13BT owners

[Mainer7]

Hi,

I'm at the "end" of putting a 13bt into my 40, and have a possibly simple question about the 24 volt starter. Since the engine arrived with no batteries connected (obviously) I am not positive which post on the the starter should be hooked to positive/ground. Sorry if this seems silly, but I've found 2 large posts, one on each side of the starter. One's really easy to access and the other is crammed in between the block and starter.
Then there is a smaller terminal (closer to the starter's bottom side) with a single small wire (with a push-on plastic connector) that goes into a group of wires.

So, can any of you 13BT owners help me out on this one? Please?

 

[HZJ60 Guy]

Ok, (I hope you get help here) but why exactly dont you have a factory manual for that engine? I mean we arent talking about maccaroni and cheese here Mr..



TB

 

[Mainer7]

I have the factory manual, and it's been a big help with this project, but it is very vague in the starter area. And the starter in the manual looks different than mine. The manual seems to just tell me there are terminals called "30" "50" and "C."

I simply need to know, to which terminal are other people's positive battery cable connected. Do you have a 13BT you can look at?
Thank you

 

[Stone]

Here's a scan of the testing page for the starter in my FSM:

From what I can gather, Terminal 50 gets a 24v (+) signal...maybe from the starter relay?

The starter appears to be grounded to the chassis.

There's one large terminal on one side (NOT Terminal C) that the armature assembly field frame is grounded to...the connection is a short heavy gauge wire with a ring terminal and covered with a rubber boot. It sits just above the small Terminal 50.

There's another large terminal (Terminal C) on the other side of the starter that gets the 24v (+) feed from the batteries. It appears that if you have a starter from the BJ series engine, this Terminal C would sit on the other side of the starter body analogous to the Terminal 50 with a slight downward angle. If it's a starter from a BB series engine, then Terminal C would sit higher up pointing straight out the side of the starter, on the same line as the large ground terminal on the other side.

I'm no electrical expert...so take it FWIW. I'm sure there are others who know better who will chime in to confirm or correct these descriptions. Cheers.

 

[Mainer7]

Well, I decided to take the truck to the local automotive electrical wizards and after a couple of hours they got the thing to start. Turns out I had a couple of wires/cables mixed up for the series parallel magnetic switch and one of the batteries turned out to be 5 years old and was all done. So now it starts and runs for a second or two, then dies. It fires right up but quickly stops. I've bled the fuel filter and feed pump, but I may need to bleed the air out of the injector nozzles? The guys at the shop thought it seemd like that or the timing was too fast. Oh and yes Stone, it's a 13BT from an '86 bj71 from G&S. If it tested out fine for Greg and Sheldon, can the timing become "off" even if I did not mess with it? Hmmm, I looked through the FSM but couldn't find any info about bleeding anything besides the feed pump and fuel filter. Thanks again for reading this and replying before!

 

[Stone]

How's the VSV working...?

 

[Mainer7]

Sheldon sent me a brand new VSV from Oz that I installed just as the old one was, but I put it up higher because I've read gere that if they get wet they don't work. I tried it with the vsv connected to power and disconnected, but no difference. I'm going to run out now and check to make sure I have the ground and power lines correct, and try it again...Thanks again Stone

 

[Greg_B]

Mainer7, check your private messages. A few notes:

1) What is the ambient temp? Every 13BT I have seen needs the throttle bumped up slightly to keep running for the 1st start of the day when it gets "cool" but the glow system has not activated. Read this post: https://forum.ih8mud.com/showthread.php?t=24480

2) The 13BT returns so much fuel (spec is 1lpm I believe) that I have never had to crack the injector lines to complete a bleed process and get an engine running. Open the bleed valve at the fuel filter, and manually prime till the air bubbles are not present.

3) Take the VSV out of the system and see if it runs. You can shut if off manually by closing the pot with your fingers.

4) Your timing will not be off from when the engine shipped.

hth's

gb

 

[Stone]

Greg's got a great point in #1 there...my BJ74 will NOT run cold without the hand throttle cranked up a few turns. Seems like every 13BT that I've come across was the same way.

 

[Mainer7]

Well, just camer back inside and found the new vsv is functioning. Yay! It was nearly 40 F outside the first time it ran. After is was towed home it ran again for a couple of seconds, then dies and it was ~30 F outside. Is using the hand throttle much different than stepping on the accel pedal while cranking? If so, I must go hook that up and try again. The shop only really deals with elecrtical/charging systems, so they were just guessing about the timing. It also seems if I wait awhile between starting attempts, it wants to work better. If I crank it for more than a few seconds in a row it sounds like it's just "free spinning" and not getting any compression. But again, if I wait a few minutes it will start/run for a moment or 2...
Greg, thank you for those messages, I have forgotten to check on those, been very busy at my real job, lol.

RE: the in/out fuel lines, I have one from the tank to the sedimentor then to the feed pump. The other one (return i beleive) comes from higher up on the injection pump and then back to another port on the fuel tank. I could find no clear diagrams of the fuel lines in any manuals so I went with my best guess. Does this sound like the correct routing?

Thanks again Greg and Stone.

 

[Mainer7]

Update

I tried Greg's suggestion of removing the vacuum line from the intake shutter pot, and the rig started and stayed running! Thank you Greg and Stone, and of course Sheldon. I had one of the vaccum lines on the vsv switched. That thing really purs like a kitten! Now, if I can just get those brake lights to work again I'll be on the road. My hardtop is 30 minutes away and it's 28F outside...Wheee.

Thanks again!
P.S. I'm sending Sheldon the 24 volt VSV ASAP, sorry I've not done so yet

 

[Greg_B]

Great, glad you got it figured.

Make sure you run a fuel conditioner (Howes Plus and Standyne are two bigger names) all the time, and ensure you run a diesel rated oil. There is tons of information about oils/specs etc here: http://theoildrop.server101.com/cgi/ultimatebb.cgi

gb

 

[Stone]

Sweet! I'm excited for you! Run the Howes Plus for sure and double on the winter, as Greg has suggested to me. Pics?

 

[Mainer7]

Thanks! Me too! I just went and put on my hard top (what a cold drive!)I used regular engine oil first then thought I needed diesel oil so I drained it and put new diesel engine oil in there, I think it was Ursa?
I put some diesel fuel conditioner in from napa. I forgot the brand but it was in a red and white bottle.
Next tank I'll look for Howes Plus, thanks for that advice.
RE: vsv....I have some strange electrical gremlins, because my lights are all working/not working randomly. I got the vsv to work that one time, but now it won't. Even if I switch the hoses around, it always closes the vac pot. So I've been shutting it off under the hood which is okay if I park on level ground 'cause there's no e-brake. I might have the vaccum lines off the vacuum pump mixed up or something, because I only needed vaccum for the brake booster and VSV. No AC, vac 4wd-transfer, or boost gauge. I have many pictures of this project I'll post after I shrink them down.