Steering Shaft Deflection Noticed

[Delancy]

Due to major delays in returning a PS gearbox to scotia, as part of a warranty swap, and replacing, I had no choice but to outsource the gearbox replacement.

At a very reputable, but small, mom and pop shop two miles from house, for what should've been a two hour job, that's uncovered an issue that I can't find and threads on, so hoping that input may help correct the issue.

During free-play adjustment, tech (FJC buddy) noticed an undue amount of play, and when we were discussing, turned the wheels and he noticed quite a but of deflection in the steering shaft, itself. Upon measuring, it's almost 3/4", as best measured.

Checked all other components, just to make sure, and everything appears to be in great shape, but from the firewall to the gearbox, the shaft appears to bend (deflect) about 3/4" each direction from its centerline.

Obviously, the 37x12.5 Krawlers are exerting more pressure on all the steering components from the box down, but I wouldn't have imagined they'd affect the column, itself, even parked.

Is this an isolated issue?

Anyone know of a stronger steering shaft, or means to brace with bearing midway?

 

[bmac1996acc]

Sounds like the grommet that goes around the shaft at the firewall is shot. It seems to support the shaft somewhat.

 

[Delancy]

It appears to be tight on the shaft. Rag joint appears to be good and when turning under load, moves as I'd think it should.

Searched these earlier, but nothing definitive.

https://forum.ih8mud.com/80-series-...e-replacing-upper-steering-shaft-u-joint.html

https://forum.ih8mud.com/80-series-tech/367408-rag-joint-worn-unnecessary-want-delete.html

https://forum.ih8mud.com/80-series-tech/518301-how-much-slop-steering-shaft-normal.html

 

[bmac1996acc]

I'd try loosening the collars on the splines on each side of the U-joint and then retightening them. Maybe when the new steering box was installed it's pushing against the U-joint causing binding. Just a guess.

 

[Delancy]

Hmmmmm........going to try and see result.

 

[LT]

Get rid of the crap rag joints and convert to a true steering joint

http://www.flamingriver.com/index.php/products/c0005

 

[bmac1996acc]

Get rid of the **** rag joints and convert to a true steering joint

http://www.flamingriver.com/index.php/products/c0005

... rag joints on your link

 

[scotia]

Here.

View attachment steering components.pdf

not much between the gear and steering wheel. Remove it and sleeve it with DOM.lol

 

[IdahoDoug]

You say you can't imagine it would affect things "even when parked." FYI, that's the MOST steering effort there is. A stopped vehicle means you are dragging the tires in an arc and is why when you move a vehicle, steering effort instantly stops. Also, you don't mention it, but a guy who has 37's on his truck generally has a lift and that generally changes castor. A guy who has a lift and 37's also generally has aftermarket wheels which he may or may not have purchased with the correct wheel offset.

SO. If you have nonstock wheels that stick out, a lot of castor from a lift, and much larger tires, AND do your test at a dead stop you would expect some strain on steering shafts.

DougM

 

[Delancy]

Here.

not much between the gear and steering wheel. Remove it and sleeve it with DOM.lol

Pic isn't working.

 

[ericbirk]

I had some shaft up and down movement as well that was part of my sloppy steering issue. I used a split flange bearing on the interior side of the firewall and bolted to the same holes that rubber bushing/seal bolts too. Stopped all up and down shaft movement entirely.

If the deflection is right at the firewall on yours I can take a picture for you tomorrow to show you what I mean?

 

[Delancy]

You say you can't imagine it would affect things "even when parked." FYI, that's the MOST steering effort there is.

Moving boulders on the trail requires more.

I realize the difference between turning the wheel parked and moving.

My concern isn't the effort the steering components are exerting, but the steering column itself, considering it requires little effort to turn, parked, yet seeing deflection in the steering shaft.

I had some shaft up and down movement as well that was part of my sloppy steering issue. I used a split flange bearing on the interior side of the firewall and bolted to the same holes that rubber bushing/seal bolts too. Stopped all up and down shaft movement entirely.

If the deflection is right at the firewall on yours I can take a picture for you tomorrow to show you what I mean?

Measuring at the firewall, since there's no way to check further down the shaft.

Would be interested to see what you came up with, because it sounds similar to what is envisioned.

 

[Delancy]

Get rid of the crap rag joints and convert to a true steering joint

http://www.flamingriver.com/index.php/products/c0005

You're an expensive date.

The advice given on steering has already cost me a fortune.

Now, which one?

 

[ericbirk]

Here is what I used.

 

[newtomelx]

More info please. Who makes it, what model #......I have been waiting for a better solution than what Mr. T offers for this, just what I had envisioned.

 

[newtomelx]

I think I found the flange.....http://www.kml-bearing.com/products...serts_show.jsp?bearing_no=PF204&cat_id=110313

what is the bearing size or part #?

Thanks in advance and ...apologize to Delancy for the thread hijack!!

 

[ericbirk]

I can't take the credit, potlatch is the one who told me about it.
I dont know the model #, I just went to a bearing supply shop and grabbed it. I got a couple Allen bolts of the same size (longer length), a few nuts to go on the backside to hold everything tight, and I believe a 3/4"ID bearing and split flange. Just measure the diameter of the shaft, you will have to clearance the inner race a bit to fit. I used one stock hole on the flange and had to drill one for the other side.

Tightened up the steering quite a bit, and takes the load off the rubber bushing/seal which should help it last longer too.

 

[Delancy]

Is the general consensus that the firewall area is the location for movement, versus the shaft deflecting?

 

[ericbirk]

Is the general consensus that the firewall area is the location for movement, versus the shaft deflecting?

Mine was moving about 1/2"+ right at that bushing/seal on the firewall, which would deflect the whole shaft. It's not now

I could also tell it was putting stress on that bushing/seal as the shaft was not centered anymore, due to that bushing being worn.

newtomelx, that is the right flange. The bearing I got was an skf with 2 set screws and a grease nipple.

 

[Delancy]

..apologize to Delancy for the thread hijack!!

Yeah, you should be.

Reported your post in the thread for being diversionary.

Thanks a lot.

Edited: An obvious joke, but in case the level of sarcasm intended, wasn't implied.