Ford 7.3 vs. 6.0 need 'mud opinion (1 Viewer)

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My dad's construction company purchased 4, 6.0 for fleet service trucks back in 2006. The only thing that ever was done to them was fluid maintenance (oil , coolant, etc...). The coolant was drained every winter and replaced with new Ford Gold coolant. The trucks have over 250,000 miles and never had the EGR, oil cooler, or head gaskets replaced.

The key is replacing the coolant yearly. The coolant breaks down and the silicates fall out of suspension and plug up the oil cooler, which then takes out the EGR cooler, which then takes out the head gaskets. The high pressure oiling system needs some attention; new oil rail plugs, and the updated STC fittings will fix those issues.

Then the FICM will go out eventually. There are many sources to fix the power side of the FICM from going out.

Keep the oil changed every 5,000 and switch to 5W-40 to keep the injectors happy.

The 6.0 can be a nasty engine with SCT tuning and all the "fixes" done...
 
I don't see Toyota putting a cummins in their products...just purely on brand hype. I'm not an old school Toyota guy, but I'm not aware of where Toyota has ever run anything other than their own engine/driveline...not to say they may have based some designs on similar engines..(old school I-6).

If im not mistaken the 12H-T from the 60 series landcruiser is a diesel hino engine
 
The 6.0 can be a nasty engine with SCT tuning and all the "fixes" done...

The 6.0 is a beast when it runs... when it runs... problem is that is usually does not. Nasty doesn't even begin to describe what a tuned 6.0 can do... but... Even dealer serviced 100% bone stock 6.0's are unreliable. I've owned 3 and EVERY ONE HAD PROBLEMS. (1 highly modified, 2 bone stock) All had the same problems - EGR cooler, EGR valve, HPOP, head gaskets, and injectors - multiple sets of injectors. There is no fix, sorry to those who own one.

[I just deleted my tirade about how impossible it is to actually have a 6.0 diesel put to any real service]

My diesels are work trucks, not race cars. YMMV.
 
All had the same problems - EGR cooler, EGR valve, HPOP, head gaskets, and injectors - multiple sets of injectors. There is no fix, sorry to those who own one.

Have had an '04 350 since new, that had the cab off at 500 miles for the first round of head gaskets.

Since, have had an '05 and '06 6.0L swaps, and they're s***, too. Regardless of any deletes, immediate head work and studs, they all have failed catastrophically, as have all others of the earlier years, that I know of.

Biggest POS I've ever owned, period, and Ford lost my business in the way they handled.
 
I understand your position with the 6.0. It seems either people love them or hate them. I think when they first came out, the Ford tech's had no clue on how to work on them. It took a lot of failures to understand what was going on with them. It got a bad reputation from early on and it was hard to shake. However, now the problems are well understood and the fixes make it bulletproof. A term synonymous with the 6.0...

So all the bad reputations has made for some excellent deals to be had in the used market. With all the experience gained from using them in our fleet service, I kept my eye out for a good used one. Well one finally came to my attention. It had 80k, one owner older gentleman, and never was anything but stock. He was unloading it because of all the stories he's heard, not necessarily because the truck was giving him problems. So I offered 12k and he took it. Heck it even had the 125k warranty still enforce.



Monitering of this engine is key, IMHO. One must moniter the difference between the oil and coolant tempatures and if the difference is greater than 15*...it's time to replace the oil cooler. So I threw a moniter on and the difference was only 8*, score! I still did a coolant system flush and will be changing the coolant yearly. I keep an eye on the FICM voltage through my gauge and make sure the it never gets below 45v. One can moniter the high pressure oiling system through the ICP reading. Basically, if one knows what to look for, problems can be resolved before they become a problem.

I drive this to the cabin, when the :princess: comes and for hunting. Never have had an issue. However, if the signs show a future problem...I will fix it before it leaves me stranded...
 
Owned three 7.3l and two 6.0s. They both have their issues, but the 7.3s have run longer and better, with fewer repairs. Longest running one was at 394k when the body rusted off of it. Current one is at 215k. Due for glows, hpop and injectors tho....and of course brakes again.

Honestly had more issues with unit bearings, hubs, brakes, ball joints and electrical systems than with either motor.
 
My F350 rolled 450k last week.

While I can complain, and will until I utter my last breath about what a POS the 6.0L is, the truck is still solid and it's been worked harder than most out there.
 
I understand your position with the 6.0. It seems either people love them or hate them. I think when they first came out, the Ford tech's had no clue on how to work on them. It took a lot of failures to understand what was going on with them. It got a bad reputation from early on and it was hard to shake. However, now the problems are well understood and the fixes make it bulletproof. A term synonymous with the 6.0...

So all the bad reputations has made for some excellent deals to be had in the used market. With all the experience gained from using them in our fleet service, I kept my eye out for a good used one. Well one finally came to my attention. It had 80k, one owner older gentleman, and never was anything but stock. He was unloading it because of all the stories he's heard, not necessarily because the truck was giving him problems. So I offered 12k and he took it. Heck it even had the 125k warranty still enforce.

http://s1212.photobucket.com/user/snobdds/media/WP_20131228_002_zps434e77f1.jpg.html

Monitering of this engine is key, IMHO. One must moniter the difference between the oil and coolant tempatures and if the difference is greater than 15*...it's time to replace the oil cooler. So I threw a moniter on and the difference was only 8*, score! I still did a coolant system flush and will be changing the coolant yearly. I keep an eye on the FICM voltage through my gauge and make sure the it never gets below 45v. One can moniter the high pressure oiling system through the ICP reading. Basically, if one knows what to look for, problems can be resolved before they become a problem.

I drive this to the cabin, when the :princess: comes and for hunting. Never have had an issue. However, if the signs show a future problem...I will fix it before it leaves me stranded...


Does it tow anything heavy for any distance regularly...? It sounds like you have got the truck at a reasonable price...many ..many horror stories on the Ford 6.0 though.
 
I have my 2006 F350 super duty King Ranch, crewcap, longbed, 4x4 since new.

Drove it till 90K miles with a large gooseneck trailer behind it daily. Total load on max of pulling capacity.
When it was 2 years old I brought it with me when we went to live in the South Caribbean.

Drove it another 30K miles (till 120K) without any repairs !! Never had a key on it till then !! Regular maintenance only.

Then the horror started, all computers, turbo, censors, valves, oil cooler, EGR has been changed till now around 140K, injectors are still all the original ones !, but now the truck is more waiting on parts and repair then it drives, and we are starting on the second round of replacing parts.

I love the truck because I had so long so good records with it, and I don't like to see it go, but this way I can't continue.
The truck has never been in an accident. The problem here in the Caribbean is that there aren' goods mechanics are not available.

Parts prices are here because of transport and import duties about 60% more expensive then in the states. Same as import on new or used trucks are super expensive.

Reason for that is that I already acquired 4 FJ40's because of the simple technology and reliability. Our Chevy Avalanche hold up here pretty well so far.

To keep the truck my only option would be to swap everything to simple technology like the old 350 or 454 gas snuggler technology. So take everything out of all electronics and hang a big bock in it. Suspending the 4x4 probably. And probably make a floor shift.

If someone knows about any "stupid" swap like this that already has been done, or would have any knowledge on this plz let me know.

To install a cummins would coastwise and pricewise (import taxes etc) also by 4 times more road taxes than gasoline power trucks that we pay here not the most cost effective.


:cheers:
 
Bump :bounce:
 
IMO, there is no cost effective swap for a bad 6.0, especially in your country. As you said, you could hack in an all-GM drivetrain from an old vehicle, just to keep the truck on the road, but it would be a hack. Cummins swaps are expensive, partly due to the engine cost. It would be simpler with a pre 1998 Cummins engine, but still a ton of work. I'd fix your Ford (however you have to) and drive it.
 
Thanks Steve.

As for right now i have decided to continue doing that, but i don't know if over time parts etc will be still available etc.

Bringing a new one to the island is madness as the import taxes are charged over the checked price/value of the car/truck AND continental transport cost to port of exportation AND international transport costs from the States to here :flipoff2:.

On top of that the then charged import tax percentage is 23% on trucks, 34% on cars :bang:


:cheers:
 
I have a close friend who is a General Superintendent for a large construction company. He lives and dies with Ford trucks. That being said, as they replaced their 7.3 trucks with the 6.0 they were appalled at the maintenance issues directly related to the engine. The company owners began to look at other brands for their diesel needs. Ford does a lot of things right but Diesel engines are not one of them.
Truth be told, with the over pricing of diesel fuel, pricey maintenance, the second tank for urea additive and the impressive performance of the stock 6.2 gas you really have to take a closer look at perceived need for a diesel motor.
 
Bumping this thread back up.

Well I discovered I had a bed plate leak on the engine, otherwise running great. Since it was still under warranty, the cab was coming off to reseal basically the entire engine and timing covers. I spoke with the head diesel tech at ford who would be doing the work and asked if I could upgrade everything while it was apart. He was more than obliged and only charged out 5 hours of extra time to do all the upgrades, the warranty work paid for most of the cost. I also paid for all upgraded parts.

So the list of upgrades...

ARP studs
OEM head gaskets
High Pressure Oil STC fitting
Bullet proof EGR cooler
High pressure oil plugs and stand pipes
New Oil cooler
Fuel pressure regulator spring (blue spring)
Resealed all fuel injectors
Thermostat






Now I know that's a lot of stuff to upgrade. However all the updated parts are Ford (except EGR cooler), which must mean they know where they failed on the first go of the engine. I shouldn't have to worry about anything more with the engine.
 
wow, that's a log of work! very cool that most of this was covered under warranty.
 
The truck was 8 month At the mechanic, and finally it drove good, then stopped after one week again, don't know the issue yet,

Love to work on my Fj40's but this Ford technology just doesn't slice it for me.

As I don't want to sell the truck, have it since new, I would love to swap the 6.0 and all it's components to a 7.3 set up, and drive the truck many years longer.

Maybe there is a skilfull Ford mecanic that would want to come to this beautifull Caribbean paradise and do the change.

Or will try to get a carburated old model gas snugler with transmission etc in it. If someone has any info on that swap please let me know.

My opinion : It's a great great truck, maybe it works in the States to keep this running, outside it's close impossible.



:cheers:
 
So what is your actual problem? Don't let just some mechanic start working on your 6.0 if they have no idea how to work on a 6.0.

You need to start baselining out your motor. Get a scanguage II from bulletproofdiesel.com (they have the PID's already preloaded) and start noting your vitals. Get the following info for me and I can tell you where to start.

Engine oil tempature (EOT)
Engine coolant tempature (ECT)
IPR %
ICP number
VGT %

I have a 2006 as well. There are two systems that need to be looked at on a 2006, the High Pressure oil system and the coolant flow through the Oil cooler and EGR coolers.

The oil cooler is prone to plugging because the coolant breaks down (silicates fall out of suspension) if not changed frequently. The flow through the oil cooler becomes clogged which prevents coolant through the EGR cooler, as they're plumbed one after each other. This causes the the EGR cooler to rupture and the only place for coolant to go is the intake. Water does not like to be compressed and takes out the head gaskets. So to see if your oil cooler is plugged, drive at 55 mph on a flat road unloaded and see what your EOT and ECT are. If they're more than 15* apart then your oil cooler is plugged.

The high pressure oil system is the other system that needs addressed. Any leak will prevent power and will results in hot no starts and ruff idle. The easiest way to test is to hook up an air hose to the ICP sensor plug on the passenger side valve cover. If you hear air escaping, you know you have a leak. Or just replace everything as the parts have been updated by Ford for reliability. Replace your stand pipes, dummy plugs, STC fitting on the high pressure oil pump, and reseal the injectors.
 
My 7.3 been on the road for 11 and had been around since 1994 before that.

I'm a skeptic. I was in the industry and saw the 6.0 a full year before its release. Traditionally diesel guys got their diesels from diesel manufacturers. I'm not sold Ford can make a diesel engine to live up the reputation of the original Powerstroke or a Cummins for that matter. I want to be proven wrong. It would make my choice of future trucks a whole lot easier since I'm a Ford truck guy.
Im a skeptic to but I took the plunge and loving it 440 torque & 880 hp scary fast & supper fun and no smell & quiet
 

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