1965 FJ45 LWB

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Unoman

SILVER Star
Joined
Mar 30, 2008
Threads
65
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941
Location
Austin
Hey fellas...I don't play around too much down in the 45 section, but hope I will soon! I've got a line on a really straight 1965 LWB pickup; however it is missing a few things, such as an entire drivetrain :) You all being the experts, I have a few questions:

How difficult would it be to convert this to a late 2F and 4 speed? Is there any fabrication work needed? I'm not afraid of conversions(have a 3FE40) but I don't have any fab skills.
It's missing the passenger side of the bench seat. I imagine these are hard to come by. Will an early 40 split bench seat work?
Brake master is gone. If I were to go disc brakes, how easy is it to run a booster and different MC?
Rear tail light lenses are missing

I think that's about it for now. Any help is appreciated.

Thanks,
Craig
 
Craig,

So, in other words, what you want to do is pretty much typical.

2F and 4spd fits right up, no welding. Rest of drivetrain is typical FJ40. Passenger bench is special--has a right rear corner cutaway to accommodate the fuel filler neck--but there are workarounds to that. Brake power booster will interfere with the left firewall brace--there are spacers made to avoid that, or the brace can be cut, bent, and rewelded. Dual brake master with dual brake lines is safer than the original single-line system. A later disc brake axle can be swapped for the older drum version. There are some recastings of the old tail lamp lenses out there, but pricey.

Oh, forgot to mention: your wallet will get a workout throughout the process.
 
Don't we always open our wallets for our cruisers??? :) Thanks for the info Bear. Having a booster is not imperative and I've heard of the spacers, but if you say having a dual brake line circuit is important, then I'd rather go that route. I don't necessarily need to have a disc axle, just curious on ease of adaptation.

I think I'm more worried about the missing tail light lenses and passenger seat. I have an early 40 split bench in the attic, but interested to learn about the workarounds you mention.
 
Years ago a fella on here had a real nice 45LV wagon. Was exiting a freeway offramp and the brakes completely went out. Truck wrecked, lucky he survived. He would be the one to recommend improved braking--not totally original to a purist, but it's your truck, and your life and that of your family. And maybe the life of a family you don't accidentally crash into. Food for thought.
 
Years ago a fella on here had a real nice 45LV wagon. Was exiting a freeway offramp and the brakes completely went out. Truck wrecked, lucky he survived. He would be the one to recommend improved braking--not totally original to a purist, but it's your truck, and your life and that of your family. And maybe the life of a family you don't accidentally crash into. Food for thought.

But as I remember the cause of the brake failure was a non stock mod. Which brings up a question. The early Land Cruisers had single circuit brakes which everybody says is a problem but starting with the 81 model the master cylinder only had a single reservoir. If the same thing that happened to that LV happened to a later model 4X series the only difference would be a warning light. But once the fluid was gone from the reservoir you would be without brakes.:meh:
 
True, LITP, but some warning is better than no warning in a dire situation. Also, if either the front or rear line was the problem, typically the other line would still function with the fluid remaining in it, as it is independent from the other line, and there would be partial braking at least on one axle, agreed a crappy situation, but possibly a life saver. Of course, a major catastrophe where both lines are severed, for example, could cause total brake failure, and nothing would help then. The decision to upgrade the brake systems through the years on the Land Cruisers was an engineer's role, and likely driven by regulations in various countries. Certainly nothing about the Land Cruiser brake systems can compare to today's complicated systems, so improvement is a relative term at best.

The decision on Craig's brakes is not mine, I only offered an opinion and a suggestion. He may elect to go the purist route, or choose to modernize a bit as he sees fit. In either case, I hope he reads a number of suggestions from the many posters on here to make an informed decision. With these old trucks I can appreciate the points made on either side of the case.
 
I can't really call myself a purist, but I'm somewhere in between that and a preservist(if that's a word). I like to drive my trucks regularly and be capable of daily duty if needed. I swapped a 76 disc axle into my 75 FJ40 for safety reasons. I have 0.0% interest in putting myself or others in danger.

This thread doesn't need to turn into a debate....was just simply to seek some advice since I have no experience with 45s. I'm clear on the drivetrain and brake situation. Can someone point in the direction on what to do about the passenger front seat? Does anyone convert to later style bucket 40 seats or FJ60 seats? What about the tail light lenses....is there a workaround to that? Will 40 lenses work?
 
Craig,

No debate here, just a healthy difference of opinions. The great thing about these forums is the wide variance you can read about what different folks like or don't like about their vehicles, and form your own decision as to what direction you choose to go.

As to the lenses, the entire lamp housings for the 1964-1968ish longbed trucks are different than than the later ones you see on the FJ40s or 45s. The LPB lamps are not as wide for your year as are the later ones, nor do they have a white backup section to the red/red or red/amber lens.

Since the original lamps are set into an embossed area in each rear valence, the later lamps will not fit as intended. If.........you don't mind installing the later lamps flat onto that general area, they would be an alternative. As mentioned, the original sized lenses are available in a recast version: red/red or red/amber--and although not as nice as the originals, fairly hard to tell the difference unless a side-by-side comparison is made.

If you are handy with a welder, one Mud member here has made some spot-on repro rear valences(the piece that carries both the tailgate hinges and the rear lamps) and you could convert your valence to one with the later wider lamps with the proper inset mounting area.

Seats changed over the years--so depends on what's available to you as to the fit. The earliest seats had large springs in the seat bottoms, more old-fashioned than the much later seats. If you go individual driver and passenger bucket-style seats, you will of course lose the ability to carry a third person--but can then install a center console to carry stuff. Again, depends upon the purist-look you may desire vs. the utility of something a bit more modern and functional. I do think that a combination of an older driver seat with a more modern passenger seat would look out-of-place, so probably replacing both would be best in that scenario.

And also needs mentioned, some folks will fab ways of mounting just about any seat out there, from many different brands, years, and styles. The difficulty with things like that is that the more externally different items you change on your truck, the more it begins to look like something different, and then loses some of what probably brought you to it in the first place. As always though, it's your truck and yours to do with as you please.

Hope all this gives you some info to digest. There's plenty more, and lots of good reading out there. Again, good luck with the project. Looking forward to lots of photos of your progress.
 
I'm not sure we are having a difference of opinions. I just picked up a set of 84 HJ47 axles along with master cylinder and booster to use in my 65 truck. Plus I have few other upgrades planned. Power steering, newer transmission with a split T case and three point seat belts. If I have one old cruiser I would use for road trips it will be the LWB truck. I do sometimes think the old brakes get a worse rap then they deserve. My first cruiser is a 68 with the old single circuit brakes. When I take the time to adjustment properly I can lock up all fours and not have it pull to one side or the other. But even with good working brakes I wouldn't use it in busy city traffic. Just upgrading the brakes in fifty year old vehicle will not make a good choice as DD in traffic. What happened to the LV is what everybody brings up as the poster child as the reason these are so unsafe. Even after 75 and until 81 when there was disc in the front and two wheel cylinders in the back that were still non self adjusting if a front brake line got cut (which is what happened to the LV) and was say FJ55 with larger than stock tires and heading down a off ramp from a freeway who is say the same thing wouldn't of happened. Neither a LV or FJ55 in stock form are up to LA freeway driving in my opinion. I guess my point is there is no automatic one size fits all on what to do. I follow the market on old cruisers and haven't seen the 45s catch on like the 40s. In the case of the 40s stock will bring the best return. I do think in the long run keeping the appearance of stock will pay off down the line.

:cheers:
 
Lots of different opinions here.. I like the old look but want to drive mine.. I swapped a portion of a firewall from a newer truck to get the boosted brakes, new pedals for said brakes and newer steering column to make power steering and turn signals return to center easier... Swapped in newer disk brakes but plan on still running bench seat and hubcaps.
a 3fe and h55 will fit but need a touch of massaging. 2f and short h42 4speed will drop right in. sometimes the booster adapter may or may not clear a carb ..
I'd convert to the new tail lights to get a reverse light.. that's just me tho..
Have fun.. many of us dive into many mods and take our enjoyment away cause we can't drive em..
 
From what I remember it's wasn't until around sometime in 69 that a later pedal bucket would bolt in. I have always planned a 78 cowl with a section of the floor to use the 73-78 transmission cover. But lately I gotten this crazy idea of using a 82 FJ40 tub back to the B pillar and continue the floor all the way to the back of the cab. Key is if the 82 FJ40 gas tank would have enough room. There is another option for reverse lights. Use the stock tail lights then just inside the tail light install a couple of 68-72 FJ40 reverse lights. I have thought about using a 3FE and A440F. Clearance would be a nightmare. Would bet simpler to use a H42/split case and the 3:70 in the diffs, same as the FJ60 got in the US.

If your thinking about upgrading the brakes to make it safer don't forget the steering. To me they are even scarier than the brakes. While the brakes take a lot of time to get right it's easier then going thru the complete steering system. Not sure how easy center arm rebuild kits are to find anymore for the early ones.
 
Hmmmmm. So, LITP, you're really a closet resto-modder deep down after all. Gotcha. Velcome to the dark side.

Just wait till you wake up one night dreaming of your next project--with power hubcaps done in a dark purple metallic candy, and dual chromed turbocharged dipsticks. As the commercial says, "Priceless."

--Just kidding, or should I add these to my list...nah !
 
Hmmmmm. So, LITP, you're really a closet resto-modder deep down after all. Gotcha. Velcome to the dark side.

Just wait till you wake up one night dreaming of your next project--with power hubcaps done in a dark purple metallic candy, and dual chromed turbocharged dipsticks. As the commercial says, "Priceless."

--Just kidding, or should I add these to my list...nah !

Ouch:rolleyes:

I've posted more then a few times about A440F but mainly in the 40/55 section. Same with the 78 cowl I have. If I were to keep it stock I'd want it 100% stock. When I bought the truck it had a early 2F and the engine listed on the VIN plate was long gone. It should of have bug catcher vent doors. Those could have sourced but not the engine. The correct spare tire carrier is harder to find but even then not sure I want to use it with my bad back. Finally located a later model locally. Plan has always been for a FF axle in the back and disc brake axle up front. While I plan on doing some mods I'm anal about how I do it. Three point seat belts will be installed using the upper bracket from a Canadian truck. Lower section off the bracket spot welded to the hard top side. The pedestal for the steering box will need to be changed to go power steering. That one I'm uncertain about. But is will be from a Toyota. If I can find another FJ40 power steering box would like to go that route. The idea is when it's done everything will look like it came from the factory.

The 70 in my avatar had a early 2F transplant but since it not listed on the VIN plate I want to go back to the F145. Other than filling the spare tank neck and hole cut for the trail light plug it will be pretty easy to go back. I ready replaced the home made angle iron bumper on the back. The front bumper has piece of 1/4 steel welded behind it. That will be replaced. So you can see I haven't completely gone to the darkside.:grinpimp:

Just curious what year is your truck or is it trucks? I know you seem to have Middle East spec parts? You have wealth of knowledge on the newer trucks just wonder if that is what you have?

:cheers:
 
Same thoughts about the seat belts and mount. I was able to get a set of those Canadian upper corner mounts and have been toying with the idea of cutting open the upper edge of the hardtop to weld-in a backingplate/captive nuts, and then welding and grinding the scars where the work was done. The concept is great, the execution another story. Some other markets had a captive nut/plate in the B pillar, but the truck I want to use does not. I think if the harness is not far enough back from the seat, then the restraint is less effective. I do believe that had the USA still been importing the pickup trucks in the eighties, then the USDOT and brethren would surely have come up with demands for improved safety. Just notice how they required the Land Rover Defenders to have exo-cages in the early nineties, when that vehicle to this day is still sold throughout the world without such a contraption.

Yea, I was fortunate enough to gain some stuff from the Middle East, and after having gone thru them with a fine-toothed comb, have some experience with them, their idiosyncracies, and the later model revisions. I've also experienced the shortcuts taken in that part of the world. Yet, I do believe that these were fine trucks, that would have been accepted by the public in the US, even with governmental mods, and that the hoopla about the Chicken tax and the "foreign invasion" and the destruction of our pickup truck monopoly altered the off-road segment of the market. I also am one of those that believe the FJ70 series would succeed here, as some of us appreciate the sturdiness and capability of the older design ethic.

I'm just joking with you about the modification jab--most everyone changes one thing or another, even if it's just the wattage of a light bulb or adding an air freshener. I appreciate that some of you guys have been lucky enough to grab some of the very earliest 40s and 25s, and the difficulties of trying to keep the flame burning, staying true to the marque and resisting the temptation to cut corners. I, too, have a possible original candidate, a '65 longbed I have toyed with keeping 100% stock, but like most trucks it has lived a hard life and wasn't maintained in pristine condition, and to do it right, will take a lot of time and money and searching. And in the end, I wonder if I would actually enjoy driving a 100% antique, frustrated at the traffic backed-up behind me on the mountain roads, me sweating and squirming when the temps are cooking in Summer in the valley, etc.. It's one thing to sit and admire a beautiful object, static, sitting in a museum or a climate-controlled garage, quite another to be enjoying the Spartan conditions while competing in modern-day traffic. I think driving it I would feel much like those Amish farmers in their buggies driving down the country lane with their wheels in the gutter and the high school kids flipping them off whizzing by in their Mustangs and Challengers.

I may yet do it, and yes, that will be me way ahead of you, with a big fluorescent-orange triangle slapped on the back of the tailgate--probably will have to stop shaving then and actually wear my Farmer John overalls out in public. So......... talk about coming out of the closet..............
 
I'm just joking with you about the modification jab

The reason I put :rolleyes: after ouch, no offense taken. Try to say pretty light hearted on the mud.

squirming when the temps are cooking in Summer in the valley, etc....

This beauty showed up in a local junk yard. While I will had to do modify it to LHD I got the extension vent off the heater. Already had LHD version of the inline evaporator. Advantage of the 3FE I have the A/C compressor is already in place. Condenser coil is still in the wreck but in pretty bad shape. Not sure what valley your talking about but doubt it's as hot as the "Valley of the SUN" (Phoenix). A/C is a must of want to use it nine months of the year.

wrecked HJ47.webp
HJ47 front floor.webp
 
To this day have never seen an FJ40 in our local junkyards. Would be nice. Congrats.
 
To this day have never seen an FJ40 in our local junkyards. Would be nice. Congrats.

Not sure my wife feels the same. Been a number if years since the 40s in junk yards dried up. Prior to that they were pretty easy to locate. At one time know where at least fifty were. Mainly 70s FJ40s a few 55 series and few 60 series. Once found FJ25 transmission and transfer. But that was probably better then ten years ago. This late model HJ47 would have been a rarity even back them. It does surprise be as big as Phoenix the few number of 40 owners who are interested in keeping their 40 series stock or modify it using LC parts. While most the body is trash there are some pretty rare parts there for the US. Being local I didn't ask if they were willing to ship small items but Large items I know they would. The 2H was still available I believe. Believe the rest of the running gear is gone.
 
Well, the hunt continues. This truck sold yesterday and not to me unfortunately. Thanks again for the help and input.

ImageUploadedByIH8MUD Forum1427036051.140995.webp
 
Here is my take on the seat. My 45 has the original bench and it has worked fine however I am just a bit tall for it. Tried to get more room by elevating it by one inch which helped. Not sure I an going to change it out however if I had my druthers and needed to replace half of it I would be going with something that would give me just a bit of more leg room, just my thought guys.
 

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