Glowsystem HJ45 12volt - advice

[Jespervangfalkenberg]

Hi all

Took this from my post in Fj45 forum.

I have been working with the glow system on the truck. Everything has been look/measured and it looks okay. But the glow plug indicator docent glow!

But i have a problem with the cold start, it smokes and stumbles until it fire properly, then it runs nicely!

Then I had a idea - I recently took the glow plugs out to test them and they all worked fine. But I did not pay attention to the number or voltage on the plugs. So this morning I took one out and guess what - 14volt!!!

If I understand this correctly it must be 8,5volt glow plugs?

I guess it means that the 14v glow plugs don't glow that much, when you have an amount of resistance in the wiring and the glow indicator. Which again means less voltage to the plugs and maybe that is why the engine starts with a lot of smoke and stumbles?

What is your opinion?"

The bosch number is 0250202076!

 

[bj40green]

Hi Jesper,

You can find all the glow stuff info here: which plugs .....b-2b-3b-h-2h-diesels

You don't mention the year of your truck but if you have the "glow controller" on the dash your plugs should be 8.5 Volts.
Your glow controller will only lit up if you have the old style plugs which draw 10 amps each.
In my BJ40, I have "energy efficient" plugs who draw only 8 Amps each which is perfect for glowing and starting but not enough to lit the glow controller.

Rudi

 

[Jespervangfalkenberg]

Hi Rudi

Thank you for the reply!

My truck is a 1978 model. So I guess it can be a little difficult to find the correct plugs? Gezzz there is a lot of options

So I will try and find some 8,5 volts and see if it helps

Thx

 

[RufusTheDufus]

Your glow plug indicator should glow at least a little even with the 14v plugs installed. It will take a long time (like 60+ seconds) but it should glow some.

Do you have a volt meter to test the voltage at glow plug bus bar while someone holds the key in the "glow" position?

 

[Jespervangfalkenberg]

When I measure the voltage it says 10,35 volt. The battery says 12.02 volts ( it is not fully charged). It seems like the "ground" is okay, there is a minimum voltage drop. The drop is on the + side. But is that not okay since the glow indicator is a resistance?

ps - I have not tried to make it glow for more than 35 secs!

see attached document from oem manual H engine

 

[lostmarbles]

Hi there

Just replace those 14V plugs with six new matching 8.5V plugs (as already suggested) and make sure you have a decent (high CCA) fully-charged battery available to run them (and to crank your engine fast enough once your glow controller is glowing) and make sure that all connections with your busbar are electrically sound too.

Just because your cruiser is old doesn't mean the 8.5V plugs should be hard to find.



There are plenty for sale on the Internet.

 

[RufusTheDufus]

My concern is that his glow controller never looks like it's conducting current. I'd expect something more along the lines of 8.5v (or less with a non-fully-charged battery) at the bus bar. 10.3v could mean his glow controller has been bypassed or modified. It should turn at least slightly red even with the wrong plugs because it's a resistor supplying all of the current to the plugs.

 

[lostmarbles]

My concern is that his glow controller never looks like it's conducting current. I'd expect something more along the lines of 8.5v (or less with a non-fully-charged battery) at the bus bar. 10.3v could mean his glow controller has been bypassed or modified. It should turn at least slightly red even with the wrong plugs because it's a resistor supplying all of the current to the plugs.

The higher voltage plugs (14V instead of 8.5V) will have higher resistance and this will automatically increase the voltage you measure at the busbar when they're energised. (It'll also decrease the overall preheat current flow.)

Conversely, if he were to fit 6V plugs (lower resistance) he would measure lower busbar voltage (before the excessive current blows his controller).

In other words, I think our glow controllers are very sensitive to glow plug resistance and consequently I'm surprised you still expect he'd see any degree of coil-glow when using 14V plugs in a preheat system designed for 8.5V plugs.

 

[Jespervangfalkenberg]

Hi guys

Thank you so much for your replies!

I have order some new plugs, which should be the correct ones. I have order them at Euro4x4parts.com. In Denmark they can't find the correct ones and that is amazing because I gave them the different kind of spare part numbers!!!

So I will cross my fingers

 

[hj 60]

Hi Jesper,

Finding parts in Europe is sometimes difficult, they all sell different parts (besides oilfilter) so you end up with boxes from different shops:
I use the Germany shops a lot:

http://www.landcruiser-parts.de/HJ60-bis-Bj-1085

http://www.diebo-teile.de/toyota_landcruiser_j6.htm

http://www.kfzteile24.de/index.cgi?rm=chooseType&nextRm=searchTree

Best part number site:
http://www.toyodiy.com/parts/g_J_1985_T ... MMZ_1.html

Search for a part number picture on this site:
http://partsfan.com/toyota/us/jp/791120/014/

http://www.megazip.ru/ru/auto/toyota/vi ... 43#g436643

http://www.neoriginal.ru/cat/toyota/par ... -MC/4_8113

http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/raframe ... Bearing&ck[ID]=0&ck[idlist]=0&ck[viewcurrency]=EUR&ck[PHP_SESSION_ID]=naik8g6vqbp905pnbphb4mq952

http://www.villagetoyotaparts.com/produ ... earchTerm=

http://www.trademotion.com/parts/1985/T ... tor%20belt

http://www.4wdspares.com/toyota-landcru ... -c-27.html


http://www.teilexpress.de/index.php/cat/c590_Toyota-Orig-Teile.html

 

[RufusTheDufus]

In other words, I think our glow controllers are very sensitive to glow plug resistance and consequently I'm surprised you still expect he'd see any degree of coil-glow when using 14V plugs in a preheat system designed for 8.5V plugs.

The difference in resistance between the 8.5v plugs and the 14v plugs is minimal. Along the lines of .1 to .4 ohms depending on brand of plug. You get more than that much variation in resistance as the 8.5v plugs warm up from cold. The glow controller won't get bright red but it should at least show something.

 

[Jespervangfalkenberg]

Hi Jesper,

Finding parts in Europe is sometimes difficult, they all sell different parts (besides oilfilter) so you end up with boxes from different shops:
I use the Germany shops a lot:

http://www.landcruiser-parts.de/HJ60-bis-Bj-1085

http://www.diebo-teile.de/toyota_landcruiser_j6.htm

http://www.kfzteile24.de/index.cgi?rm=chooseType&nextRm=searchTree

Best part number site:
http://www.toyodiy.com/parts/g_J_1985_T ... MMZ_1.html

Search for a part number picture on this site:
http://partsfan.com/toyota/us/jp/791120/014/

http://www.megazip.ru/ru/auto/toyota/vi ... 43#g436643

http://www.neoriginal.ru/cat/toyota/par ... -MC/4_8113

http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/raframe ... Bearing&ck[ID]=0&ck[idlist]=0&ck[viewcurrency]=EUR&ck[PHP_SESSION_ID]=naik8g6vqbp905pnbphb4mq952

http://www.villagetoyotaparts.com/produ ... earchTerm=

http://www.trademotion.com/parts/1985/T ... tor%20belt

http://www.4wdspares.com/toyota-landcru ... -c-27.html


http://www.teilexpress.de/index.php/cat/c590_Toyota-Orig-Teile.html

WOW… thank you very much

 

[RufusTheDufus]

Then I had a idea - I recently took the glow plugs out to test them and they all worked fine.

How did you test the plugs to determine they are OK? Yes, they are the wrong plugs just curious what test method you used.

 

[Jespervangfalkenberg]

How did you test the plugs to determine they are OK? Yes, they are the wrong plugs just curious what test method you used.

Hi

I just took them all out and tested if they would glow connected directly to a battery. And I counted the seconds. They all glowed at the tip and they started in the same amount of seconds.

 

[lostmarbles]

Hi

I just took them all out and tested if they would glow connected directly to a battery. And I counted the seconds. They all glowed at the tip and they started in the same amount of seconds.

And a fully charged battery can have a terminal voltage of 13.6V which isn't far off the plugs nominal voltage of 14V ....... So I'm not surprised they glowed

But of course in your cruiser each plug has the glow controller wired in upstream. This drops the voltage and thus would hinder their ability to glow. And that's why 8.5V plugs are specified.

 

[Jespervangfalkenberg]

Precise! That is what I thougth!

Let see how it goes "glows"

 

[Jespervangfalkenberg]

just to follow up on the topic!

I got the new 8,5v plugs today and guess what - it works

 

[RufusTheDufus]

Awesome.

 

[bj40green]

Good job Jesper Enjoy!

Rudi

 

[lostmarbles]

Just searched for other posts you've made and found your AMAZING build thread:
https://forum.ih8mud.com/fj45-owners-club/737403-my-hj45-project-denmark.html



I think this is best build thread I've ever set eyes on!! Really!

What I was looking for was information on your truck's date of birth and history relating to your glow controller.

Is it maybe 1977 or 1978 build date..

HKT make two different 8.5V plugs for these old diesels so I wonder why you went for PT100?

(The above pic has been uploaded from your build thread)

Their catalog that I have says you should be running the PT104 part number rather than the PT100 but to be truthful, I don't know exactly what the differences are..



And how many seconds did it take to get your controller that hot?

Here are our two glow controllers side by side:


I wonder if yours is standard or whether it has been modified/repaired over the years?

It looks so bright I wonder if you are at risk of burning it out?




PS. The above photo of mine was taken after about 20 or 25 seconds of preheat.