2021 Powertrain Upgrade and 200 Series Refresh (2 Viewers)

[silverfstop]

I just got a note from a friend at Toyota. The 2021 LC will remain a 200 series and get a refresh. The biggest change will be a new powertrain, reported to be a 3.5L Turbo V6. 415hp/445lb-ft, 10 speed AT and electric power steering.

Should be interesting to see how this pans out - I think we'd all like to see better fuel econ for sure!

 

[razzyrazz]

Should be interesting. Looks like there were reports/rumors of this back in August that it would move to the turbo V6 that is in the LS. We'll see...

 

[Markuson]

Well thank goodness we can all stop speculating now...

But seriously... Honestly wonder sometimes if Mr. Toyota crawls underneath the 200 again...looks up at its insane, piggish strength...& says in Japanese—



Another 12 years to the full 300 redo?

 

[M1911]

Electric power steering means that it will likely have lane keeping assist.

 

[Joshuak172]

Electric power steering means that it will likely have lane keeping assist.

Yup, tss 2.0 finally.

 

[Taco2Cruiser]

As a guy who built a 512hp at the rear wheels Tacoma with a 4.0L, I’m happy I have the 5.7.

If that new drivetrain is coming, it will be great for 95% of its owners.

But when loaded down with over a thousand pounds of off road mods, people, and supplies. There is...

(And I say this as loving how engineers make things actually better at the time, and hating the line “well, that’s how I’ve always done it)

There is no replacement for displacement.

So from Toyota’s perspective, yeah, dump that 5.7 and let’s gets some small displacement forced induction action!

Hope Toyota can figure out LSPI.

 

[GordJ]

I think we'd all like to see better fuel econ for sure!

Yeah, ‘cause nothing says economy like 415 horses. Lol


Taco- I’m with you. I don’t see myself towing my trailers with a V-6

 

[Chocolate]

Does this mean....



























300 SERIES REVEALED

 

[Chocolate]

As a guy who built a 512hp at the rear wheels Tacoma with a 4.0L, I’m happy I have the 5.7.

If that new drivetrain is coming, it will be great for 95% of its owners.

But when loaded down with over a thousand pounds of off road mods, people, and supplies. There is...

(And I say this as loving how engineers make things actually better at the time, and hating the line “well, that’s how I’ve always done it)

There is no replacement for displacement.

So from Toyota’s perspective, yeah, dump that 5.7 and let’s gets some small displacement forced induction action!

Hope Toyota can figure out LSPI.

To your point:

Silverado 2.7T gets worse mileage than 300 pound heavier 5.3L V8 model

2019 Chevrolet Silverado Four-Cylinder – Not More Fuel-Efficient Than V-8

 

[Sedalia]

There are very race cars and powerful semi tractors that have 6 cylinders. Cylinder count alone doesn't mean much to me. Turbo would be nice for us who live at altitude. We lose a lot of power here otherwise. My other cars, truck, tractor, etc. are turbos because it makes a big difference.

 

[bloc]

There are very race cars and powerful semi tractors that have 6 cylinders. Cylinder count alone doesn't mean much to me. Turbo would be nice for us who live at altitude. We lose a lot of power here otherwise. My other cars, truck, tractor, etc. are turbos because it makes a big difference.

Yes all kinds of vehicles use six cylinder engines. You probably know you shouldn't tow with a race car. Those semi tractors you speak of are often 2-2.5x the displacement of a 5.7 (let alone a 3.5T) and only make 25-50% more horsepower. Plus.. they are DIESEL. An absolutely fundamental difference.. and one of the biggest differences is in how well suited each application is to operating near it's rated horsepower for any length of time.

While I trust toyota above all others to do their testing on a platform like the landcruiser, comparing a small displacement turbo V6 to anything that burns diesel is apples to oranges.

 

[Tripledave]

Thumbs down on the v6, forced induction or not. IMHO, flagship vehicles the size and weight of an LC deserve a v8.... Smoothness and torque from a naturally aspirated v8 contributes to the overall "feel" of the LC and I am certainly happy to own the current version.

 

[Sedalia]

True, which is why I have a turbocharged 7.3l F-450 for pulling stuff. It gets nearly as good fuel mileage as the LC. Here in the foothills and valley, We lose about 20% HP, and more in the mountains, compared to lowlanders.

 

[Markuson]

There are very race cars and powerful semi tractors that have 6 cylinders. Cylinder count alone doesn't mean much to me. Turbo would be nice for us who live at altitude. We lose a lot of power here otherwise. My other cars, truck, tractor, etc. are turbos because it makes a big difference.

I think @Taco2Cruiser referred to displacement...not cylinder count.

 

[c4xplsv]

We had an f150 with their 3.5l EcoBoost. It was always in boost no matter how you drove (unless going down hill). It never did better than a comparable V8 on fuel economy. In fact, it probably did worse in some cases. The small turbos did well with low end torque but ran out of steam at the top. Those small v6’s are working really hard....

I think it is a marketing thing. Not denying the value in turbo technology nor am I discounting the ability to “tune” the trucks for better performance. From what I’ve seen they burn just as much fuel with little more than a 20-30hp gain over the v8 they replaced.

 

[Taco2Cruiser]

I think @Taco2Cruiser referred to displacement...not cylinder count.

Thanks Mark. Displacement means exactly that.

Personally (if I HAD to go less than 5.7) I would of liked to see a something in the low 5 liter range, preferably inline 6 cylinder. Then force induced for heavy uphill pulls. Yet it would still have the grunt to operate fine without a turbo for most of the time.

We might be seeing the next break in Land Cruiser ownership?

40/60 guys love simple, and didn’t want new electronics.
80 guys love solid axles, and didn’t want IFS
100 guys loved a slightly boxier body, and didn’t like the bubble (I really like the look of the 100 way better than my 200)
200 guys may want a large displacement motor, and didn’t want small turbos
300 guys may want to just burn some hydrocarbons, and didn’t want fully electric
400 guys maybe want body on frame, and didn’t want unibody and IRS

One thing is for sure, in stock form (as that is the only way to compare) overall, Toyota will make the next Land Cruiser better.

The next generation will be just as or more capable off road, on road, hauling stuff, and doing it for decades without serious failures.

So I won’t be upset or surprised when whatever comes next is better. And I won’t bash it just because I don’t have one.

I mean come on, if we wanted it to where only our old Land Cruiser were worth a damn, we’d all go buy Land Rovers.

No one wants that...

 

[M1911]

When Ford brought out the EcoBoost engines in the F-150, lots of folks predicted that they would be a flop, claiming that traditional truck buyers want V8s. But the best selling engine option for the F150 is the now EcoBoost 2.7l V6. A friend of mine has an F-150 SuperCrew with the 2.7. He loves it, and gets far better fuel economy than I do.

I like everything about the 5.7 except for the fuel economy. If Toyota can improve LC fuel economy with a turbo V6, I won’t rule it out.

 

[cc93cruiser]

Bring back a bigger displacment 6 inline....

 

[Taco2Cruiser]

When Ford brought out the EcoBoost engines in the F-150, lots of folks predicted that they would be a flop, claiming that traditional truck buyers want V8s. But the best selling engine option for the F150 is the now EcoBoost 2.7l V6. A friend of mine has an F-150 SuperCrew with the 2.7. He loves it, and gets far better fuel economy than I do.

I like everything about the 5.7 except for the fuel economy. If Toyota can improve LC fuel economy with a turbo V6, I won’t rule it out.

I say this as not being condescending or mean. Just continuing a friendly conversation:

But the vast majority of American truck buyers use their trucks as cars. They tow or haul maybe once a month or so. Really it is a lifestyle vehicle.

For the few that are always in tow/haul situations. And that includes towing and hauling off road modifications like steel armor and off road tires. There is little to no fuel economy benefits combined with heavy strain on a little engine operating at a constant near max capacity for long periods of time.

I was lucky for years to have government leased trucks and turn them over every 18 months. Fords, Chevys, Dodges, Toyota’s. Put four grown men, their gear, and a trailer in a 3.5 ecoboost, that thing was the second most gutless drivetrain I ever used in 20 years. Put two guys and gear in it, awesome drivetrain.

And companies like Ford knows this. If you want to actually use your truck for a truck, you buy a F-250. If you want a truck instead of a car, you buy a F-150. One is not better than the other. Just different tools for different applications.

 

[40Man]

A 3.5 turbo engine is going to work much harder at higher speeds than a 5.7. A turbo may be good and reliable, but I would still bet on the 5.7 for longevity.

Also, you'll be running premium fuel with a turbo which will likely exceed the cost of any savings due to increased mpg (if any).