spacer on top of the coil top hat to save effort/costs of disassembling the coil.

Other options are slightly longer coils, slightly stiffer coils with factory shocks or go for a fully assembled and complete aftermarket coil over.

As my GX is an OT and I like the AVS I’m pondering stiffer spring/longer spring/preload spacer within the coil as my near term alternatives.

I am hoping the aftermarket eventually develops a high quality coil over that doesn’t throw codes. I’d do that as a long term when the factory struts wear out or if I put on a bunch of weight.

My $0.02. YMMV.

 

[NY2LA]

Spacers that go between the shock/spring top hat (aka the coil over) and the vehicle chassis achieve lift by pushing down the entire coil over which can lead to all kinds of interference and damage at extreme travel. This is because the fundamental geometry is changed and the suspension travel and the bump stops have not.

Spacers that go within the coil over add preload, but do not change overall travel. So they don’t have the same problem with damage as the suspension is operating normally. Here moderation is the key. A plus of this approach, if you have not added weight, is a linear spring rate coil maintains that factory spring rate and behaves normally.

Although I agree with some of your points, I think this part of the spacer discussion is too close to the type of argument that Westcott makes in its marketing. Frankly, I think it presents the worst case scenario (irresponsibly large, untested hardware) for a traditional spacer and the best-case scenario (driving on a smooth road) for the collar-style spacer that Westcott is selling.

Any change to one component to alter ride height will alter the "normal" operation of a whole bunch of components to some degree. But a small traditional spacer will change the angles of components only a little and won't cause enough stress or wear for most people if everything clears and nothing seizes or bottoms or tops out. On the other hand, the Westcott system immediately introduces loss of performance for everyone not just driving on gentle pavement. All the lift comes with an equivalent loss of downtravel. 2 inches of lift? Well, that's two inches less downtravel. You're also changing how the suspension compresses over bumps and likely reducing actual uptravel as a result. So, in my opinion, it's very misleading to represent that collar-spacer style approach as maintaining a factory ride. On a road without any bumps maybe--but not offroad. I personally wouldn't want to give up so much of my articulation on an 80K, high-end machine just to be a little higher up.

I agree with your interest, however, in finding the right aftermarket suspension for the GX550 OT. I'm currently looking at Radflo. They seem promising and offer a slightly extended travel shock in their product mix.

 

[tacoshawn]

Although I agree with some of your points, I think this part of the spacer discussion is too close to the type of argument that Westcott makes in its marketing. Frankly, I think it presents the worst case scenario (irresponsibly large, untested hardware) for a traditional spacer and the best-case scenario (driving on a smooth road) for the collar-style spacer that Westcott is selling.

Any change to one component to alter ride height will alter the "normal" operation of a whole bunch of components to some degree. But a small traditional spacer will change the angles of components only a little and won't cause enough stress or wear for most people if everything clears and nothing seizes or bottoms or tops out. On the other hand, the Westcott system immediately introduces loss of performance for everyone not just driving on gentle pavement. All the lift comes with an equivalent loss of downtravel. 2 inches of lift? Well, that's two inches less downtravel. You're also changing how the suspension compresses over bumps and likely reducing actual uptravel as a result. So, in my opinion, it's very misleading to represent that collar-spacer style approach as maintaining a factory ride. On a road without any bumps maybe--but not offroad. I personally wouldn't want to give up so much of my articulation on an 80K, high-end machine just to be a little higher up.

I agree with your interest, however, in finding the right aftermarket suspension for the GX550 OT. I'm currently looking at Radflo. They seem promising and offer a slightly extended travel shock in their product mix.

We are in violent agreement. I’d never go for 2 1/2 inches with a spacer lift, even if it is installed inside the coil over structure. An inch yes, 1 1/2 inches maybe.

You are also fully correct on an IFS lift. IFS lifts (adjustable preload collars on standard travel coil overs, adjustable spring perches, spacers) really are just changing the nominal position within the same range of travel. So 1” of lift = 1” of less down travel, zero-sum-game.

Will be interesting to see. I had both of my places in line (LC250 LC trim and GX) arrive the same week. The fact that the LC had a traditional suspension/swaybars did enter my thought pattern as a secondary consideration as did the better approach angles from the factory. I’m hoping the aftermarket with bring forward e-KDSS with AVS compatible lift solutions to the GX OT community.