2L-TE Engine Mystery

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Crank Sensor

As far as I can tell the crank sensor is connected. Getting to it was a bit difficult. The air con rads are in a bad place.

If the crank sensor was toast would there be other symptoms?

Thanks,

Karl
 
As far as I can tell the crank sensor is connected. Getting to it was a bit difficult. The air con rads are in a bad place.

If the crank sensor was toast would there be other symptoms?

Thanks,

Karl

To be honest I dont know much about them ,except that if they are missing or not working they give the symptoms you mention.
Someone fitted a 2LTE pump onto a 2LT and had similar problems to you because it had no sensor.

You should have close to a litre a mintute coming out of the return hose at 2000 rpm from memory.

A good diesel shop would solve this in minutes;)
 
Roger that,

I may have to take a trip down island to Coombs Country Auto and get Glen to look at it.

Thanks,

Karl
 
To be honest I dont know much about them [...]
A good diesel shop would solve this in minutes;)

Nothing 2LTE can be solved in minutes. There are NO English language manuals available for diagnostics and the 1KZTE manual does not have the same test values as the 2LTE requires. The 1KZTE has somewhat better on-board diagnostics...

The 2LTE is a total POS, and I have to suffer working on these things almost daily in an attempt to keep the owners of them happy and rolling on down the road. The vehicles are decent, the engine is insufferable.

I have more experience with them locally than any other technician I know of, and I still feel like I know too little about the problems that people face and how to solve them. Glen at Coombs Country Autos is probably the only other guy (locally) that has a clue... as we chat back and forth quite a bit when it comes to these units in an attempt to learn from each others experiences.


~John
 
There are NO English language manuals available for diagnostics and the 1KZTE manual does not have the same test values as the 2LTE requires.


John have you tried getting a FSM manual from New Zealand? I remember coming across a number of web sites when I first got my Safari which provided translated copies of JDM FSMs.
 
John have you tried getting a FSM manual from New Zealand? I remember coming across a number of web sites when I first got my Safari which provided translated copies of JDM FSMs.

Nothing in English... I am trying to get one in Japanese. I have not tried New Zealand, but have had no luck in all the other countries I have tried. Did the poor Kiwis get cursed with these things as well?

I have lots of resources for the Safari and most other Toyotas....

~John
 
Nothing in English... I am trying to get one in Japanese. I have not tried New Zealand, but have had no luck in all the other countries I have tried. Did the poor Kiwis get cursed with these things as well?

The Kiwis were one of the biggest importers of JDMs in the developed world. They got a lot of well used Prados.

There are a number of Safari manuals free to download - including one of the FSM which I printed out into 5 big binders. Next time I will email it to a printer and have them do it.
 
Nothing 2LTE can be solved in minutes. There are NO English language manuals available for diagnostics and the 1KZTE manual does not have the same test values as the 2LTE requires. The 1KZTE has somewhat better on-board diagnostics...

The 2LTE is a total POS, and I have to suffer working on these things almost daily in an attempt to keep the owners of them happy and rolling on down the road. The vehicles are decent, the engine is insufferable.

I have more experience with them locally than any other technician I know of, and I still feel like I know too little about the problems that people face and how to solve them. Glen at Coombs Country Autos is probably the only other guy (locally) that has a clue... as we chat back and forth quite a bit when it comes to these units in an attempt to learn from each others experiences.


~John

The local shops here fix them with their eyes closed. I have a friend who has 240000 klms on his Surf,he has never had the head off and has no problems getting it serviced.
 
The local shops here fix them with their eyes closed. I have a friend who has 240000 klms on his Surf,he has never had the head off and has no problems getting it serviced.

The mechanics of the truck is dead simple...

The fuel injection diagnostics... even though I consider myself to be well-versed on it, still provides me with hours of head-scratching and "entertainment."


~John
 
The mechanics of the truck is dead simple...

The fuel injection diagnostics... even though I consider myself to be well-versed on it, still provides me with hours of head-scratching and "entertainment."


~John

I think the fuel injection shops here have had their japanese info translated. The shop I got to mumbled something about it one day ,but they keep it close to their chest.
 
A wealth of information

Thanks for all of this,

I have been wondering what the difference between a feed pump and a lift pump is? I'm guessing that the feed pump provides diesel to the lift pump which then pressurizes it for the injectors.

The other thing that I've noticed while test driving it is that for the first 1500-2000 rpm everthing seems to be right. When the revs get higher than that the throttle position doesn't seem to make any difference other than causing the transmission to downshift...

I've been looking on toyodiy.com for information about parts and assemblies and the error code 12 that I've found gives an indication for a timer control valve on the injection pump body. Is this valve electrically controlled or pneumatic? I think it might be central to what's going on.

Karl
 
I would say they are the same thing.

I think some vehicles may have a lift pump at the tank and a feed pump inside the injection pump but generally the names are interchangeable.
Toyotas just have the feed pump
 
The feed pump and lift pump are one and the same. It's built into the injection pump... If the lift pump is failing, then the injection pressure will be consistent or adequate. When the lift pumps goes on a non-electronically controlled rotary pump, the symptoms are lack of power at moderate and higher RPMs even though things are generally pretty good at lower RPMs.

Make sure there are no air leaks in your fuel system! Put clear hoses to and from the injection pump and the spill tube to the return line and look for anything more significant than the odd air bubble.

The timer control valve is an electromagnetic valve that is part of the injection pump. The spill control valve (it's round and black and sits are the rear of the injection pump) spills fuel to alter injection volume.

The only other thing to try is the Throttle Position Sensor (TPS) as it feeds info to the injection pump via the computer. It does have some effect on tranny shift points, but that is otherwise controlled by the TV cable (kickdown cable).

In reality, the injection pump gets all the throttle position information (from the sensor) by way of the computer. It's really a drive by wire system, but somewhat archaic when compared to more modern designs. The throttle plate is there for EGR purposes primarily... there is another small butterfly valve that opens and closes immediately upon sensing throttle position changes from the base (closed throttle or idle) positions - also EGR related.

I hope I'm not creating more confusion here... really, when these things go wrong, do the basics first (air and fuel filters, check the TPS for a smooth waveform on a lab scope) and then install a new injection pump when all the more basic diagnostic stuff fails to make any improvement.

You can also check the injection timing with a diesel pulse tester and a timing light, but without known good base values it will only tell you if you're close or not. The timing is set by the computer from input values that come from the crank angle sensor and the injection pump - the only things that can go wrong with the timing are being out on the timing belt or the pump being installed with the marks not lined up (between the block and the pump body - which are not likely to go out). The computer is the only other factor in the equation...

In reality, all these tests take time (and cost money). For the cost of the parts, and the amount of labour involved, replacing the pump is something that should be considered fairly early on. These pumps are considered to be a throw-away item, though there are a few (rare) shops with the ability to service them. However, the cost of repair would run more than the cost of replacement with a new unit.


~John
 
John, does the Denso injector pump on this engine also have a small mesh screen inside the banjo fitting on the intake line to the pump? The Zexel pump on the Safari (also a similar Bosche VE pump design) has a screen in there which has been know to cause the same issue the poster has noted. It gets clogged over time or soon after using a higher concentration biodiesel or a fuel system cleaner. The solution is fairly easy. Open up the fitting. Reach in with a dental pic and pull out the screen. Clean it and then put it all back together.
 
Thanks John and John

Thanks for this guys. I'll try to do some digging.

I did find, on the delica.ca, website some talk about having to reset the timing for the pump if you're changing the timing belt on a L300. Is this the same for the Surf?

Karl
 
There's no resetting the timing if the marks are lined up. You can do a relearn on the computer, but it is hit and miss if it does anything at all...

Is your EGR valve closing properly?

The 4D56T engine (Delica L300) is a totally different animal than the 2LTE...

~John
 
try a 12V feeder pump and see if that helps...

John, thanks for posting up about the crank sensor, i wondered what that one was for...

i have a 2LTE that i am stripping due to dead crank, if any parts are needed just let me know.

best of luck gettign it back on the road correctly.
 
Venturi Assembly

Hi guys,

Thanks for all of this.

I'm going to check the TPS with a check I found on the Aussie site for Toyota Surfs.

I've been trying to check the EGR and haven't noticed anything amiss.

There is a set screw on an actuator on the venturi assembly, right beside the TPS. It seems to move freely, but I can't find any reference to it in the assembly diagrams I have. What exactly is it?

Karl
 
Timing Belt

Hi all,

I've checked the TPS and it comes out within spec.

I have another question. Is it possible the timing belt is out by a tooth or two. I found a post on another site www.hiluxsurf.co.uk that stated:

TCV is bottom rear of pump and can be replaced. Very expensive though. TCV faults can also be caused by other things such as incorrect timing caused by a timing belt that may have jumped a tooth or two.

Because this whole thing started with the crankshaft pulley breaking at the crankshaft key is it possible that the violence of that caused the timing belt to jump a cog? What would that do to the performance? If it caused it to jump wouldn't it retard the timing of fuel injection and basically screw up the ECU in doing what it's supposed to do?

Karl
 
New Problem!

Hi everyone,

It appears that the timing belt jumped at cog on the crank shaft and that is what has been causing the problem.

I now have a new problem. The crank pulley, which was just replaced because it had been broken, has a crack in the key way. Apparently the replacement key wasn't quite wide enough and the play has caused a fatigue crack through the keyway. We're going to attempt a weld of the crack and then sweating a collar on the outside of the pulley to prevent it from happening again.

Anybody had the same problem?

Klemwild
 

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