Where can I test my ignition ignitor?

[alsalsa]

Sorry guys for the one-liners. Not mechanically inclined...that's why I had a mechanic check it out. Already changed intake hose and put in new oem filter. The mechanic is stumped. Looking for a mechanic that can come by and diagnose this issue. 818 area code. He checked fuses in hood area, fuel pump comes on and took a test light around. He did not see any power from the ignitor to distributor. No spark or power in the distributor, his words. He also pulled a spark plug and probed with the test light. Hope this helps more. His educated guess was the ignitor...I put another one in and same problem...vehicle cranks over but will not start. Thanks again.

After leaving Jiffy Lube I noticed vehicle seemed like it wanted to stall when braking. Went to my destination. When ready to come home the vehicle would start, but shut off if no gas given. I made it home by applying brakes and accelerator, seemed like I was driving stick, parked it. Later I tried to start it and no luck. Turns over with plenty of power, but will not start.

 

[alsalsa]

After leaving Jiffy Lube I noticed vehicle seemed like it wanted to stall when braking. Went to my destination. When ready to come home the vehicle would start, but shut off if no gas given. I made it home by applying brakes and accelerator, seemed like I was driving stick, parked it. Later I tried to start it and no luck. Turns over with plenty of power, but will not start.

Tool R Us...Fuses in hood area were checked.

 

[Tools R Us]

Tool R Us...Fuses in hood area were checked.

Fusible links at the battery?

 

[alsalsa]

Fusible links at the battery?

Can you explain further. Again not mechanically inclined...trying.

 

[Tools R Us]

Connected to the positive terminal of the battery are a couple of small wires that run a few inches to a small black box, just outside of the battery tray. These are fusible links, a type of wire that burns/breaks to save the harness. A simple way to test them is to pull on each of them, if they feel solid, likely good, if they stretch, fall in half, are broken, are bad. The "B" fusible link, (connects to a white with a red stripe wire after the box) is the main power supply to the ignition.

 

[alsalsa]

Connected to the positive terminal of the battery are a couple of small wires that run a few inches to a small black box, just outside of the battery tray. These are fusible links, a type of wire that burns/breaks to save the harness. A simple way to test them is to pull on each of them, if they feel solid, likely good, if they stretch, fall in half, are broken, are bad. The "B" fusible link, (connects to a white with a red stripe wire after the box) is the main power supply to the ignition.

Thanks, will check tomorrow first thing. Thanks for your patience.

 

[toyteg08]

What did you find when you checked your Mass Airflow Sensor? Was it plugged in properly? Jiffy Lube never fully removed it, right? They just popped the new K&N in there?

Did your mechanic meter out the ignition coil? Is the coil wire in okay condition?

Your fuel pump primes up, correct? Do you get three audible clicks from under the hood above the driver's side fender before startup?

If not, have him check your main relay.

Is the fuse for the ECM (the car's computer) blown?

Just stuff to check out off the top of my head.

Jon

 

[alsalsa]

Did emergency trouble shooting; Fusible links visual check look good, pulled felt solid
Main fusible link-OK
AM1-OK
AM2-No voltmeter
15A EFI located in the under hood fuse box-OK
7.5A Ignition located in the fuse box at the drivers -OK
15A ECU-IG located in the fuse box at the drivers knee-OK
What did you find when you checked your Mass Airflow Sensor? Was it plugged in properly? Jiffy Lube never fully removed it, right? They just popped the new K&N in there?
Did your mechanic meter out the ignition coil? Is the coil wire in okay condition?No. Coil wire looks ok, mechanic does not want to return.
Your fuel pump primes up, correct? Do you get three audible clicks from under the hood above the driver's side fender before startup?YES
Is the fuse for the ECM (the car's computer) blown?WHERE IS IT LOCATED?

 

[alsalsa]

Also, when I turn key I see no CEL light and my shifter does shift.

 

[toyteg08]

If you checked the EFI fuse and it was good, the ECM probably is getting power, assuming there is power to that point already.

I can see a few scenarios here. and a few things left you should try, or have a mechanic try.

Meter out the coil to rule that out. If it's out of spec, your truck won't start. It's the box that the 7th ignition wires goes to. Trace it from the middle of your distributor cap, over to the black box sort of down and in front of the master brake cylinder (going on memory here). That box is your ignition coil. Measure the "primary resistance" between the two terminals + and -, and then the "secondary resistance" between the + terminal and the coil wire ouput. I don't know what Toyota's specs are for the coil, so you will need to call a dealer and ask them, or reference the FSM. Your coil readings should be close to spec. Do you know how to use an ohmmeter? That's the measuring tool you'll need.

Second thing, if it were me, I'd measure the fusible links, instead of relying on pulling them to determine whther or not they're good. Yeah, they probably are, but still, just to be 100% sure...

Third, you might have a dead ECM. I doubt it though. But it is a possibility.

Fourth, maybe your wiring harness got toasted somewhere by the EGR pipe. Our trucks do have that issue in North America, where we run an EGR system. You're probably going to need to have a knowledgeable mechanic to check that out if you want to perform continuity tests on the wiring. You could do a visual inspection however. Search on the topic to hopefully find some pictures of where the EGR pipe is, and where the wiring harness intersects it at. It's on the driver's side firewall, the EGR valve (the one closest to the fender) and the VSV valve that control it (the one more toward the middle of the engine bay) being the two saucer shaped things, and then the EGR pipe you can see going from the EGR valve down towards under the truck. You should see where the wring harness is right by it for a section of length.

Also, I've read that the wiring harness can sometimes short out against the sheet metal somewhere by the passenger's side firewall, where it goes into the cabin. You'll have to search more for info on that, not too familiar with it.

I think, personally, it has something to do with the doofuses at Jiffy Lube, since your truck was fine until they messed with it. It would stand to reason, IMO. I'm wondering if the wiring to your MAF got screwed up and shorted when they replaced the air filter.

Read this thread, especially the second page:

https://forum.ih8mud.com/80-series-...e-replacing-ecm-help-northern-new-mexico.html

Let us know what you find.

Jon

 

[CJF]

I think, personally, it has something to do with the doofuses at Jiffy Lube, since your truck was fine until they messed with it. It would stand to reason, IMO. I'm wondering if the wiring to your MAF got screwed up and shorted when they replaced the air filter.

This is what I keep coming back to as well.

Curtis

 

[alsalsa]

If you checked the EFI fuse and it was good, the ECM probably is getting power, assuming there is power to that point already.

I can see a few scenarios here. and a few things left you should try, or have a mechanic try.

Meter out the coil to rule that out. If it's out of spec, your truck won't start. It's the box that the 7th ignition wires goes to. Trace it from the middle of your distributor cap, over to the black box sort of down and in front of the master brake cylinder (going on memory here). That box is your ignition coil. Measure the "primary resistance" between the two terminals + and -, and then the "secondary resistance" between the + terminal and the coil wire ouput. I don't know what Toyota's specs are for the coil, so you will need to call a dealer and ask them, or reference the FSM. Your coil readings should be close to spec. Do you know how to use an ohmmeter? That's the measuring tool you'll need.

Second thing, if it were me, I'd measure the fusible links, instead of relying on pulling them to determine whther or not they're good. Yeah, they probably are, but still, just to be 100% sure...

Third, you might have a dead ECM. I doubt it though. But it is a possibility.

Fourth, maybe your wiring harness got toasted somewhere by the EGR pipe. Our trucks do have that issue in North America, where we run an EGR system. You're probably going to need to have a knowledgeable mechanic to check that out if you want to perform continuity tests on the wiring. You could do a visual inspection however. Search on the topic to hopefully find some pictures of where the EGR pipe is, and where the wiring harness intersects it at. It's on the driver's side firewall, the EGR valve (the one closest to the fender) and the VSV valve that control it (the one more toward the middle of the engine bay) being the two saucer shaped things, and then the EGR pipe you can see going from the EGR valve down towards under the truck. You should see where the wring harness is right by it for a section of length.

Also, I've read that the wiring harness can sometimes short out against the sheet metal somewhere by the passenger's side firewall, where it goes into the cabin. You'll have to search more for info on that, not too familiar with it.

I think, personally, it has something to do with the doofuses at Jiffy Lube, since your truck was fine until they messed with it. It would stand to reason, IMO. I'm wondering if the wiring to your MAF got screwed up and shorted when they replaced the air filter.

Read this thread, especially the second page:

https://forum.ih8mud.com/80-series-...e-replacing-ecm-help-northern-new-mexico.html

Let us know what you find.

Jon

Went this am to tinker around the LC. Pulled the maf plug, cleaned both ends. Left it unplugged and went to turn on the engine. Also, unplugged and plugged the fuses in the engine compartment. Turned key to on, did not start engine and low and behold the cel light came on! Felt lucky and started the vehicle...started and shut off, did it twice without hitting the accelerator. Left it at that for now and came in to update. Where can I go from here?

 

[CJF]

Where can I go from here?

To clarify:

It started with the Air Flow Meter (not Mass Air Flow sensor like on a 95-97) disconnected?

 

[Gumby]

Whatever you paid the "mechanic" was entirely wasted.

The MAF testing procedure was suggested in the last thread last week.

Either the Jiffy Goobers screwed up your MAF wiring, or you told them to screw up your MAF by having them install a K&N without following the proper dry time procedure.

I'm going with "B" although you better make sure the wiring is OK before you replace the MAF and possibly fry the new one.

 

[alsalsa]

To clarify:

It started with the Air Flow Meter (not Mass Air Flow sensor like on a 95-97) disconnected?

Unplugged the harness from the housing. The harness held on by a clip.

 

[alsalsa]

Unplugged the harness from the housing. The harness held on by a clip.

Plugged harness back to maf housing and went to start truck...turned key, no cel and truck would not start. Unplugged harness again, cel present, truck started but would not stay on. Is it safe to say the problem is with the maf? Do you clean it? Replace it?

 

[TrickyT]

Negative!

Different car, same procedure:

Testing the igniter (ICM) off-the-car

Great website!

Jon

A bit off-topic for alsalsa's problem, but the testing procedure described in this link is overly simplistic and won't do a decent test of a 1FZ-FE igniter at all because of additional built-in protective circuitry. If there was an easy on or off-vehicle test, it'd be in the FSM. The autoshop101 link that George posted provides the details of why you can't do a static test of the igniter.

 

[CJF]

Hey guys,

Just for my own understanding, and to make sure we're all on the same page:

Doesn't a 93-94 have a gate-style Air Flow Meter on top of the air filter housing (as on a 91-92), rather than the wire Mass Air Flow sensor on a 95-97??

Or am I off base here?

Curtis

Plugged harness back to maf housing and went to start truck...turned key, no cel and truck would not start. Unplugged harness again, cel present, truck started but would not stay on. Is it safe to say the problem is with the maf? Do you clean it? Replace it?

 

[toyteg08]

Hey guys,

Just for my own understanding, and to make sure we're all on the same page:

Doesn't a 93-94 have a gate-style Air Flow Meter on top of the air filter housing (as on a 91-92), rather than the wire M*** Air Flow sensor on a 95-97??

Or am I off base here?

Curtis

Hmmm, dunno. I thought 93-97 were all a mass airflow setup. Mine's a '96, so I'm not positive about that; could be wrong.

Jon

 

[toyteg08]

Plugged harness back to maf housing and went to start truck...turned key, no cel and truck would not start. Unplugged harness again, cel present, truck started but would not stay on. Is it safe to say the problem is with the maf? Do you clean it? Replace it?

Seems safe to say your problem is either internal to the MAF, or in the wiring to it.

What you'll have to do now is follow the steps taken by MountainBum in the other thread I linked to.

For all intents and purposes of troubleshooting, VAF = MAF. Maybe the 94's do have a different design, I dunno. But, to quote MountainBum...

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"ECM SEEMS to be fine. I unplugged the TP and VAF and my check light came back on!!!"
-----

This is what happened with you, correct? When you unplugged the MAF, right?


-----
"Then plugged in the TP and check light still on, then VAF and it all went bad, no check light."
-----

Okay, so....


-----
"So I checked voltage on the VCC and with the VAF unplugged, I had 5 good volts at the ECM and at the VAF plug."
-----

Check and see if you're good here.

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"Once I plugged in the VAF, the voltage went out, both at the ECM and at the VAF plug. So I started doing ohm checks on the VCC line. With the ECM unplugged, VAF unplugged, and TP plugged in the resistance in the VCC line was about 3K ohms, normal."
-----

So, here he checked the wiring between the computer (ECM) and the MAF/VAF/whatever. Do the same.


-----
"I then plugged in the VAF and the resistance went totally haywire. This indicates that the VAF went bad and has grounded out the VCC line inside the VAF somewhere. So I am now searching local yards for used VAF."
-----

This is probably what will happen to you. Either the MAF is messed up internally, or one or more of the wires between the MAF and the ECM is going to measure way out of whack.

Jon