Toyota CT26 Upgrade - 13BT/12HT/1HDT/1HDFT (1 Viewer)

[Hulsty]

Driving/accelerating during the day I do not notice any smoke behind the car, at night I can see smoke in the headlights of cars following me.

Throttle response is good ,especially when rolling onto the throttle and winding her up to overtake etc. Maximum torque must be around the 2000rpm range, once max boost is reached the car feels pretty much linear in response as it builds rpm with EGTs not really climbing, it does not have the same top end pull around 2800rpm like it used to (which was climbing around 18psi on the turbo), though it most certainly is pulling better, just has more lower down so lessening the "feeling" of the top end.

During acceleration I have 15psi ~1800rpm I have not tried to load it back from rpm to see how it behaves as rpm drops.

I am going to call a tuner soon and ask what other adjustments they can play with and maybe get more out of it fuel wise and how much to have it dyno tuned.

Why is it so that I appear to have maxed out the fuel available yet the maximum fuel screw is not yet bottomed out?

 

[gbentink]

Driving/accelerating during the day I do not notice any smoke behind the car, at night I can see smoke in the headlights of cars following me.

Throttle response is good ,especially when rolling onto the throttle and winding her up to overtake etc. Maximum torque must be around the 2000rpm range, once max boost is reached the car feels pretty much linear in response as it builds rpm with EGTs not really climbing, it does not have the same top end pull around 2800rpm like it used to (which was climbing around 18psi on the turbo), though it most certainly is pulling better, just has more lower down so lessening the "feeling" of the top end.

During acceleration I have 15psi ~1800rpm I have not tried to load it back from rpm to see how it behaves as rpm drops.

I am going to call a tuner soon and ask what other adjustments they can play with and maybe get more out of it fuel wise and how much to have it dyno tuned.

Why is it so that I appear to have maxed out the fuel available yet the maximum fuel screw is not yet bottomed out?

Smoke at night is fairly common on old diesels - shows how dirty they are really.... and depends alot on engine overall condition and tune

Try reducing the spring tension on the boost compesator (should be an allen key nut on top of boost compensator and expose a toothed wheel on a thread much like the VE pumps. Just reduce preload 1 turn and you should feel the difference straight away (in the form of more boost at lower rpm, but watch for smoke). This is something to do actually after you fit an intercooler. Density has increased so you can change the ramp rate (fuel/psi ratio)

I suspect 18psi on your pump maxes out the boost compensation though I havent looked at a 13BT - I am assuming after playing with 12HT. You might actually pick up some midrange dropping boost to 19 or so psi if that is the case - bit of dyno time to help that (along with reducing wastegate tension.....

I would be tempted to set boost to 25psi and add a little programmed petrol injection.......

*EDIT* Caveat being check how bopost affects AFR's on your setup, so that you can find the sweet spot. If you increase boost too much and the turbo efficiency suffers, VE will suffer and more boost may mean less mass flow and lower AFR's - bad on every level.

With this turbo on a 1HDFT, it was found that at 2500rpm, 21psi made more power and better AFR's than at 24psi.

 

[Dougal]

Just crunching some numbers. You should have around 500Nm now. I was working on 230g/kwh which gives 110 cc/1000 shots to burn clean and cool in that much air.

 

[Hulsty]

Just crunching some numbers. You should have around 500Nm now. I was working on 230g/kwh which gives 110 cc/1000 shots to burn clean and cool in that much air.

Mine? Standard is about 285Nm ~2200rpm.

 

[Hulsty]

Smoke at night is fairly common on old diesels - shows how dirty they are really.... and depends alot on engine overall condition and tune

Try reducing the spring tension on the boost compesator (should be an allen key nut on top of boost compensator and expose a toothed wheel on a thread much like the VE pumps. Just reduce preload 1 turn and you should feel the difference straight away (in the form of more boost at lower rpm, but watch for smoke). This is something to do actually after you fit an intercooler. Density has increased so you can change the ramp rate (fuel/psi ratio)

I suspect 18psi on your pump maxes out the boost compensation though I havent looked at a 13BT - I am assuming after playing with 12HT. You might actually pick up some midrange dropping boost to 19 or so psi if that is the case - bit of dyno time to help that (along with reducing wastegate tension.....

I would be tempted to set boost to 25psi and add a little programmed petrol injection.......

*EDIT* Caveat being check how bopost affects AFR's on your setup, so that you can find the sweet spot. If you increase boost too much and the turbo efficiency suffers, VE will suffer and more boost may mean less mass flow and lower AFR's - bad on every level.

With this turbo on a 1HDFT, it was found that at 2500rpm, 21psi made more power and better AFR's than at 24psi.

I have reduced the spring tension on the boost compensator by nearly as much as it can be reduced already.

I spoke to a dyno tuner, who echoed similar words, lowering the boost may help things. He has tuned a couple of 13BT's and mentioned without opening the pump there is not much adjustments left that I havent done myself, main thing is he will check everything over, adjust the pump timing and optimise the boost and fuel. $130 an hour reckons it will take about 1.5 hours.

 

[gbentink]

If you are at max fuel, leaning off the AFR's through additional boost is always case of dimishing returns. It will increase power to a point, then decrease. I like to tune on the lean side of optimum. It may use a few extra kw, but it is safer and cleaner.

Cheers

 

[dousty]

Thats big power. I am assuming the GT power run was also in 3rd and on the same dyno? Have you got pricing available for these turbo's? Does it matter if you start with a 12HT CT26 or a 7MGTE turbo?

Graham?

 

[gbentink]

Sorry Dousty, yes all power runs done on the same dyno at the same place with the same ramp rate and the same tyres in 3rd in 2wd.

This is product development stuff for me, so no point adding other variables. I dont believe in advertising inflated numbers, these are just what it does.

This is the pefect towing turbo and spirited performance, but I am soon to test the upgrade to the upgrade. Hoping to get some serious numbers for that, it will be interesting to see how the low end responds to entirely different turbine design and different compressor wheel (than the other performance turbo dynoed).

As for core exchange no problem with any version CT26.

PM me for a price, I need to know your configuration to determine a price.

 

[dousty]

Great, thanks.

 

[rideglobally]

all smile

Hi gbentink, i am running your turbo and i am all smile! i got nulla on the road again with a new rebuild engine. i am getting ready for a 7000 mile trip and been too busy working out the kinks on the Nulla i.e, power steering working, ac working and preparing for the trip. plus my full time job. i will record some stats on the trip i will be going high altitude and low. for the moment i can tell you that it is boosting quicker at lower rpm and lower egt. i have also been running it without my intercooler, i am hoping to put back the inter cooler before the trip. my fuel screw is turn out one full turn, i do not yet have the guts to turn it all the way out.

i am all smile, also want to thank you and Tim for all your advise and support on my 12ht rebuild.

 

[Talos]

Try reducing the spring tension on the boost compesator (should be an allen key nut on top of boost compensator and expose a toothed wheel on a thread much like the VE pumps. Just reduce preload 1 turn and you should feel the difference straight away

So does one need to remove the intake to get access to this? or am I just blind?

 

[gbentink]

Hi Talos, it isn't easy to access and may only be possible removing the plate that holds the compensator diaphragm in place.

I confess I haven't tried it on the vehicle - this wasn't done on TimHH61 either

 

[ToyRoverlander]

Great stuff!

I was wondering if this turbo would be suitable for a 3B, or would that be just a little too much as it's not a DI engine?

 

[gbentink]

Another guy on the forum "Hulsty" just installed one on his 13BT and he has posted up some results I believe, otherwise he might respond to a PM.

He did mention 15psi by 1900rpm. It may do a little better than that but I expect 1800rpm would be the earliest for 15psi.

If you want really low end response, there are other turbos that would do the business at say 1400.

It really depends on your gearing, where you drive it. If you cruise at over 2k @ 100km/h then it would probably be very good.

Great stuff!

I was wondering if this turbo would be suitable for a 3B, or would that be just a little too much as it's not a DI engine?

 

[ToyRoverlander]

Another guy on the forum "Hulsty" just installed one on his 13BT and he has posted up some results I believe, otherwise he might respond to a PM.

He did mention 15psi by 1900rpm. It may do a little better than that but I expect 1800rpm would be the earliest for 15psi.

If you want really low end response, there are other turbos that would do the business at say 1400.

It really depends on your gearing, where you drive it. If you cruise at over 2k @ 100km/h then it would probably be very good.

Thanks for the reply.
I have seen his setup and it looks very nice with good results too. This 3B of mine sits in a LWB Land Rover softtop. Gearbox and axles are LC too with 4.1 gearing and 33's. I cruise (100kph) at a calculated 2400rpm I think it was. With 35's it will be a little less.

I have to say that I'm not THAT worried about low end power as that feels quite good. It just lacks mid and top end power. That's what I would like to see improved. If low end power gets a boost too that would just be a bonus.

I was just worried that this turbo would be too much for an IDI engine. But after reading posts in various topics (including that wicked compound turbo ) it seems the most important thing is to keep EGT's down and your turbo seems to do just that, combined with an intercooler..

 

[Dougal]

The biggest differences between turbocharging the 3B and the 13BT would be strength and fuel delivery.
There's no problem pushing 20+ psi into a DI engine, but the 3B depends on the state of your head.
For fuel delivery the 3B has a lower limit, with an intercooler you will run out of fuel well before 20psi.

 

[ToyRoverlander]

The biggest differences between turbocharging the 3B and the 13BT would be strength and fuel delivery.
There's no problem pushing 20+ psi into a DI engine, but the 3B depends on the state of your head.
For fuel delivery the 3B has a lower limit, with an intercooler you will run out of fuel well before 20psi.

Good point!
I have got no clue about the state of the head. That would just be a matter of crossing fingers.
So what you're saying is that the 3B will not give enough fuel to use the potential of this turbo?

 

[gbentink]

Check the thread below where Hulsty actually graphed his approximate boost curve on his 13BT.

https://forum.ih8mud.com/diesel-tec...what-does-good-boost-rpm-curve-look-like.html

I wouldnt say this turbo would be too much so long as you kept boost and fuel where is safe. At the end of the day it appears to work very well on the 13BT - not something I had even really thought of targeting in the beginning

 

[gbentink]

By the way, sorry for not giving a new dyno result for the 1HDFT I have been working with (Mudstorms HDJ80). It "seems" to be making ~ 160rwkW (I say that because its better than before when it was at 145). It was running 27psi, but now the auto trans is dead.

Mudstorm had bought a "Nomad" valve body from Wholesale Automatics but not yet installed, and the trans wasnt real great when we added this first turbo.

Problem is, Mudstorm insists on doing first to second gear burnouts on 35" tyres

 

[Tim-HJ61]

I was pleased to get some rear wheelspin in gravel changing into second with my manual 12HT , but he is doing this on bitumen with four wheel drive. Crazy!

Tim