1982 BJ-42 Towing Capacity??

[canucksafari]

Looks like we are getting to a laugh intermission in this thread.

I tried...

 

[crushers]

i enjoyed them...

I tried...

 

[Dougal]

oh my god, you designed a tow bar?!? WOW.
was the one from princess auto not good enough for him? gee, must take some real brain power to design one. hitch, 2 bars and a couple mounts... braggin rights for sure.

interesting blanket statement on RWD cars and trucks.
so... a 1970 dodge 1/2 ton share the same tranny, brakes and gearing as the old 70 dodge coronet but not the same in your books...got yah. i can see your age beginning to show.

Damn I forgot about the model T's too. I'm really showing my age here.

There are no off-the-shelf towbar solutions for heavy commercial vehicles and I'm afraid the design includes reading standards and performing calculations.
So I don't expect you to relate or understand.

The suspension is a little different between a car and a pickup truck, which results in greatly different stability.
And outside north america a half ton pickup isn't a truck.

Likewise, a 2wd and 4wd version of the same pickup usually have a very different suspension setup (spring and damper rates, available travel etc).

Go on, give the 40 series owners another kick in the ribs.

 

[canucksafari]

Lets see we got bait, quite a few hooks and lots of line. I got it, this must be the diesel fishing thread?

BTW, I got a nice hitch custom designed and built here for under $300 (wiring included). Said it would tow 7500 lbs but said that 5500 lbs would be comfortable. Not sure if he was an engineer or a mechanic. Sure did handle the mig nicely. He must have been a welder... .

 

[ohrly?]

I have 2 bj40's and on the papers it says the car weighs 1560kg.
Max load load (car included) 2300kg meaning aprox 640kg loading in the car.
And max load pulling (also car included) 6300kg

This stands also on the ID plate of the car.
This is in Belgium

My plate says that my 40 weights 5300 pounds, which is about 2300 kg's I believe.

 

[joshoisasleep]

dont over load i flattend out my old springs(went from saggin to flat and fawked) by loading the bj60(N/A at this time) with too much lumber (3500lbs approx) the truck woulndt go over 90km/hr in 4th but the truck had no problem on hills slowed to 60-70km/hr these trucks haul ass but ill never overload my truck again

During my 3 months of driving my donor BJ60 (also NA, and at that time 4spd/3.7's) I filled it so full to the ceiling of lumber the passenger seat was even full and lumber was sticking a foot or two out the back. I was going to say that I had no problems with the springs but actually thinking about it, it might have done the same thing but I just didn't notice/care. It drove maybe a bit slower on the uphills... I dunno it was hard to tell.

You can quote all the website links/book knowledge/wizard of oz/whoever you like, but if that was 3500lbs as Big Blue thinks then my 3b had no problem with it in BC.


I'm sure my current setup weighs more than 1000lbs over stock!! Before all my turbo fiddling the engine didn't complain at all or feel much different than normal even when full of passengers on top of all my gear. That was enough weight to make my suspension sit almost flat (62 springs in excellent shape reinforced with added leafs). IMO altitude is the only thing that can easily knock the wind out of a 3b... a little weight means nothing.

Actually that's why I'm so frustrated with my turbo setup... above 6000 feet I can't imagine having lived without it, but at sea level I preferred it NA because I could blast uphill grades fully loaded (as above) in fifth against the wind with my sail-like roof rack without seeing any increase in temps as I do now.

Sorry I get defensive of my engine... I owe it plenty . When you live in your car you get weird like that - my girlfriend actually gets jealous.


I think some people may be right about the 40's though. They're shorter(/lighter?) than a 60 and unless it had big meats or some weight in it I wouldn't tow TOO heavy...

 

[freebie]

???

Texas?
So do you wish you never asked??

 

[crushers]

LOL!!
so when you make a blanket statement comparing trucks and RWD cars BUT it is only dealing with the ones in your head?
that a truck, designated such by transport canada, is not a truck but what? a car with a tray on the back?

that a BJ40 capacities, although similar to the truck, IS truck but a 1/2 ton truck isn't a truck? OKAY, you lost me on that one.

lets compare:
BJ42 .....................................................F-150 (1/2 ton)
90" wheel base ......................................126" wheel base
92 hp ...................................................202 hp (2wd) to 300 hp (4WD)
800 lb payload ......................................2990 lbs
8000 lbs tow rating................................. 2400 to 5200 lbs (2WD) 6300-7200 (4WD) depending on configuration
partial boxed frame - full length frame......fully boxed - full length frame
(BJ42-C channel from rear front spring hangers back including rear cross where reciever bolts on)
drum brakes........................................ 4 wheel disc
2 7/8" wide spring pack........................ 3" wide spring pack

now explain to me how an engineer in one part of the world can rate a BJ42 to tow safely 8000 lbs of trailer with a C channel frame and drum brakes and yet another engineer in another part of the world can rate a fully boxed disc brakes F150 at a MAX 7200 lbs? do you engineers have a world wide formula that you have to work from or not? or do you just pull this s*** out of your ass to satisfy what ever the 'paycheck' wants?


after all the 40s i have owned over the years and the 2 sitting in the back yard i guess you have to be right. after all the book says you are.

in closing, if you feel that cooling, engine torque, tranny strength, wheel base length, weight of tow vehicle and numerous other factors are not important in tow rating calculations but frame, brakes and diff gears are the only factors then so be it. (if that is the case then lord help that gent that bought that tow bar design from you)

Go on, give the 40 series owners another kick in the ribs.

 

[joshoisasleep]

mind you the F 150 isn't a truck (according to your post above) so then it is a glorified 2WD car (which you do not accept as having any tow ability either).

I think what he meant wasn't that trucks are cars in other countries, but that in many countries the word "truck" only applies to large commercial goods transport trucks. An F150 might be called a "pickup" but if you say truck people think of something with 18 wheels. There is a differentiation which although confusing, is relevant to this argument because people are comparing "cars and trucks" and as this is an international forum, people are getting confused.

 

[crushers]

now, lets take this discussion one step further.

BJ42 ...................................................2008 70 series
90" wheel base ....................................117" wheel base
92 hp ..................................................151 hp (2wd) to 300 hp (4WD)
drum brakes........................................ 4 wheel disc
leaf spring........................................... leaf spring
4000kg tow rating................................ 3500kg tow rating

HOLD ON,DID I READ THIS RIGHT?!?!
the new 70 series with a longer wheel base, stronger frame, disc brakes, 4.30 gearing has a LOWER tow rating than the old 40 series with a shorter wheel base, 'C' channel frame, 4.11 diffs and drum brakes?!?!

some engineer must of screwed up on this one...
http://www.toyota.com.au/TWR/content/static/35224.pdf

 

[crushers]

you might very well be right...
in Oz they only sell the pickup as a cab and chassis according to:
http://www.toyota.com.au/TWR/content/static/35224.pdf

but once the tray is added, what is this unit called?

here an 18 wheeler is a tractor and trailer... JFYI

I think what he meant wasn't that trucks are cars in other countries, but that in many countries the word "truck" only applies to large commercial goods transport trucks. An F150 might be called a "pickup" but if you say truck people think of something with 18 wheels. There is a differentiation which although confusing, is relevant to this argument because people are comparing "cars and trucks" and as this is an international forum, people are getting confused.

 

[crushers]

found the answer jeep/4X4 or chassis model

i will correct my post

 

[kim]

Lets see we got bait, quite a few hooks and lots of line. I got it, this must be the diesel fishing thread?

BTW, I got a nice hitch custom designed and built here for under $300 (wiring included). Said it would tow 7500 lbs but said that 5500 lbs would be comfortable. Not sure if he was an engineer or a mechanic. Sure did handle the mig nicely. He must have been a welder... .

A welder, eh?

LOL.

 

[joshoisasleep]

...the new 70 series with a longer wheel base, stronger frame, disc brakes, 4.30 gearing has a LOWER tow rating than the old 40 series ...

Back when that 40 series truck was rated, were seatbelts mandatory? Not saying which one's better for towing, just that the rating systems might have changed a bit over the years... safety might be a bit more important now.

In your truck comparisons you don't show weight of the trucks. Maybe the F150 is lighter? I would think that with the bed empty it would be certainly lighter in the back and so a bit less safe for towing... for the same reason that pickup trucks are not so good in the snow.

 

[Dougal]

found the answer jeep/4X4 or chassis model

i will correct my post

No you still don't get it.

Here's a simple tutorial using the toyota family.

Car = Camry, Corolla etc.
Offroad passenger vehicle (SUV to the yanks) = rav4, highlander, 80/100/200 series landcruisers etc.
Pickup/Utility = hilux, landcruiser 70 cab/chassis etc regardless of deck fitted.
Van = toyota hiace etc.
Light Truck = Toyota Dyna etc
Heavy Truck = Hino 700 series etc.

 

[Dougal]

now, lets take this discussion one step further.

BJ42 ...................................................2008 70 series
90" wheel base ....................................117" wheel base
92 hp ..................................................151 hp (2wd) to 300 hp (4WD)
drum brakes........................................ 4 wheel disc
leaf spring........................................... leaf spring
4000kg tow rating................................ 3500kg tow rating

HOLD ON,DID I READ THIS RIGHT?!?!
the new 70 series with a longer wheel base, stronger frame, disc brakes, 4.30 gearing has a LOWER tow rating than the old 40 series with a shorter wheel base, 'C' channel frame, 4.11 diffs and drum brakes?!?!

some engineer must of screwed up on this one...
http://www.toyota.com.au/TWR/content/static/35224.pdf

Australia uses the same size tow balls as NZ. They're only available currently to a max 3500kg rating.

If you were to fit a ringfeder then you may be able to tow more, but toyota don't make a genuine parts towbar to fit a ringfeder.

BTW your specs are wrong.
The 70 series has coil springs on the front, drum brakes on the back and is only available in 4wd with 151kw (200hp).
There is no 2wd version and no 300hp engine

 

[canucksafari]

No you still don't get it.

Here's a simple tutorial using the toyota family.

Car = Camry, Corolla etc.
Offroad passenger vehicle (SUV to the yanks) = rav4, highlander, 80/100/200 series landcruisers etc.
Pickup/Utility = hilux, landcruiser 70 cab/chassis etc regardless of deck fitted.
Van = toyota hiace etc.
Light Truck = Toyota Dyna etc
Heavy Truck = Hino 700 series etc.

Classification don't mean much to me. Here the insurance corporation has the classification of car, wagon and truck. Technically for them an 80 or a Ford expedition is the same as a Jetta wagon. The ministry of transport has just car and truck (which is based on GVW). All truck plates are commercial plates whether or not they are for commecial or pesonal use. There is a limit which then requeire you to stop at every scale. As for towing with any of them, the only thing which legally matters is the rated towing and load capacity. Manufacturers' engineers tend to go on the high side. And they are probably pushed to do so by their bosses who want to use the selling point of higher towing capacity. So what you are allowed to pull and what is comfortable to pull is often not close to being the same.

 

[kim]

As for towing with any of them, the only thing which legally matters is the rated towing and load capacity. Manufacturers' engineers tend to go on the high side. And they are probably pushed to do so by their bosses who want to use the selling point of higher towing capacity. So what you are allowed to pull and what is comfortable to pull is often not close to being the same.

They are the same to me.

 

[Dougal]

Classification don't mean much to me. Here the insurance corporation has the classification of car, wagon and truck. Technically for them an 80 or a Ford expedition is the same as a Jetta wagon. The ministry of transport has just car and truck (which is based on GVW). All truck plates are commercial plates whether or not they are for commecial or pesonal use. There is a limit which then requeire you to stop at every scale. As for towing with any of them, the only thing which legally matters is the rated towing and load capacity. Manufacturers' engineers tend to go on the high side. And they are probably pushed to do so by their bosses who want to use the selling point of higher towing capacity. So what you are allowed to pull and what is comfortable to pull is often not close to being the same.

Here a car based wagon and an offroad passenger vehicle are distinguished by ground clearance.
That puts cars like Subaru's Forester into the offroad-passenger vehicle class with 80's and the like. Even though many of the owners end up lowering them to below your average sportscar height.

We also have heavy vehicles classified by weight (3500kg) and requiring a different license class to drive and towing connections needing engineer certification.
But there are exemptions for things like camper-vans which can be driven on a car license and landcruisers which are above that with a full load of passengers.

My vehicle was factory rated for 1000kg unbraked and 4000kg fully braked, later that was reduced to 3500kg inline with the towing components available.
The most I've towed with it was around 2500kg, I've done that a couple of times. The towing speed limit here is 90km/h.

Working at any limit isn't usually a comfortable experience, except for bureaucrat imposed limits, like those on speed.

 

[canucksafari]

They are the same to me.

Nice avatar change Kim. Here's your next cross Canada tow for the 60.