100 vs 200 vs 4Runner for Off-Road and Reliability

[aging fleet]

A 2006 post from @cruiserdan about the costs of owning a Land Cruiser. It's specific to the 80, but applies to the 100 and 200 as well.

There have been a few recent threads where questions have come up looking for cheap stuff or easy answers. In response to that I would like to offer some observations.

The 80 Series Land Cruiser was, at the time, Toyota's Flagship vehicle in the United States. When new the 80 sold from the mid 30 thousand dollars (for 91-92 year model examples) to the low to mid 40's (for 93-94) to a bit past 50 thousand dollars for the last production 97 models.

During the production run the 80 rarely sold for less than the factory sticker and often for more. They were always in short supply and coveted by dealers. I bought mine new and it took me almost a full year to get it.

Obviously the "new" has worn off for virtually all of the original owners so they parted with them and we now see second, third, and even fourth, owners showing up on the board.

Those of you who fall into the latter category did not buy a 10,000 dollar or 9,000 dollar or even a substantially cheaper vehicle. You bought a used vehicle that, in many cases, sold for close to 50 grand new.

The care and feeding of a top-end luxury vehicle DOES NOT depreciate like the vehicle does. Parts and labor costs only go up.

The only way to really be able to afford one is to enter into the relationship with eyes wide open and the commitment to learn to work on it and care for it yourself. Or, have the resources to pay somebody WHO KNOWS AND UNDERSTANDS the vehicle to look after it on your behalf.

It should further be mentioned that to morph an 80 into what ammounts to the most capable production 4WD vehicle ever offered by any manufacturer will cost at least 6000 bucks, if you supply the sweat. This only takes into consideration the mods, not the PM's to get the vehicle up to speed.

That being said, my relationship with my 80 has been one of the most satisfying parts of my life.

D-

 

[MyLandy]

Great point on cost of maintaining luxury vehicles, but hopefully by limiting the miles I put on it I can keep the costs in check.

I don't even need the luxury features, I've only ever bought base-model vehicles.

I just noticed in another thread that all Lexus and some 06-07 LCs have Automatic Height Control and hydraulic suspension. That sounds like something I don't need that would cost a fortune to repair.

 

[4Beast]

I would personally only get a 200 if I could afford to get a lift and at least 35s, as I think that they look silly otherwise (I know, superficial). The 100s don't look as ungainly stock as the "Highlander XL" (IMHO). I would definitely love to have that 5.7 though, and knowing how capable my 100 is, I assume that they have refined the platform even more. I would also disagree with the assertion that these trucks are expensive to maintain. I'd guess whoever says that has not had anything European...

 

[krice118]

@Kruzur
Read the FAQ in the 100 section and the 200 section, most if not all of your questions have already been answered

 

[Leandro]

I just noticed in another thread that all Lexus and some 06-07 LCs have Automatic Height Control and hydraulic suspension. That sounds like something I don't need that would cost a fortune to repair.

Don't worry about AHC. If well maintained will last as much as the truck. Worst case scenario, you can buy an OME kit for around $800 and swap it in your driveway.

 

[CA2GA]

Thanks to everyone for this great feedback!

Based on your replies, it seems like:
Offroad capabilites would be similar, but the LC will feel more solid than the 4R
The 200 would be more costly to maintain than the 100, but the 100 won't be cheap
I should use OEM parts for LC, which works out because I do that for all my cars anyway
After mods on both 4R and LC, the gas mileage won't be much worse on the LC
I need to be aware that there are differences between models, but also between years of the same model

I will be test driving all three to get a feel for each.

Are the early 200s (there is a 2008 for sale in my area) much different than the late model 100s with regards to maintenance? I like the boost in horsepower but could live without it given the torque of the 100.

Regarding LCs, are there any years to avoid or any years that are better regarding maintenance?

For 100 vs LX470 and 200 vs LX570, is Lexus more costly to maintain? Any other advantages/disadvantages?

Thanks again

I drive an LX 470 and work at a Lexus dealer (sales, not service). Under the skin there's not much to differentiate the LC vs. LX except the Adjustable Height Control (AHC) suspension and adaptive variable suspension. Maintenance costs for most things should be similar, though I'm sure Lexus dealers charge a higher labor rate and probably parts, but I don't think it's huge. Not really an issue for DIY jobs.

If you are going to mod, you need to decide ahead of time if you are going to lift it or if the AHC meets your needs. I love the AHC and find it gives me enough clearance, as well as a terrific ride and the ability to lower the vehicle when loading it. For some, a lift is the only way to go. In that case, you'd be better off with a non-AHC LC. Simpler to lift, no hydraulics and electronics to maintain etc. I would drive both and make your decision on suspension.

 

[kcobourn]

Great point on cost of maintaining luxury vehicles, but hopefully by limiting the miles I put on it I can keep the costs in check.

Having done this twice in < 2 years I can tell you finding a legit, stock, low mile, no rust, well maintained LC is next to impossible IMO. LXs are easier to find & from my own experiences with Lexus owners they tend to over-maintain their cars (a good thing!).

No matter which you choose to buy get ready to put in at least $1K to 'baseline'. I spent $6K on my current 72K 2006 & $7K on my first 129K 2006 example as my requirements were to get the truck as close to factory fresh as possible (without sending it to Slee). This $ incuded things like new tires, tint, details, DIY simple maintenance, & dealerships or indy shops doing more intense items.

I just noticed in another thread that all Lexus and some 06-07 LCs have Automatic Height Control and hydraulic suspension. That sounds like something I don't need that would cost a fortune to repair.

My first was with AHC & the second without AHC. As long as you're testing the AHC system & it has been properly maintained I personally think it's not really that scary to own. I miss it as my new one doesn't have AHC.

In terms of T4R vs. LC/LX I tried to like T4R but just couldn't go back after owning 100s!

 

[tacoduck]

LOL none of y'all have ever owned a BMW 540.

 

[kcobourn]

LOL none of y'all have ever owned a BMW 540.

HAHA - close ... a 2011 Audi S4 ... they had to rebuild the motor @ 38K. Thank God for extended warranties!

 

[tacoduck]

Ive owned 2 UJZ100's, and they are by far, the cheapest, most reliable vehicles Ive ever owned. the 4.7 engine is bullet proof and also powers tundras and sequoias. tons of parts everywhere. The UJZ 100 is rare in that its luxurious and reliable. it rides amazing both on and offroad. its not as bloated as the 200. Timing belt is a 100k service. 20k miles a year, thats once every 5 years. it costs $700.

Mark me down as a ujz100 fanboy.

 

[sacmaster]

I've had an 00 and still drive an 03 daily. Wife drives a 12 4Runner limited. She prefers hers and I prefer mine. She gets about 4 mpg better than me on average (both trucks riding on all terrains but otherwise stock). Both are supremely reliable. The LC is quieter and has more room. Seats are more comfortable as well. 4Runner is a little quicker and handles better. Both great vehicles, but there's a reason you can get two 4runners for the price of an LC.

 

[77mustard40]

Good point on the fuel economy. I have a 100 and drive a T4R as the dd, both modestly built will take you a lot of places off-road. Don’t own a 200 so I can’t chime in there. Like getting mid 18’s on average with the T4R but when I get in the 100 I can feel it’s presence. 1999 with 175 on the clock and it’s still rock solid.

It’s a personal choice, find the right truck for you and it will all work out. Will say I prefer the MUD community over the sniping in the T4R forum if that matters.

 

[RKTINC]

I have all three in my garage. The 4R IS a tin can but the most reliable tin can ever made. The 200 is actually an LX570 and seems like a floating mom wagon. I love the 100 and have had two. As the baby bear said... it’s just right. Look for a clean low mile late gen 100 lx or LC and you will see less depreciation than a 200.

 

[Live to Ski]

LC is the ticket.

be aware that post '03 has the environmental controls integrated into the entertainment systems. ALMOST impossible to change sound system (can be done.....but......).

Read somewhere: 100 drives better on corrugated dirt roads at speed over the 200 (torsion vs coil over). No direct experience here but important for us western types.

AHC: be aware that if you overload that system (seems easy to do), rig will go into limp mode. Again, no direct experience.

As others have said, there are ton more lexus lx470's out there. that would be your best bet based on numbers produced and mall crawler use.

Numbers sold in US: indication of support, higher #'s = more aftermarket. Hate to say, landcruiser falls below 4R here. 100 will have higher #s than 200 when all said and done.

Finally, I see your in MD. as you probably know, rust is not your friend in the used rig market.

Priority order: rust, service history (verified at toyota service website....plug in vin), mileage, overall condition, cost (lexus there), how you feel about the transaction (one owner that is knowledgeable, etc).

Go get that cruiser (some bias here)

 

[RND1]

LOL none of y'all have ever owned a BMW 540.

I have - been there done that. When it left me stranded on the side of the road for the 3rd time, it was on CL as soon as I fixed what stranded me that time. Sold it to some poor sucker from the UK.

 

[Kofoed]

The ergonomics are so much better (at least for me) in the 100 and 200 series. As I bought my 100 for desert trips and not DD I didn't care too much about mpg, I wanted comfort, room, and the abililty to sleep in the back with everything closed up. 100 all the way

 

[MyLandy]

So much great information! I want to lift it so AHC would be a waste. Narrowed my search to '98-'07 Land Cruiser. Didn't realize how big an issue rust is but hoping to find one with little to none.

Interesting that in '04 they integrated environmental controls into the entertain system. Hopefully the stereo is good enough if I go with an '04-'07.

 

[Live to Ski]

Well, the integrated environmental/sound system is waaaaay better than my stock FJ60 radio (which I couldn't hear @ moderate highway speeds) .

Speaking of sound: many 100's have deteriorated speaker foams. Could be a price negotiating point if you are aggressive (I wouln't be as good condition rigs disappear.....). Watch out with stereo installers....factory speakers are 2 ohm.....most aftermarket is 4 ohm.....that is noticeable in a bad way. Lots of good results her on mud using re-foam kits.

Also, forgot to mention that earlier 100's have a 2 bearing setup with predominance to fail. Later models have a 4 bearing gig.