Bought a FJZ80 in the midst of a 1HZ swap, some questions

[Leitrum3]

Here’s a little story of mine, about how I stumbled into a fortunate situation, perhaps a once in a lifetime moment.

I was at the local cruiser shop a few weeks ago getting an engine mount swapped out (I didn’t want to risk my fingers, I’d rather they theirs!) and I off-handedly mentioned that I was interested in switching over to an 80 and eventually doing a diesel swap. The mechanic stopped what he was doing, walked over to the door and pointed out to the lot and proceeded to inform me of an interesting situation they were in with another owner. Wouldn’t you know it, there was a guy who was having them do the work for that very same thing over the course of the past 4 years. They were nearly complete when he decided he wanted to pull the plug and just get rid of the thing for a song (I won’t even say what I just paid for it, I don’t want anyone to hate me) and would I like to take a look? Why, yes. Yes I would.

Here’s what I found.
-1996 FZJ80 in decent shape except for the fact that it’s been sitting for 4 years and has moss or algae growing everywhere! Thanks for that, Portland.
-1HZ engine, which I’m told came from Outback Imports and was in good operating order before it made its way stateside. I’m planning to call Jesse tomorrow to confirm all of this.
-A442F, hydraulic out of Australia, rebuilt, also from Outback Imports. Again, I’m calling Jesse to confirm this and ask if it has the Extreme VB as I have a hunch it does.
-ARB lockers, front and rear
-ARB rear bumper, but no tire or jerry can carrier
-A whole mess of other random mods that I’m sure I’ll be sorting out for months.

So, the real challenge is going to take up someone else’s project when it’s most of the way through but has lots of loose ends. The shop hasn’t touched it in a year or two so their recollection of details is scant, and I’ve been a FJ60/3B owner for the last few years so the 80 stuff is completely foreign and seemingly much more complicated electrically. I’ve been doing extensive research on this particular swap and am still sorting out what I might need to source or mod and will be meeting up with the shop guys for an hour or two to review early next week. To my knowledge all that remains to be installed is the coolant plumbing, air intake, drive shafts, and quite a bit of wiring. Well, as much wiring as these engines have. So for now, I guess I just have a couple questions if anyone’s listening and/or knowledgeable.

Given that it’s a 1HZ with a manuf. date of 4/94, is it still the same simple electrics that I read the 93’s and lower have? Will the OBD II ever work with this combo?

Mated to a hydraulic A442, does anyone have any sense of how the wiring will go? My guess is that this will be fairly simple with the only items in question being the “Power” and “2nd” switches.

What gauges do I need to change? Tacho obviously, but anything else? Does the whole cluster need to go? Since it had an A343 originally, was this electric and not a cable? Am I looking at a complete rats nest? In which case I think I’ll just call G&S. ;p

If you made it this far, I might as well share some photos. I’m sure folks such as yourself can see a diamond in the rough.

 

[sailor]

You already know. Just call g&s.

 

[BCR4619]

Who in their right mind would..... forget it, Congrats! and x2 on G&S <--- Wealth of knowledge right there

 

[gifu]

Bitch'n. Now just need a turbo for it.

 

[Tapage]

1HZ just need one 12V the cutoff valve to run .. so you can ditch all other electronic and wiring ..

Down here all A442F have some sort of electronics .. ( solenoids to control it / power / ETC button / 2nd start / OD on the shift lever ) no OBD nothing ..

The only thing that I'm not sure it's how to make the tach works .. it's my understanding that gassers need tach signal for few things like AC compressor ..

 

[roscoFJ73]

Lucky bastard.You will get hate mail over this.

You only need the diesel tach,it should fit into the FZJ80 dash,assuming its the same shape.Its gets its signal from a sensor on the fuel pump.
Temp gauge should be plug and play,it was on the 60 and 70 series
All 1HZ were the same from 90-99 except some european ones which had the ACSD on the fuel pump.Some also had the HAC for alpine regions and some were 12volt and some were 24volt.
Where are they going to put the fuel filters?There is a place on the RH fender begging for a fuel filter to be hung there.

Is that a charcoal canister in the foreground?Throw it away its horrible

 

[Cruisin']

Congrats on a good find.

The fuel filter could go where the charcoal canister is.

The diesel tach should swap right in. They are the same shape.

Hope you're able to sort out the details in good time and get that beauty on the road!!!

 

[Leitrum3]

Thanks all, that's the good feedback and collective thought that I need since this thing feels a bit foreign to me still.

You only need the diesel tach,it should fit into the FZJ80 dash,assuming its the same shape.Its gets its signal from a sensor on the fuel pump.
Temp gauge should be plug and play,it was on the 60 and 70 series
All 1HZ were the same from 90-99 except some european ones which had the ACSD on the fuel pump.Some also had the HAC for alpine regions and some were 12volt and some were 24volt.

So, a question on the tach. I thought I read on another post that the tach gets its signal from the IP, but here you say the fuel pump. I haven't physically dug in and familiarized myself enough with the engine to know for sure yet. The fuel pump would make more sense though since I know one of the mods is pulling the pump out of the tank.

The big question I'm trying to figure out with the gauges is the speedo. The 96 is electronic and the 1HZ uses mechanical. I thought I read that the 93-95 is mechanical so can I just swap in one of those or do I need to change the whole cluster at that point?

Where are they going to put the fuel filters?There is a place on the RH fender begging for a fuel filter to be hung there.

Is that a charcoal canister in the foreground?Throw it away its horrible

I have to admit, I had to look up what you were talking about here since I've only ever owned diesel cruisers. I haven't heard of a charcoal canister other than what they use to make Jack Daniels!

The fuel system is part of what hasn't been finished converting, I well imagine that the fuel filter would replace the charcoal canister since the new AirDog separator is on the inside frame rail below the driver's feet. Any ideas on what kind of fuel filter and mounting bracket I should source? OEM or aftermarket?

 

[Cruisin']

The IP is the injection pump, which is the only fuel pump on these, unless you add a pusher pump externally of the fuel tank.

The factory fuel filter bracket mounts fairly close to where the charcoal canister is. That mounting should work nicely.

 

[bsmith123]

nice one

Looks like you stumbled onto a good thing there!

 

[roscoFJ73]

Thanks all, that's the good feedback and collective thought that I need since this thing feels a bit foreign to me still.



So, a question on the tach. I thought I read on another post that the tach gets its signal from the IP, but here you say the fuel pump. I haven't physically dug in and familiarized myself enough with the engine to know for sure yet. The fuel pump would make more sense though since I know one of the mods is pulling the pump out of the tank.

Fuel pump = Injector pump in my vernacular. Toyotas dont have a fuel pump in the tank as it is built into the IP and works quite well.
The IP has a sender,about 25mmin dia at the rear(engine side) of the IP with 2 wires coming from it.

The big question I'm trying to figure out with the gauges is the speedo. The 96 is electronic and the 1HZ uses mechanical. I thought I read that the 93-95 is mechanical so can I just swap in one of those or do I need to change the whole cluster at that point?

Sorry dont know anything about electronic speedos

I have to admit, I had to look up what you were talking about here since I've only ever owned diesel cruisers. I haven't heard of a charcoal canister other than what they use to make Jack Daniels!

The fuel system is part of what hasn't been finished converting, I well imagine that the fuel filter would replace the charcoal canister since the new AirDog separator is on the inside frame rail below the driver's feet. Any ideas on what kind of fuel filter and mounting bracket I should source? OEM or aftermarket?

I was surprised the canister was still in there at such an advanced stage of the engine swap.I think I ditched mine before the old 3F came out,just to make more room.
There is lots of filtration systems. OEM works fine for me. What you need is something that takes inexpensive and easy to source filters and can handle 60 litres per hour without slowing the flow down.
The feed pump inside the injector pump pumps about 4 x as much as the engine needs.It uses the excess to cool the inj pump and then sends the excess back to the tank.The FSM says its as high as 900cc a minute ,which is 54 litres an hour .
The OEM filter on a 1HZ has 2 parts ,the main filter and the prefilter. The prefilters(cheap) means you dont have to replace the main filter (expensive)so often.
This was an option on early 1HZs then became standard(Im assuming 80 series were the same as 7* series inthis regard)
Lots of pics of filtration systems on ebay with prices to give you some idea.

Another good thing to have with them is a separator with a glass bowl to see the water . Some also have alarms to alert you about the water.
To be honest ,I have had about 2 drops of water in 7 years.
I see your separator is going down below,its not where I would have put one,even though toyota saw fit to place them there on the older models.
It can always be changed
Im thinking about fitting one of these as I dont have a water trap at the moment
ABC New Inventors win recognises Water Watch ability to catch big $$$$ diesel fuel disasters - Information Articles Go See Australia Directory
.

 

[Leitrum3]

So this may show my lack of experience for anything but my current engine, however, it must be asked. The only engine I have ever worked on or had any semblance of understanding is my current 3B (soon to find a new home) which has a fuel/water separator (or sedimenter?) way back by the tank. Then there's a fuel filter just before the IP. The separator in this case probably doesn't provide much more than water filtration given the age of the thing so it's logical to have another fuel filter.

On the new rig, however, the PO had the shop install one of the AirDog systems. From what I'm reading about them, does that then take the place of the sedimenter and multi-layered fuel filter that you're referencing? Or do I really need an additional filtration system beyond this?

As far as the canister still being there, I mentioned in my initial post that I haven't had a sit down with the shop yet to fully understand where things are at so this may be something they've already planned for as part of finishing the fuel system mods. I'll know what's what on Wednesday!

 

[Leitrum3]

Down here all A442F have some sort of electronics .. ( solenoids to control it / power / ETC button / 2nd start / OD on the shift lever ) no OBD nothing ..

In reality, I only brought up the OBD question from my fear of the DMV folk in Oregon since I haven't registered a car here yet. I thought I heard that they liked to test these if your car is supposed to have them. Back home in Alaska they don't even take a second look at rigs like these. They just slap on a sticker that says "Diesel" and wave you off!

As for the A442, the one I have was sourced out of Australia (confirmed with owner) and has the valve body kit and torque converter from Wholesale Automatics. So, there really shouldn't be anything needing to talk with anything else. I'm just not sure that any of the "2nd", "Power" and other type buttons will ever work. Were there different buttons/features provided for the US spec A440, which I imagine would be more similar to a hydraulic A442?

 

[roscoFJ73]

So this may show my lack of experience for anything but my current engine, however, it must be asked. The only engine I have ever worked on or had any semblance of understanding is my current 3B (soon to find a new home) which has a fuel/water separator (or sedimenter?) way back by the tank. Then there's a fuel filter just before the IP. The separator in this case probably doesn't provide much more than water filtration given the age of the thing so it's logical to have another fuel filter.

On the new rig, however, the PO had the shop install one of the AirDog systems. From what I'm reading about them, does that then take the place of the sedimenter and multi-layered fuel filter that you're referencing? Or do I really need an additional filtration system beyond this?

As far as the canister still being there, I mentioned in my initial post that I haven't had a sit down with the shop yet to fully understand where things are at so this may be something they've already planned for as part of finishing the fuel system mods. I'll know what's what on Wednesday!

I dont know much about them.It has an inline pump which is not really necessary on a denso rotary pump but it appears the Airdog needs it.
I would ask them about it or send off an email to the manufacturer.
Ask how many litres an hour/minute it can handle remembering the denso pump needs its flow to keep the pump cool.
Toyota worked out a good system suitable for all parts of the world and it rarely fails.
The water trap I linked is something that does not affect the flow of the OEM system,which is why I would have it.

 

[Tapage]

check if the IP Tach sender it's attached ... ( IP facing block )

YOu can swap speed sensor in the tail of t-case and use electronic speedo ..

 

[Leitrum3]

Okay, so I finally got a chance to talk with the guys at the shop about the rig and where everything is at today and naturally, there were some new questions. I think this is the first 1HZ or 1HD-T that they have swapped so there is some figuring out on their end, as well as some “homework” items for myself just so I’m not spending money unnecessarily. Below is the list of everything I can think of from our conversation that is relevant to both the above posts and moving forward. For the purposes of the items below, I’ll say that I’m having them get it to a point that I can drive it around with speedo and tach. I figure I can fix the interior stuff myself and fine tune it over the course of the year.

- Coolant lines: need to be routed
- Engine accessories: not hooked up yet, but should be quick for them.
- Fuel Tank mods: complete
- Fuel filter: Airdog, as previously discussed. Charcoal filter is just hanging out for no good reason.
- Radiator: from the 1FZ-FE but it doesn’t seem to need to change. Is this everyone else’s experience?
- IP appears to have the tach wiring already, but they haven’t sorted out where and how it all hooks up. I haven’t ordered a new tach yet either. Per the 1HZ specific tach I saw on Cruiserparts.net, is there also some sort of T-Belt sensor?
- Speedometer hook ups: Apparently they swapped the T-case from the original tranny onto the A442 so were able to keep the electric speedo sensor which will work nicely with the existing speedo. Tapage called it!
- Cruise Control: There is an actuator sitting in the back of the truck but I’m not sure what engine it came off of. I kind of assume that the wiring for this won’t play nicely with what’s in my rig currently…
- Air filter assembly: I guess the PO sold this with the engine but my understanding is that the diesels need a larger output to the engine than the gassers anyway? Is grabbing a filter box off a parts rig FZJ80 out of the question? They had proposed using a K&N cone filter, but I have reservations about it…
- A/C System: No pump, pulley or bracket. From looking through the FSM, it seems I have a PCS actuator and not an ACSD so I think I’m also missing a solenoid for the fast idle as well. Wiring up the AC system is also questionable. I will likely put all this off for a while.
- Glow timer & relay: Currently there is nothing. Ideally I’d love the factory timer, but I’m seeing the consensus is still to go with the “Wilson” switch even in the newer rigs. So I guess that just leaves me to source a glow relay and find a place for the button on my already crowded dash.

Other items I’m not sure of the status on that I’ve read that need to be changed or addressed in some way are as follows:
- H20 sender
- Oil pressure sender
- Fuel cut solenoid (Isn’t this already part of the IP?)
- Fuel filter sensor

The biggest question I came away with from our conversation today was actually the throttle cables, which seems simple enough, but I get the sense that all of my parts came from very different vehicles. There is the cable that comes directly out of the firewall and links into the throttle assembly above the valve cover, and then there is the throttle cable off of the A442. The catch for me is the cable (kickdown? TV?) from the A442 doesn’t have anywhere to go currently. From what I’ve been able to ascertain from the FSM’s and various posts, it seems like there were two types of IP’s for the 1HZ’s, some with the HAC and ASDC, and some w/o HAC and with a PCS instead (like mine). What I can’t figure out is whether this was specific to the location the original vehicle was sold at, or if there was some other indicator? My fear of course is that the difference is between M/T and A/T and I’ll now have to source a different IP.

Pictures below I stole from different posts by both Tapage and Rosco (Sorry and thanks!) showing the two different types of pumps. The last photo shows my IP and the kick down cable just hanging out.

Thanks to all who have offered their thoughts thus far, it's sorely needed!

 

[roscoFJ73]

Radiator will be ok ,others have used the 3F radiator which is smaller in volume than the 1HZ with no bad side effects.

T belt sensor,I think its just the one that tells you when its due.On the earlier models it would come on a 100k after it was reset.

In oz all the landcruisers use the same filtration. A 1FZFE probably uses more volume of air than a 1HZ,so I cant see it being a problem.
K&N are rubbish.
Oil pressure sender should be the same I would have thought,its used on about 30 toyotas,diesel and petrol.
Fuel cut solenoid is on the pump. I can see yours ,it has a green wire coming off it like mine.You can test by applying 12v and listening for the click.
H20 sender? Do you mean coolant sensor? I just plugged my old 3F wire to the 1HZ and it worked fine .
There are at least 2 other sensors that adjust the glow time to the engine temp.
Fuel filter sensor requires the dash light that comes with diesels.Im sure there is a way of rigging something up to alert you of water.

The ASCD is a legal(smog) requirement in some countries and will not affect the engine if you dont have one.
HAC were an option in oz I think and later became standard.You wont need one at sea level and you are right,its a location thing.
There are only 2 pumps AFAIK when it comes to the 1HZ and that is pre99 and post 99(the year will differ in other countries)
The newer one has 2 more teeth on the timing belt.
You can id the pump by the part number on the pump.

The 1HZ a/c requires all the brackets and pulleys to be off the correct series. The 70 series compressor sits 10mm further to the rear than an 80 series.
I would leave it for later,get it up and running to the point where you can take over.

I used the fast idle solenoid for the AC from the 3F engine,you could use one off a 60 series

 

[roscoFJ73]

If I ever need a glow plug timer again ,Ill try one of these.
UNIVERSAL GLOW PLUG TIMER 12 VOLT | eBay

 

[Tapage]

I saw in your engine your throttle cable .. you have the auto kick down cable ( red tip ) and the throttle one attached right there .. sure you can make it work.

When I did my tranny swap I kept my old t-case with speed sensor and all .. match it to my H150 and work wonders ..

Believe all other questions are covered by Rosco ..

 

[Leitrum3]

The ASCD is a legal(smog) requirement in some countries and will not affect the engine if you dont have one.
HAC were an option in oz I think and later became standard.You wont need one at sea level and you are right,its a location thing.
There are only 2 pumps AFAIK when it comes to the 1HZ and that is pre99 and post 99(the year will differ in other countries)
The newer one has 2 more teeth on the timing belt.
You can id the pump by the part number on the pump.

I've scoured the FSM's for the 1HZ, A442 and FZJ/HZJ Chassis and I'm still stumped. Mine is definitely the earlier model (Type A), of which there also seem to be 2 styles per the 1HZ FSM on EM-29 (Type A and Type B, which are images 1 and 2 from post 16). So a little of what I'm taking away from this is that there isn't anyone out there whose IP looks like the second image in post 16 and also has an automatic transmission with a kick down cable. That, or the kick down connects to something other than the IP. If that's the case, then what does it hook into? I'm just not really sure what's missing or what other routing there could possibly be. If I had a manual, this wouldn't be an issue...Which makes me wonder if this engine came from a manual truck originally.

It's probably obvious I'm trying to find a good solution that doesn't include modifying the throttle body unnecessarily. If there's a good and proper way that doesn't include swapping out the IP, I'd love to find it. When I get back into town on Monday, I think I'll go spend some time looking this thing over first hand for a few hours...