Build The Clustertruck Rides Again - Refurbishing a 1975 Chevota

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IMO it depends on whether or not you do a cam "while you're at it"
On the 350 in my FJ40, most of the cost of the rebuild was the cam (2/3rds)

I'll be interested to hear how much a 283 harmonic balancer will set you back
 
No plans for a cam, lifters, valves,rockers, etc.

The plan is all seals and gaskets (valves, main seals, oil pan, etc), probably an oil pump while I'm in there, pulleys, and balancer.

As for the balancer, I'll probably just go with the smallest 350 balancer I can find, and a divorced pulley as opposed to the integrated unit. The 283 balancer aren't easy to find and pricey when you do find one.
 
the 283 balancer is pressed on and doesn't have a bolt to hold it on. My experience with aftermarket balancers is some fit well, others barely fit, and yet others... well, you know that whole thing about God getting vengeance on those who persecute the saints? there's a part of me that is good so that the guy who said the balancer was "good enough" roasts a few extra hours in hell for it.... yeah, I'm completely over it (or not).
 
the 283 balancer is pressed on and doesn't have a bolt to hold it on. My experience with aftermarket balancers is some fit well, others barely fit, and yet others... well, you know that whole thing about God getting vengeance on those who persecute the saints? there's a part of me that is good so that the guy who said the balancer was "good enough" roasts a few extra hours in hell for it.... yeah, I'm completely over it (or not).

Yeah - I know all about the boltless balancer...makes it a bear to rotate the engine for all this TDC finding I've been doing.

If I can make a tool to guide the drill, I plan to drill and tap the crank snout for a crank bolt.
 
Ok, I can't help myself. IMHO, you should run the 283 until it dies of natural causes and then drop in a nice running 350 motor. In the long run this will probably cost you less and will save v you the pain of pulling the 283 twice ( if you band-aid it this time)
 
Ok, I can't help myself. IMHO, you should run the 283 until it dies of natural causes and then drop in a nice running 350 motor. In the long run this will probably cost you less and will save v you the pain of pulling the 283 twice ( if you band-aid it this time)

@reddingcruiser - unfortunately, the engine needs to be pulled for a dozen other reasons. The throw out bearing is on its way out, the bellhousing was "custom drilled" and is crooked - plus some of the bolts are stripped. The engine is also about 4-5" too far forward in the bay. This means the front driveshaft angle is too steep to actually RUN a front driveshaft, and I have a huge dog leg in the shifter because the tranny tower is up against the firewall - which also means I have the world's longest shift throw...

In short, to move forward with getting this truck mechanically sound, pulling the engine is the next step.

I agree that if I had infinite money, dropping in a fresh 350 is the way to go. I even agree that it would be cheaper in the long run. Unfortunately unless I trip and fall on a pile of money I left laying around, it will probably take another year to put together the funds to buy a 350...which means the truck will basically sit for a year...and really, who wants that?

Honestly, I would not have even dubbed this engine questionable if I hadn't run the leak down test. It has been reliable, smooth running and problem free since I bought it. Leaky, yes, smelly, yes, but problematic? Not really...

Leaning toward running it but I'd have to run the numbers on a new engine.
 
a hundred bucks for a drill bit and tap.... it really doesn't take long until you're at a 350. Gen 1 Vortecs last at least 200,000 miles without need of anything (as long as the oil cooler remained attached).... $200-$300 and you can swap for a far better motor. I know it's an annoying refrain - but if you're going to pull the motor, having something cheap stuffed in there for if (when) the inevitable roadblock happens would be more than a good idea. To be clear, my idea is buy a 1997-2000 Vortec motor from a Tahoe or truck for a couple hundred dollars, get a hundred dollar intake (dual plane), clean the snot out of the outside, rattle can it and stuff it in with your accessories, carb, and distributor.... if you're really doing well, you can get a complete motor and sell the stuff you won't use (EFI) for as much as you sold the motor....

that said, make sure the motor isn't junk - pull a valve cover to check for the penzoil buildup and make sure the cooling system is operational (the orange stuff plugs passages if it's not changed).
 
a hundred bucks for a drill bit and tap.... it really doesn't take long until you're at a 350. Gen 1 Vortecs last at least 200,000 miles without need of anything (as long as the oil cooler remained attached).... $200-$300 and you can swap for a far better motor. I know it's an annoying refrain - but if you're going to pull the motor, having something cheap stuffed in there for if (when) the inevitable roadblock happens would be more than a good idea. To be clear, my idea is buy a 1997-2000 Vortec motor from a Tahoe or truck for a couple hundred dollars, get a hundred dollar intake (dual plane), clean the snot out of the outside, rattle can it and stuff it in with your accessories, carb, and distributor.... if you're really doing well, you can get a complete motor and sell the stuff you won't use (EFI) for as much as you sold the motor....

that said, make sure the motor isn't junk - pull a valve cover to check for the penzoil buildup and make sure the cooling system is operational (the orange stuff plugs passages if it's not changed).

I'm sounding like a broken record, at this point, because I've got this debate started in 2 threads (my own fault). The main objective of this next project was originally NOT to swap engines. The objective is to move the motor mounts, change out the clutch, which is 100% on its way out, change the transmission cover, get proper driveline angles, and repair the leaky, shot exhaust. This whole debate started because, with the engine out, it becomes a "while I'm in there" project to replace it if it turns out to be bad. The reason I'm thinking about bucking all common advice and wisdom, and just running the 283 for a few more years is:

1. It has shown little or no cause for concern that it is bad. It isn't too smokey, it has good compression numbers across all 8 cylinder, idles smooth. The only concerning data, so far, is the leak down test - which was performed on a cold engine, by an amateur. It only takes me missing TDC by a tiny bit to leave a valve cracked open and totally screw the pooch. As such, I'm not sure how much faith I put in the leak-down numbers.

NOTE: As I mentioned in the other thread: I will not buy a single part for the 283 until it is out of the truck, with valve covers and oil pan off for further inspection. If there is something obviously wrong at that point, I won't really have a choice.

2. Admitted impatience to get this thing back on the road: If I save up for a crate engine, It will be an additional year before I can afford it. I'm on a shoestring with this project and I don't see that changing. With budget tight, if I can re-seal the 283, drop it back in, and actually enjoy driving it for a couple years while I collect the money for bodywork, tires, paint, etc. to me, it's worth the couple hundred "wasted" on this engine to actually drive it.

Who knows, maybe it'll blow up in 6 months after I drop it back in, then you can all come point and laugh and say "I told you so." In either case, the whole reason I bought this truck was to be a learning experience. I like to mess with things, so the actual labor is part of the fun for me.

@SuperBuickGuy - your Vortec idea is a good one, and very likely the route I will take if this engine turns out to be in bad shape. For what it's worth, it seems like the going rate for a 90,000 mile, 1998ish vortec is about $600, if I pull it. Not too bad...A couple questions though:

1. CAN you even carb an EFI vortec? Do the old Gen 1 intake manifolds still just bolt right up?

2. I'm assuming they've done away with mechanical fuel pumps. Not saying an electric pump would be a bad wiring project - just thinking that a significantly more modern engine would be more than a simple "drop in." (i.e.: emissions controls, computers, sensors, etc.)

3. Motor Mounts: I thought with Gen III engines they changed the mounts and exhaust manifolds. Am I wrong? If I set up the truck for Gen I mounts and manifolds, would it still be possible to drop in a Vortec later?
 
1 - you can carb a Vortec motor, but it requires a Vortec-specific intake. That said, they're $100 on ebay for a brand-new one... you want a dual plane manifold
2 - depending on the Vortec motor, it may still have provision for a mechanical pump - you're looking for an actual block-off plate on the casting. With that said, electric pumps are pretty dependable any more.... but do avoid the $12 version
3 - gen 3 changed, but the gen 1 Vortec is the just much better heads on the same block you've got in your rig now.

Now, if you do decide to go Gen 3 with a 4.8, 5.3 or whatever, there are more expenses. You need a spark controller since there is no distributor and a new intake. The motor mounts are different - in that they're simply further back on the block.... and pretty easy to solve. The other issue with Gen 3 is the crank flange/back of block spacing - you'll need to buy a spacer because it's the same bellhousing bolt pattern but 1/2" further from the bolt surface on the block.... to be clear, I'm suggesting a Gen 1 motor, not a Gen 3. I know everyone is gaga over the new motor (and for good reasons) but the Gen 1 get better mileage, cost less to build, and are a direct swap.
 
So now I'm a bit confused -

You mentioned a 1997-2000 Vortec previously. Is that a Gen I or a Gen III? If that's the Gen III Vortec, what years would I look for in a Gen I?
 
4.3 V6 Vortec, IIRC came out in 1989 or 90. The Vortec 350 came out in 1997, the BB version in the mid-90s.... in all cases, it's just the vortec head. GM did a redesign of the 4.3 in roughly 2000 and added a counter-balance shaft to kill power smooth out the vibrations. The 88-90 350 had a ramp head that did awesome at creating low-end torque and was equally awesome at killing top end hp (and really, it had a ski-jump ramp cast in the intake port just above the valve.) Honestly the 2000 up 4.3 and the vortec bbc were actually more bust then boon because GM changed the block - and while parts still did interchange, there just simply wasn't the performance improvement that the Vortec head did on the 350 across the other engine families.

Another consideration is to maintain the EFI and computer controlled ignition - stand alone harnesses and computers are widely available and pretty foolproof.
 
Out with the old, in with the new...

After 10 weeks of waiting, I finally got my new Quadrajet, custom built for a 283, from Sean Murphy Inductions. It looks great! I spent a lot of the month in Europe (work and play) which was awesome, but I was excited to dig back into the 40 today.

IMG_4319[1].webp


Out with the old, in with the new!

IMG_4323[1].webp


Installed:

IMG_4325[1].webp


So, I'll start by saying this is a HUGE improvement over the old Buick Q-jet. It addressed a good number of the issues I was running into - including the recent flooding issue. HOWEVER, as with all things clustertruck, not all is right with the world - yet...

THE GOOD:

1. The truck starts with virtually no effort, for the first time ever, and holds a 700 RPM idle well.
2. Throttle response and power both seem substantially improved - I believe I had a severely rich condition with the buick carb. I took it out for a spin today and was VERY impressed with the throttle response and particularly the acceleration. The truck feels like it got a 10-20% increase in power...
3. Ported vacuum actually works now - so I was able to appropriately time my engine. The truck still seems to prefer a lot of advance - 12 degrees at idle (advance plugged), up to about 32 at throttle. Anything less and I get off-idle hesitation.
4. Electric choke, functioning choke pull-off, no more rigged-up manual choke.
5. a good, safe, throttle return spring setup.
6. SMI does a good job of addressing the major Qjet issue - epoxied welch plugs, brass bushings in the throttle plates where they're prone to wearing and leaking.

THE BAD:

1. Monster vacuum leak - Very loud hissing on the passenger side of the carburetor. Hit the area with carb cleaner, and the idle stumbles pretty significantly. As a result, my mixture screws are pretty unresponsive. It seems like it's one of the 3 primary gaskets (baseplate, air horn, etc.) but I essentially just doused the whole area with my last bit of carb cleaner. Seems like it's coming from right behind the choke...The silver lining is the truck seems to run OK with the leak, but it will need to be addressed. I just ran out of carb cleaner. I'll have to pick up some more to continue the investigation...

2. Throttle linkage binds slightly - truck doesn't like to drop back to idle, as it "sticks" slightly open. May just need to be worked a bit. The throttle cable is loose enough that it shouldn't be holding the throttle open.

3. Not FULLY convinced I have the choke hooked up right, yet. I'll also need to set up the fast idle. I guess I'll know next time I start it!

The vacuum leak SHOULD just be a matter of tightening the screws that hold the carb "sandwhich" together...but I know Quadrajets are prone to warping if you overtighten them, and they seem pretty tight already. The only ones I haven't checked are the ones coming up from the bottom through the throttle plate....
 
Rick, that doesn't look like a throttle body??;)

Q-jet was my carb of choice back in the day.
Glad to here you're finally getting your 283 dialed in.
 
Rick, that doesn't look like a throttle body??;)

Q-jet was my carb of choice back in the day.
Glad to here you're finally getting your 283 dialed in.

Slowly but surely...I'll get it right just around the time the rings fail...

I've pretty much confirmed that the air leak must be coming from the baseplate gasket or the throttle body gasket. I sured up all the screws (in the proper torquing order) as much as I dare to on top and the hissing continues. Sounds like it's going to need to come back off for further evaluation, but I'll probably have to keep hosing it down with carb cleaner until I can get my final answer.

For whatever reason, it seems like no matter where I sprayed it tonight on the passenger side, it would affect the idle. I guess I'll see if carb cleaner comes with one of those little red straw things to better direct the flow.
 
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Rick, very nice Quadrajet it's going to sound awesome. I hope you will upload a video.
 
Quadrajets have different base gaskets - be sure you got the right one for your application.... that vacuum leak sounds very similar to how I learned that little tidbit.... more specifically, be certain that the gasket covers the vacuum tunnel that runs on the back of the carb. For whatever reason, GM changed that quite a bit between breeds and vacuum leaks are the result

12*? most low-compression motors like 16* idle and 38* of vacuum plus mechanical advance....
 
Quadrajets have different base gaskets - be sure you got the right one for your application.... that vacuum leak sounds very similar to how I learned that little tidbit.... more specifically, be certain that the gasket covers the vacuum tunnel that runs on the back of the carb. For whatever reason, GM changed that quite a bit between breeds and vacuum leaks are the result

12*? most low-compression motors like 16* idle and 38* of vacuum plus mechanical advance....

Yeah, that is one of my suspicions. I noticed that I had been running two gaskets on my previous quad - one like the thick one I have on there now, and then a slightly different shaped thin one. I just went with what was provided to me by SMI, but I'm wondering if this is the problem as well. I'll upload pictures in a bit. Hopefully it's that simple! However, the idle still changes when I hit other areas with Carb cleaner, so that may not be it...

Rick, very nice Quadrajet it's going to sound awesome. I hope you will upload a video.

Thanks! I certainly will. It sounds great aside from the air leak. As soon as that gets addressed, I'll take some video.
 
Here you go @SuperBuickGuy

You can see the slight difference. Now the two quads I have are vastly different years. Is the baseplate gasket determine by the intake or the carb base? Looks like the main difference is the thinner of the two gaskets covers the area under those two Welch plugs hanging out the bottom of the carb.

image.webp


My previous carburetor setup was running both of these stacked, but it was a 67 Buick carb on a Chevy Edelbrock SP2P intake...this new one is a mid 70's Chevy quad...
 
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