1984 FJ60 Engine Sputtering, Bucking - FIXED!!! (2 Viewers)

[Landpimp]

On the charcoal canister. Look at the small elbow hose on the tank, it's probably torn.

And you can try swapping the hoses on the top of the canister to see if it helps, it often does.(my 60 has been like that for a few years now,)

ICS....the failure point is normally inside the emission computer, not the ICS itself. By grounding it to the carb, you bypass the computer. The ICS grounds/switches in the computer, the old soldered joints goes bad at about 30 years.

There is also an o ring on the ICS that may be gone/torn...not sure what issues it would cause but it's something to check.

 

[morganism]

I would go back and vacuum clear the diaphram on the EGR valve again, classic symptoms of carbon buildup clogging.

Before you change anything else, take a piece of wire, and ground your ignitor pack to a solid bolted ground. It is the aluminum finned pack on the top of your coil. Has a ground to one corner already, clean another case screw, attach the new ground wire, and enjoy easy starts, brighter lights, better mpg, smoother running, and peace of mind... That ignitor pack is supposed to ground thru the coil mounting bolts, and those get manky easy, and rarely get touched (unless you are clearing oil out of your engine compartment.)

 

[Gretsch]

OK I went and got some gas this weekend for the Toyota and I heard NO swoosh when opening the cap. I must have gotten confused with my son's little pickup truck. I looked breifly at the Charcoal canister but did not see anything obvious wrong with it. I did not have too much time to mess with it (finishing up some house painting), so I did not get to try the hose swap idea. I'll try and get to it here in the next few days.

The ICS should now be jumper grounded properly @NeverGiveUpYota. I can remove the jumpers and have the truck stall at idle. In troubleshooting the idle thing, I did adjust the idle set screw to get it to idle a little faster. It seemed to be running at times too low so now I got it dialed in to idle around 600-700 RPM. But disconnecting the jumpers stalls it. It tries to run for a bit but eventually gives up and dies. 2F is amazing. Tries its best to run even without fuel. Atl least mine does.....once I get it started.

I will try the ignitor pack grounding idea as well.

I appreciate the suggestions and will try and get some time to investigate things more and report back. Thanks all.

 

[NeverGiveUpYota]

@Robert Franzke... man, 600-700 is GREAT! If you can truly get it to idle there then whats the problem other than the stalling? So the issue is upon restart after sitting for some time she struggles to catch and keep steady? You are getting fuel into your carb right? Have you checked the level in the sight glass on the side facing the fan?
Have you confirmed that you do not have a manifold leak? Use carb spray (no brake) and spritz little shots around the top edge of each intake port. If your RPMs rise and steady out then you have a leak.
What happens if you simply bring the idle up to say 800 or 900?
And have you checked your timing?

 

[NeverGiveUpYota]

And if you try that ignitor ground, please post me pictures. Electrical stuff tends to make me nervous and jumpy so be my guinea pig.

 

[OSS]

The last issue (I recall) was that the engine suddenly was hard to start. The charcoal canister and tank venting have no influence on starting the engine. Your fuel cut solenoid has been problematic since the beginning and the root problem isn't the emissions computer.

My guess is that the fuel cut solenoid valve is sticking every once in a while. You proved this to yourself in the past when you powered it up/off several times and eventually it started moving.

Replace the valve.

 

[NeverGiveUpYota]

Also I just came across @Slow Left and his words attached to this page... I need to test my own Ignitor as I have had weird tach issues too. fuel control solenoid, emission control relay

 

[NeverGiveUpYota]

The last issue (I recall) was that the engine suddenly was hard to start. The charcoal canister and tank venting have no influence on starting the engine. Your fuel cut solenoid has been problematic since the beginning and the root problem isn't the emissions computer.

My guess is that the fuel cut solenoid valve is sticking every once in a while. You proved this to yourself in the past when you powered it up/off several times and eventually it started moving.

Replace the valve.

Some carb gurus say the aftermarket FCS from china (CCOT sells the replacements for $10) aren't very dependable. So what then?

 

[OSS]

When it was available from Toyota it cost $195. My choice now would be buy a used carb for cheap parts to strip or an aftermarket solenoid from Australia (that's probably made in China).

Search 21062-61060

 

[Gretsch]

So had a second before getting my kid to school so I whipped up a ground wire for the ignitor. Truck had been sitting overnight. Got in and tried starting it up. It seems to have made no difference unfortunately. Took about a minute to get it started. Good idea but did not help me here. Here is a pic of what I did:

Hopefully you can see how I did this. I also got some carb cleaner and with the engine running sprayed some along the intake manifold gasket. I did not detect any change in engine RPM. Hopefully that rules out intake leaks. Engine runs great after starting. Also, just for reference, I included a pic of how I have the ICS jumpered. As I said it idles fine now.....once it starts.

Thanks again for all the help figuring this out.

 

[Landpimp]

I did say "normally" its not the ICS itself

you can pull the ICS off, hook it to power and see if it works.

The last issue (I recall) was that the engine suddenly was hard to start. The charcoal canister and tank venting have no influence on starting the engine. Your fuel cut solenoid has been problematic since the beginning and the root problem isn't the emissions computer.

My guess is that the fuel cut solenoid valve is sticking every once in a while. You proved this to yourself in the past when you powered it up/off several times and eventually it started moving.

Replace the valve.

 

[NeverGiveUpYota]

Cool, thanks for the photos. What’s your temps in that area of TX right now? Choke IS pulled? Do you pump the gas a few times before turning the key? I’m in CT, it’s maybe 34 out there Now and if I went out I know for a fact even w/ choke pulled it would take some pleading.

 

[Gretsch]

Temps in Texas now are fairly chilly for this part of the world. Mid 40's. Truck is garage kept so prolly warmer in there. Using the choke to start never seems to work for me. I pump gas usually like twice then go. Since the starting issue I have been pumping like 6 times. Still takes a bit. Could be just cold but was happening before the winter weather hit here (took forever this year).

I went to dealer today to see about some other parts I needed and checked to see if they had an ICS for sale. The clerk says they did not sell it separate....came as part of carb....which she says is disco'ed now. I thought those were still readily available. Is that a new development or is it true the aisin carbs are no longer available from Toyota? I saw CCOT has an aftermarket ICS available. Any other options for sourcing just the ICS?

 

[NeverGiveUpYota]

I would say not pulling the choke could be a big reason your feeling the truck is taking too long to start. Try as I said on a cold start and then see how it is tho I do understand this was more about restart after sitting for a bit.

 

[NeverGiveUpYota]

Find a used ICS.... or buy as @OSS said, a core carb w/ one attached.

 

[Gretsch]

Has anyone used one of the aftermarket ICS' available. Looking at the one from SOR. Seems solid but wondered if anyone has had experience with them.

Also, I guess then its true that the carbs are no longer available from Toyota US. Can someone confirm?

 

[Gretsch]

My current tach reading at idle just FYI:

Look right?

 

[Infinity00]

Yep, mines a little lower since I have my idle set closer to 650, but that looks fine. A little over 3/4, so maybe idling close to 800. That’s where a lot of people seem to like it

 

[NeverGiveUpYota]

Has anyone used one of the aftermarket ICS' available. Looking at the one from SOR. Seems solid but wondered if anyone has had experience with them.

Also, I guess then its true that the carbs are no longer available from Toyota US. Can someone confirm?

Not avail but folks have them. I posted a wanted ad and was responded to in a few days. Post one up. Someone will respond. If your buying it as a core you could spend $75-200 or rebuilt for $200-400 potentially.
CruiserYard in TX has a bunch. They had them listed for about $150 in the classifieds here on mud a few weeks ago.

 

[Gretsch]

Hello all, back from the dead. So I was reading through some threads today on the ICS system. Seems there are drawbacks to running the carb ground setup I have done to get my truck to idle, some of them with potentially damaging effects to other parts of the truck. Although the truck has been running fine (no dying, bucking at HWY speeds, still rough starting at times), this information has motivated me to find the reason this fix works on my truck and get it to run correctly as designed.

In my reading I came across something interesting (at least I thought it was) that I wanted to run by everyone. It seems that while the Emissions Computer controls the ICS using a ground at the computer board, there is a vacuum switch which sends signals the EC uses to determine if it should open or close the ICS. This is information I was unaware of. In getting more and more familiar with this truck, I realize now that its missing quite a few components from the desmog job done on it. I looked through a troubleshooting guide for the ICS system and one of the things it talks about is this vacuum switch and cutting off vacuum to it to help test the ICS system. The pic in the guide shows what looks to be a switch hanging off the carb mounting or maybe the intake manifold. Hard to tell. I don't have anything like that switch there. There is something bolted to the inner fender well on here that has a electrical wire and a vacuum hose attached to it. Could this be the vacuum switch they are talking about? Either this is it and its been relocated from its factory position, or its missing from my truck altogether and this thing on the fender is something else entirely. I have attached the guide photo I am referring to here as well as a shot of my truck and this phantom vacuum switch. I would appreciate it if folks could confirm for me that there is indeed some type of vacuum switch which feeds signals to the EC so it can control the ICS on/off, as well as take a look at the thing on the fender of my truck to see if its the switch I am talking about or this is something else I am unaware of. Also, if this vacuum switch is broken or malfunctioning, could this cause the EC to not open the ICS correctly? Thanks in advance and sorry for resurrecting this dead thing.

ICS troubleshooting pic:

Pic of my truck's suspected relocated vacuum switch circled in red: