Worn CAM - Typical wear?

[malcb]

Pulled the sump on the "spare" engine I got in a "spares" LC (not running and no known history) and found the CAM lobes are very pitted.

Is this normal wear or does it suggest oil breakdown and accelerated wear?

 

[peterb]

I hope not as that is how mine look.
Peter

 

[igotta40]

Looks exactly like mine.

I'm doing a rebuild and my Land Cruiser 2F expert professional mechanic advised I should replace it, also the bearings, lifters and both timing gears. I don't get it, the truck was running fine. Blowby/smoke out of the exhaust pipe was the reason for my decision to rebuild. No valvetrain issues that I saw, vacuum gauge was always spot on. I trust him and so I am going to take his advice tho and replace. SOR has a regrind with resurfaced lifters and new bearings in stock for around $250.00. Nybody had any issues with that product?

Sorry if this is a hijack but maybe we can help each other.

 

[IDave]

I don't claim expertise, but I will share what I know.

That pitting is not wear, per se, but, essentially from rust. It is not a normal amount of pitting from what I've seen, and could lead to further deterioration.

To really know if there's wear, you need to measure the cam lobes. I suspect you have that, but my eye isn't that good, and we only see one in your picture.

If your lobes are worn your valves aren't opening properly and you'll have issues tuning and running your truck.

 

[FLYINGLOW]

That looks to me like all the F and 2F engines I have torn into, about 8 of them. I believe it is from incorrectly adjusted valves. The lifters will be dished out and pitted also. Pretty well need all new.

 

[malcb]

Interesting, the only thing I know about the engine is it was in a FJ45 that sat out in the open for years, I think in Scotland.

When I got it most steering parts and interior was gone, no floor at all in the cab, no tray and the frame was so rusted through it was sagging, carb and brake master & booster were gone. The tires were all still inflated, 7.50R16 cross ply on split rims completely rusted up. I had to scrap most of it but kept the engine and axles.

I figured the cam would need replacing if I use the engine, I was just interested if the wear was typical, most worn cams I have come across are more polished particularly as any surface hardening wears off, this is more like the galling that occur when the lubrication isn't present.

I have to say the rust theory is also quite possiable, it would be the worn parts that would be most likely to rust.

 

[malcb]

Looks exactly like mine.

I'm doing a rebuild and my Land Cruiser 2F expert professional mechanic advised I should replace it, also the bearings, lifters and both timing gears. I don't get it, the truck was running fine. Blowby/smoke out of the exhaust pipe was the reason for my decision to rebuild. No valvetrain issues that I saw, vacuum gauge was always spot on. I trust him and so I am going to take his advice tho and replace. SOR has a regrind with resurfaced lifters and new bearings in stock for around $250.00. Nybody had any issues with that product?

Sorry if this is a hijack but maybe we can help each other.

No thats very helpful, particularly if someone can provide some thoughts on the SOR kit. The price sounds good, pity the delivery and import duty to the UK will double it for me.

 

[cruiserbrett]

that wear is galling of the surface hardening on the lobe of the camshaft, where the spring tension causes the most pressure. Poor lubrication will accelerate it, but its common on the F/2F cams due to poor surface hardening...


that cam can be welded and reground and re-hardened, or you can source another cam. JimC has posted up some replacement aftermarket cams he likes in the best 2F thread...

 

[IDave]

That's interesting, Brett.

Again, I am trading on the experience of others who know more than I do, but I've been told that reground cams may not have the same life as new. I'd hate to replace again after 50K miles. That's why I went with new.

 

[malcb]

Thanks, easiest option for me in the UK is likely to be regrinding not many 2F cams around, just one of those things that is a PITA for a one off, shop won't know the cam, won't know the material etc.

Fewer and fewer good machine shops in business every year, everone drives the same cars from germany or japan, uses the same aftermarket parts from germany or japan and very few of them do more than mess with the lights and stick bodywork on.

 

[malcb]

That's interesting, Brett.

Again, I am trading on the experience of others who know more than I do, but I've been told that reground cams may not have the same life as new. I'd hate to replace again after 50K miles. That's why I went with new.

If someone knows what they are doing a regound cam can be as good or better than the original for wear, problem is many don't know what they are doing and lots of reground cams are profiled for more lift, sometimes even over a shorter duration adding to the pressure on the lobe.

 

[greytandy]

A little late to this thread, but my lobe was worn exactly like that. I wish I still had the pics. Mine was throwing a lot of metal particles. I ultimately had the engine replaced (long story).

 

[IDave]

If someone knows what they are doing a regound cam can be as good or better than the original for wear, problem is many don't know what they are doing and lots of reground cams are profiled for more lift, sometimes even over a shorter duration adding to the pressure on the lobe.

Logical. You'd have to trust your cam builder.

 

[3doghouse]

Summarized from https://forum.ih8mud.com/60-series-wagons/94863-engine-rebuild-questions.html

Cam and lifters almost always need replaced above 120K miles. The OEM cam is chromed (very thin) or surface hardened on yours (still too thin)...

...Go with new lifters from Cruiserparts.net. OEM at a good price.
Use a quality USA billet cam, names like Melling or Sealed power...

...Some things should be supplied by a non-OEM manufacturer (FelPro manifold gasket, Melling camshaft, stainless valves, steel cam gear)...

 

[Mark W]

that is normal wear
it is not from rust
it is probably not due to mis-adjustment
just lots of wear
it is time to replace


Mark

 

[grant5127]

that is normal wear
it is not from rust
it is probably not due to mis-adjustment
just lots of wear
it is time to replace


Mark

X2... time to play taps... along with the lifters and bearings....

 

[IDave]

appreciate the correction(s)

 

[donny paradise]

that cam needs to go to the recyclers