Timing Belt at TDC or 50 Degrees?

[knewstance]

I have been reading threads all over the place and keep finding different things for different years and I have seen people doing different things on the same model years!

Please help, I'm not sure what to do next. (Everything has been fairly smooth to this point, knock on wood!)

1998 Land Cruiser - Do I remove the timing belt at 50 degrees or at 0 degrees?

I've read in a few different FSMs that I could find but I have not been able to find one for the 1998 model yet.

 

[Nick T]

Toyota 2UZ-FE Timing Belt Marks 4.7L

Either TDC or 50° atdc will work
If you have it at 50° atdc, you have less chance either of the cam gears will rotate when the belt is off as there is less spring pressure on your valves trying to rotate the cam.

 

[knewstance]

Toyota 2UZ-FE Timing Belt Marks 4.7L

Either TDC or 50° atdc will work
If you have it at 50° atdc, you have less chance either of the cam gears will rotate when the belt is off as there is less spring pressure on your valves trying to rotate the cam.

Thank you!!

 

[gatormark91]

Cam pulleys at the "T" marks, and crank mark pointing to the nub on the plastic timing cover. When you put the belt on, advance the passenger side a tiny bit, so you can put the belt on with no slack on the driver's side. Then move the cam pulley back to the 'T". This makes it much easier to the get marks on the belt lined up with the driver's side cam marks and the crank marks (belt marks should line up with the straight edge on the oil pump housing, and the holes for the crank removal tool on the timing belt drive pulley). Make sure the arrows on the belt point forwards and you can see the marks on the front edge of the belt, and you should be good.

If your timing gets off for any reason, point the crank mark at the nub on the cover and the cam marks at the T's, and all will be good again.

Also - replace the crank oil seal while you are there. It's cheap, you almost certainly need it, and the local dealer won't have it in stock at a decent price. Order it now or you'll have to suck it up and pay $$ for it, or wait for it to be delivered.

Replace the oil cooler and intake bypass hoses, too. You have to take them off anyway, they are 20 years old and no one changes them.

 

[marcus2001]

Cam pulleys at the "T" marks, and crank mark pointing to the nub on the plastic timing cover. When you put the belt on, advance the passenger side a tiny bit, so you can put the belt on with no slack on the driver's side. Then move the cam pulley back to the 'T". This makes it much easier to the get marks on the belt lined up with the driver's side cam marks and the crank marks (belt marks should line up with the straight edge on the oil pump housing, and the holes for the crank removal tool on the timing belt drive pulley). Make sure the arrows on the belt point forwards and you can see the marks on the front edge of the belt, and you should be good.

If your timing gets off for any reason, point the crank mark at the nub on the cover and the cam marks at the T's, and all will be good again.

Also - replace the crank oil seal while you are there. It's cheap, you almost certainly need it, and the local dealer won't have it in stock at a decent price. Order it now or you'll have to suck it up and pay $$ for it, or wait for it to be delivered.

Replace the oil cooler and intake bypass hoses, too. You have to take them off anyway, they are 20 years old and no one changes them.

I think what you said makes sense but I wanted to be sure. I followed the directions in the kit I got to put it at 50 degrees past TDC. I did that and after I released the tensioner the cams moved. So I'm in a predicament you might say.
So I assume the nub on the timing cover is that little dowel like plastic with a white dot on it just to the right of the 0 TDC mark.

 

[gatormark91]

I think what you said makes sense but I wanted to be sure. I followed the directions in the kit I got to put it at 50 degrees past TDC. I did that and after I released the tensioner the cams moved. So I'm in a predicament you might say.
So I assume the nub on the timing cover is that little dowel like plastic with a white dot on it just to the right of the 0 TDC mark.

Mine didn't have any paint on it, but a circle is 360°. 90° is straight off to the right, 50° is (essentially) up halfway between 0 and 90. So if it looks like it's in the right place, that's it. It's been four or five years since I did mine, so I can't really remember it 100%, but that sounds right.

If you advance the passenger cam a little bit to put the timing belt on, when you pull the pin from the tensioner, it's going to move the cam a little bit. It should move it back to the mark, though.

And don't forget to put FIPG or black sealer on the bolt for the tensioner pulley! I did, and I have had a tiny little oil weep for a while now.

 

[Ayune]

Cam pulleys at the "T" marks, and crank mark pointing to the nub on the plastic timing cover. When you put the belt on, advance the passenger side a tiny bit, so you can put the belt on with no slack on the driver's side. Then move the cam pulley back to the 'T". This makes it much easier to the get marks on the belt lined up with the driver's side cam marks and the crank marks (belt marks should line up with the straight edge on the oil pump housing, and the holes for the crank removal tool on the timing belt drive pulley). Make sure the arrows on the belt point forwards and you can see the marks on the front edge of the belt, and you should be good.

If your timing gets off for any reason, point the crank mark at the nub on the cover and the cam marks at the T's, and all will be good again.

Also - replace the crank oil seal while you are there. It's cheap, you almost certainly need it, and the local dealer won't have it in stock at a decent price. Order it now or you'll have to suck it up and pay $$ for it, or wait for it to be delivered.

Replace the oil cooler and intake bypass hoses, too. You have to take them off anyway, they are 20 years old and no one changes them.

I replaced the front crankshaft seal too, it’s right there exposed, easy & cheap at $11. P/N 90311-A0001 for my ‘98 LC.

 

[2001LC]

Tips:

Use a torque wrench.

• Seal threads on tensioner pulley bolt (10mm allen head). (see FSM)
• Place belt on, than idler pulley (DS pulley). Just makes easier to get belt on. Lightly clamping belt onto sprockets. Reduces fuss/chance of belt moving off sprocket marks. while installing it and idler pulley.
• Make sure to put the 2 (1 tinny the other small triangular) plastic covers on, before install of fan bracket.
• Route crank sensor/oil sender wire housing behind fan bracket.
• Time cams to straight line, not T's.
• Torque lower side fan bracket/AC compressor bolt from below.

 

[gatormark91]

Tips:

Use a torque wrench.

• Seal threads on tensioner pulley bolt (10mm allen head). (see FSM)
• Place belt on, than idler pulley (DS pulley). Just makes easier to get belt on. Lightly clamping belt onto sprockets. Reduces fuss/chance of belt moving off sprocket marks. while installing it and idler pulley.
• Make sure to put the 2 (1 tinny the other small triangular) plastic covers on, before install of fan bracket.
• Route crank sensor/oil sender wire housing behind fan bracket.
• Time cams to straight line, not T's.
• Torque lower side fan bracket/AC compressor bolt from below.

View attachment 2908443

Why not the T marks and the 50° mark? For a lot of people, this is the first time they've ever tackled a big job like this. Putting the timing on the Ts and the 50° means that they don't have to fight the valve spring pressure, and you get the same correct timing. It's so much easier. If you follow the FSM and use the markings on the heads for the cams, you end up fighting the valve springs and the sprockets keep moving. Personally, I don't want to put vise grips on a brand new belt. Your advice is the gold standard for me, but this time I'm wondering why you're not liking an alternate way that is easier?

 

[2001LC]

T's are NOT at 50 degrees of TDC, they're about 5 ATDC (after TDC). The T's are used with the little plastic nub on lower timing cover.

For setting belt on sprockets, lower plastic cover is not on. Using the T's and it will NOT be timed properly. Personally, I check timing, by rotating 720 degrees, before installing lower cover.

Hard timing marks: Those are cam marks and are not the "T's"

These CAMs happen to be a little after of marks in picture I've on file, just before T's,

Crank sprocket to belt marks.

Remember:
Right and Left are ours, as we sit in driver seat. (BK1 is left, BK 2 is right)
Once we turn crank (720 degrees to check) with new belt on. Belt marks do not ling back up. Only hard marks of sprockets do!

 

[gatormark91]

T's are NOT at 50 degrees of TDC, they're about 5 ATDC (after TDC). The T's are used with the little plastic nub on lower timing cover.

For setting belt on sprockets, lower plastic cover is not on. Using the T's and it will NOT be timed properly. Personally, I check timing, by rotating 720 degrees, before installing lower cover.

Hard timing marks: Those are cam marks and are not the "T's"
View attachment 2910288
These CAMs happen to be a little after of marks in picture I've on file, just before T's,
View attachment 2910299

View attachment 2910300
Crank sprocket to belt marks.
View attachment 2910292

View attachment 2910289


Remember:
Right and Left are ours, as we sit in driver seat. (BK1 is left, BK 2 is right)
Once we turn crank (720 degrees to check) with new belt on. Belt marks do not ling back up. Only hard marks of sprockets do!

Sorry stand corrected. I should not have referred to 50°, I should have just referred to the nub. Thank you!

 

[2001LC]

Sorry stand corrected. I should not have referred to 50°, I should have just referred to the nub. Thank you!

The deal about off set from TDC 50 degrees, so cam do not move on us. Well doesn't work very well. They almost always end up moving. But no big deal in the non VVT. I just set crank and cam marks at top dead center, and remove belt. If I don't disturb cams, they don't often move on me.


No need to be sorry.

just wanted it clear; T's should not be used. To do so, one must understand which mark harmonic balance timing mark lines up with on cover (nub).

 

[gatormark91]

The deal about off set from TDC 50 degrees, so cam do not move on us. Well doesn't work very well. They almost always end up moving. But no big deal in the non VVT. I just set crank and cam marks at top dead center, and remove belt. If I don't disturb cams, they don't often move on me.


No need to be sorry.

just wanted it clear; T's should not be used. To do so, one must understand which mark harmonic balance timing mark lines up with on cover (nub).
View attachment 2910615

That the mark I use.