Toyota cardan Joint

[notaf-ingjeep]

Hey, I was working on a driveline last night. I thought I would get more from what I was going to build, but.... It bound up at the transfer case with less travel than anticipated. I've heard and read about guys using the cardan or cv joint from the front driveshaft of a mini truck. 84-85 are the best I read. Spent three hours looking for the info I wanted with no luck. How are you guys getting your cruiser flange to work? Are the u-joints the same? Can I get one of these cardan joints, and load it up with my cruiser flanges? I have an orion t.c. but not the h.d. so it's a stock 4 speed output. Any place that might sell that particular peice? I need something cheap for now, money is tight. I was hoping to build something now, with what I have. My stock flanges and plenty of slip spline. If I could get one of these toyta cardans or cv to work, I would be a lot better off. I wouldn't have to limit my suspension soo much for the time being. I think any year of mini cardan would be sufficient, I got a lot of suspension travel to spare. I 'll just limit at the pinion before any binding occurs. I apreciate any info you have on this, THANKS AGAIN!!!

 

[Sputnik40]

You can find something here if you do a search - I last looked several years ago, so not sure if it's going to be easy to find.

My recollection was that the 84-85 carden's had the highest degree of deflection, so were the most desired. Mine is an 85, and also has 5" of slip - which helps immensely. [STRIKE]I think I had a stock late 70's end worked onto the carden end so I could mate to a late model one piece case output. I have heard of others redrilling the drum to work with the mini-truck drive pattern (this works and is cheap).[/STRIKE] EDIT - SEE CORRECTION IN POST BELOW - JUST REDRILL FLANGE - Doh) On the diff side - you will need a new universal pinion flange to match the year carden shaft you use. There is a bolt pattern webpage - can't remember it right now - but it is useful to ordering (it's on a website that sells flanges, think it's that Colorado outfit?). They didn't have the one I needed - so bought one from Jesse at High Angle. Georg can also prolly help there as well.

I have two spares that I need to get fabbed up - one is a very early mini-truck and has the rediculously small pinion flange bolts and bolt pattern (don't recommend this). The latter is a later 4-runner Carden with larger bolts and bolt pattern.

Both need to be disassembled and clearanced to gain the higher degree of deflection (operating angle) that the 84-85 came stock with....supposed to be an easy mod, but just something I havn't had any interest in doing (until this past weekend when 2 friends busted shafts at Chocco and we all had to contribute bits and pieces so as to get 2 new shafts welded up in camp).

 

[notaf-ingjeep]

Yeah, I don't think that I will drill the drum. It's not worth it , I would like things to be balanced for the road. I don't know how well that would work out in that case. I have no problem building a good driveline that can be balanced though.
I did a search here and looked for a while but just too much to read through don't have the time.
thanks

 

[mookie]

all the mini-truck d-shafts that i've had mated up to the tcase fine....also some early fj60 front dshafts have a cv joint

don't mean to hijack, but sputnik, how did you like choccoloca?

 

[notaf-ingjeep]

all the mini-truck d-shafts that i've had mated up to the tcase fine....also some early fj60 front dshafts have a cv joint

don't mean to hijack, but sputnik, how did you like choccoloca?

Are you saying that is just lined up, like it was the same flange? That doesn't seem likely to me, there has to be more to it. Are you saying, that you rebuilt them with the cruiser ends and spline using the same u-joints? I'm just trying to learn exactly what its going to take to get them to mate together. I have never owned one of these drivelines, so I have no base of knowledge to start from. I want to know what it takes to get it to work ,so I don't end up wasting money trying it out and failing. If it is simple I'd go for it, I just don't want it to be more work than it is worth.

 

[mookie]

yes, the t-case end of the mini-truck shaft has the same flange pattern as the cruiser t-case, you just have to drill the holes out larger to 10 or 11 mm iirc....i didn't rebuild them or mix/match them with LC shafts, i just used the mini shafts all the way and drilled a second set of holes in my diff flanges

cruiser u-joints are bigger than the mini trucks......but the slip shaft does have the same diameter and spline count so you might be able to create a mutant shaft that way, the mini shaft has a longer slip yoke though.....also the plugs that go into the d-shaft tube are the same diameter on mini/LC so that's a easy way to make a mutant shaft too

i went through about 3 rear d-shafts when i still had leafsprings plus i've had 2 extras made for front and rear spares....i started out with FJ60 shafts but they are just damned hard to find so i started using minitruck stuff. the best place to find those for me has been the marlincrawler forum...

 

[Sputnik40]

yes, the t-case end of the mini-truck shaft has the same flange pattern as the cruiser t-case, you just have to drill the holes out larger to 10 or 11 mm iirc....i didn't rebuild them or mix/match them with LC shafts, i just used the mini shafts all the way and drilled a second set of holes in my diff flanges

Ooops, in retrospect - this is what I had done to mine when I had the shaft built - replace "redrill" with drilled out the drum to larger bolt size.... sorry. Memory is starting to go.

Chocco was sweet - lots of good 4 and 5 trails, short enough you could take a chance and hammer it knowing that you could drive out short ways to camp on an easy trail. So much so that I broke a drive side rear main leaf, and a short side poly performance rear. Driveshaft and pinion held up fine - no wrap issues. Damn good times. Will be going back for sure.

 

[mookie]

Ooops, in retrospect - this is what I had done to mine when I had the shaft built - replace "redrill" with drilled out the drum to larger bolt size.... sorry. Memory is starting to go.

nope, you don't have to do anything to the drum, just drill out the holes in the d-shaft flange a little and it mates right up

glad you liked choccolocca, did you make it up the boat ramp?

 

[Sputnik40]

nope, you don't have to do anything to the drum, just drill out the holes in the d-shaft flange a little and it mates right up

glad you liked choccolocca, did you make it up the boat ramp?

Walked up Boat Ramp twice - slightly wet the first time, in the rain the second time. Nice trail, sik flat rock with water running down it - I kinda like the little waterfalls at the top the best.

Gentle flop on the big rock at the top of Hell's Revenge (too much antisquat to go straight over, so tried sneaking around the left).

Looooooved Backside - nice slot .

 

[notaf-ingjeep]

Thanks guys, last night I found another thread with some other good info as well. It seems like an easy cheap way to go about it. I'm kind of thinking it may be a little more hastle than it's worth for me. If I had the parts on hand for sure, I'd go for it. I would say in my case I might be better off just buying something new, probably more cost effective. Anyone using one of the MARLIN H.D. drive shafts? Looks like a good unit on the website. I might go that way, I sent them an email about maybe just buying a toyota cv that will bolt right up to the t.c. output. Well see what they tell me.

 

[John Smith]

I am running a 85 minitruck front CV driveshaft in the rear of my 40. I did what mookie said and simply drilled out the flange holes on the CV that mates to the LC transfer case. I replaced the flange on the diff with the Marlin unit drilled for all the different minitruck patterns. I could have also just swapped out the end of the driveshaft that mates to the diff side with the LC part. I probably would have done that but did not know the splines were the same at the time.

 

[mookie]

those aftermarket D-shafts are a waste of money imo, but to each his own...the mini-truck shafts are easy to find, easy to make work and strong as hell

hijack on- Sputnik, have you been out to Mountainside ORV yet? i like it 100x better than choccolocca....and i can't believe you broke another freaking poly axle shaft.....i've done a little research and found that Dutchman can make me some lifetime warrentied 33 spline alloy shafts and they can respline the sidegears of my detroit, i have two sets of stock shafts left so when i break the next one i'm prolly going that route....one of my heep driving friends went that route and they are holding up really well for him

 

[Sputnik40]

those aftermarket D-shafts are a waste of money imo, but to each his own...the mini-truck shafts are easy to find, easy to make work and strong as hell

hijack on- Sputnik, have you been out to Mountainside ORV yet? i like it 100x better than choccolocca....and i can't believe you broke another freaking poly axle shaft.....i've done a little research and found that Dutchman can make me some lifetime warrentied 33 spline alloy shafts and they can respline the sidegears of my detroit, i have two sets of stock shafts left so when i break the next one i'm prolly going that route....one of my heep driving friends went that route and they are holding up really well for him

I concur with going aftermarket. Keep it simple - the mini-truck carden shafts are brutally strong for the $$$ IMHO, plus you get the longer slip joint.

Case in point - a friend broke a front driveshaft on his 60, and we were able to hack apart a few folks spare driveshafts and weld him up a new one the same night he broke - back on the trails the next morning. Another guy had a custom rear "Ford" driveshaft that he broke - and he ended up taking one of my spare stock Toyota joint ends/flange and rewelding it to his "custom" Ford shaft. Would have been alot easier had he stuck with Toyota stuff. All depends on if you have funds for a proper spare - or if you're running with folks that carry similar parts to the custom shaft you have.

Mookie - sent you a PM on those Dutchman shafts - maybe a new thread. I'm done with Poly's - and need an alternative (other than the stock spares I have) until I can get a 14 bolt done up to go with the 4-link project I'm been procrastinating on....

 

[notaf-ingjeep]

Oem sounds best! I think I may have one built by High angle, jess quoted me a very good price. His unit sounds really good, pretty much a factory part but stronger tubing. I'm just afraid that by the time I find all the right parts, build the sucker, and get it balanced, I want to be able to use the road, it will have been a huge thing. Really, this sounds lame I know, but time is money to me. If it becomes a huge thing, it can quickly become a regretfull project. It would be nice to have an extra if anything, so it's something I can do over time. One that I can build with the thick .25 tube I have and not have to balance. It, I think, is a little thick and a lot of rotating mass. Strong, but just unpractical for any real use, I fear it could be hard on my drivetrain. I mean if used for anything but crawling. I want a good driveline that won't limit my travel, soon, asap. I've got a lot more to do, it seems having a driveline forehand will make it easier on myself. I've got bumpstop and limit straps to set, I also would like some Anti-rock bars. Running out of warm weather in utah, I really hate winter anymore.

 

[Sputnik40]

Both my long travel front and mini-truck rear were built by Jess - it was cheaper to ship my parts to him to mod and fix than to go local. Wasn't cheap - but I've been more than pleased with the quality of work...

 

[notaf-ingjeep]

Yeah there is 6 states distribution, and some other hillbilly shops here. He is cheaper, more than that I would trust his work over anyone. Not cheap, but nothin' is cheap

 

[notaf-ingjeep]

Now he says at high angle that he wants me to drill the transfer case for the toyota pattern. I won't buy it . I'm not wanting to drill it out the t.c. output, not cool. I want a bolt in unit

 

[Tapage]

just to clarify .. are the minis pinion flange the same as Cruiser flange .. ? ( just diferent bolt pathern .)

 

[mookie]

just to clarify .. are the minis pinion flange the same as Cruiser flange .. ? ( just diferent bolt pathern .)

correct- the /mounting surface/cups are the same but different bolt pattern at the pinion flange, there are like 8 different pinion bolt patterns between LC's and mini-trucks

there is a particular size of schedule 40 pipe (google search for it) that the plugs from a toyota driveshaft fits into almost perfectly but it's hard to find. i've also heard that there is a size of dom that you can just cut the toyota d-shaft tube in two without having to grind out and remove the plug ends and it fits nicely inside .....if you were able to find one of those you could fab/weld up your own shafts then take them to a local shop to get balanced like $50 each you should be able to make up your own shafts for around $150 each i would think

used mini-truck shaft $75ish
you already have the LC shaft to use for the pinion end
tubing- $25ish
balancing- $50

 

[mookie]

Now he says at high angle that he wants me to drill the transfer case for the toyota pattern. I won't buy it . I'm not wanting to drill it out the t.c. output, not cool. I want a bolt in unit

i've talked to Jess before, great guy but i don't think he knows a lot about Land Cruisers