Troubleshooting the steering

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S

schaff70

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Been reading and searching the forum for the past week trying to identify a general vague steering feel in my 2001 LC.

Bumpstop feedback feels like one of the wheels changes direction slightly and just off center steering wheel movements feel like they aren't connected to the wheels.

Came home tonight and had my daughter inside turning the wheel from center to 2 o'clock and back to 10 o'clock with the engine off while I was checking the movement in the engine bay. Didn't see any play in the u-joints on the steering shaft, but when the wheel changes direction i'm hearing a slight knock where the shaft connects to the rack.

Any ideas? Am I looking at the dreaded rack replacement?

I know I don't post a lot, but I always search for solutions first.

Thanks in advance.
-Todd
 
If play in rack & pinion gear between input shaft and output shafts, then rack may be bad. Not so common.

More common:
Rack mounting bushing are worn out. Just replace bushing. (steering wanders left and right down the HWY, with speed constant.)
Lower ball joint worn out. Replace lower BJ.
TRE ball joint worn out. Replace TRE.
 
Failed to mention in the first post.
Replaced both outer tie rod ends in February, steering rack bushings were done a week ago with white line poly bushings.
Replaced the driver side upper control arm due to a torn ball joint boot in April.
Lower ball joints aren't leaking but the truck has 240k on it now.
Also has new front half shafts on both sides.
 
Rack, when first going bad is very difficult to diagnose. I do with one tire off the ground, rocking/twisting back and forth holding it at 3 & 9. I'll set up video camera to watch rack as I do this. The difficult part for me is "seeing" if any play between rack housing and tie rod shaft or input shaft. They should move together as rack assembly moves side to side about 1/4". You may want to take to a few good front end shops, see what they say.

I just reboot to upper ball joint boots a few days ago and replaced both lower ball joints.
Leaking at ball joint boot is not a test for ball joints itself.

Here a simple test with ball joint attached to knuckle (FSM test is different).

 
Thanks for the videos. I'll get the front wheels off the ground this week and check the lower ball joints.

With the mileage I'm reaching the point where a lot of the suspension bushings need replacing. It's not going to be cheap, but it's better than a car payment!
 
So i got the front end up off the ground tonight. Started on the driver side and using a jack handle moved the wheel up and down to check the lower ball joint. No visible play or any signs it is loose. As a preventative measure due to the mileage I ordered some 555 lower ball joints from Napa on the way home from work.

Decided to check the left to right movement on the driver's side (with the passenger side wheel on the ground). I have about an inch or slightly more movement from the inner tie rod on the driver side. See video below. The passenger side has some minor movement, but not nearly as bad as the driver's side.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="IMG 2308 - YouTube" frameborder="0" allow="autoplay; encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 
Not good, that looked excessive!
If the rack, other side and input shaft are holding fairly still while the TRE arm is moving that much, I'd say time for a new end shaft.

Edited to read: end shaft
 
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If you're mechanically inclined you could pull the boot and take a look at end shaft assembly. It may be all you need.
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But if pinion gear bad you'll be wasting time & money. Most shop if they see play or even see a leak, they'll recommend a new rack.
 
Your said other side had less play. If it looks good (end shaft), try to see if you've excessive play between it to input shaft.
 
Greatly appreciate the feedback on helping me troubleshoot this problem. Driver's side inner tie rod end was pretty bad. The grease resembled butterscotch pudding and lots of play in the joint. I went ahead and replaced the passenger side while I was there and no more steering issues.
When I pulled off the boot though I had less than 1/4 cup of power steering fluid inside the boot on the driver side and just a couple tablespoons on the passenger side. I'm figuring with the age the seals inside the rack are starting to wear.

Here's how bad that driver's side tie rod was.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="September 10, 2018 - YouTube" frameborder="0" allow="autoplay; encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 
One of the issues with using ploy is the increased stiffness. This will often bring out weak points much sooner than may have otherwise been seen.

I generally like to look at all aspect of rack before replacing any parts. If rack leaking, I add AT-205 reseal to reservoir and drive for 5 hours minimum. If leak does not stop then, replacement rack is the way to go. OEM kits are available to reseal if one wishes to go that route.

Most shop like Slee or Dealer will just replace the whole steering rack if any one of the following issue is detected: mount bushing bad, seals leaking, gears worn (play) or Rack End (AKA inner TRE) issue. They don't want to get into issue where they replace one component then find others fail a short time later.
 
I just read about adding AT-205 this morning and have it on my list of things to pick up this week. Hopefully it will help some of the rack seals last a little longer.

Between the tie rod ends and the new Ironman foam cell rear shocks, the truck is now fun to drive again.
 
I'd try (AT-205) before replacing rack ends. Also (I'll say again) I'd look very close if play between pinion and rack gears before AT-205. This will be easier to see with boots off, as you now have. If play in gears, I'd stop and just replace the rack.
 
bumping to see if anyone has a video or method for looking at play between pinion and rack gears.

Just took off drivers side inner and outer tie rods, had some fluid in the boot, maybe an ounce and a half. Some play in the tie rod but not much. Really hoping to not have to replace the rack but its the original rack and the car just hit 495,000 miles. Hoping I can just do the AT-205 and at least delay rack change for a bit.
 
Folks - my steering is pretty bad. Wanders a lot - a little nerve-wracking at times. I took it to the shop and the guy said the rack and pinon "was losing pressure" and needed to be replaced. Quoted me $550 parts / $250 labor.

EDIT: Called mechanic and he said the way he diagnosed it was by putting it up on the rack and cranking it up. When he did, the steering started pulling one direction. Said it's not the bushings.

Seems like a lot of guys are suggesting just replacing the rack bushings to solve this problem. The amount of drift/wander seems significant enough that I wonder if bushings could really be the problem.

Also - I'm seeing a lot of new steering racks on ebay for ~$170-$210 - are they any good or should I stick w/the official OEM parts?
 
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El Town FJ100 said:
Folks - my steering is pretty bad. Wanders a lot - a little nerve-wracking at times. I took it to the shop and the guy said the rack and pinon "was losing pressure" and needed to be replaced. Quoted me $550 parts / $250 labor.

EDIT: Called mechanic and he said the way he diagnosed it was by putting it up on the rack and cranking it up. When he did, the steering started pulling one direction. Said it's not the bushings.

Seems like a lot of guys are suggesting just replacing the rack bushings to solve this problem. The amount of drift/wander seems significant enough that I wonder if bushings could really be the problem.

Also - I'm seeing a lot of new steering racks on ebay for ~$170-$210 - are they any good or should I stick w/the official OEM parts?
Click to expand...
Thats actually a pretty good deal for this job, i'd consider it. I did it myself and while it is certainly doable it is a huge PIA. Those steering racks you're seeing are probably re manufactured ones where they replace seals and inner tie rods. I would just replace the rack and put in new bushings, the better tighter steering is very much worth it. IDK I put in a reman from detroit axle its good but theres almost certainly a chance it will need to replaced sooner than a new toyota one would have been. It really depends on your current cash situation. If youve got some tax money and want to keep the car for a while I would just have him put in a new oem steering rack with either new rubber or polyurethane bushings, and maybe replace hoses at the same time. If youre short on cash just do the reman and know youre probably gonna have to do it again in a couple years.
 
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