Starting: LX 470 family (on/off road) adventure rig (1 Viewer)

[ScottyS]

Hi all, I've been a lurker for a bit, while deciding on the direction of my next family adventure rig project. I would like to thank all of the IH8MUD contributors and community that swayed me from doing a Tundra, F150, or other full-size platform...and into a 100-series LC instead.

Background: My last (and still operational) project was a 1st-Gen Xterra that has served this role for 8+ years and 50k miles. Kids are getting larger, as are the cargo loads, and the X is just too small for 4 full-size people + gear. I do very functional builds that are not flashy, not very overlandy, but something in between hard-core offroad and overlanding. My skill set is similar: I've done a lot of fieldwork in desert/mountain environments with a variety of rigs, and know my way around the backcountry and solo 4x4 ops. I'm OK with wrenches, less of a fabricator, and have buddies who lean hard into fabbing and gizmos - so I've got support even though I don't have my own shop. Here is the family X saga: Xterra build thread elsewhere

The Genesis: I've been watching California CL ads and such for over a year to get a feel for the Tundra and 100-series markets for a while. I've almost bought into the 80-series LC's coming over from Japan now, but wanted the comfort of IFS and left-hand-drive for my wife and kids. Personally, I would prefer the 80-series RHD and diesel operation, but it's not just me that will use this rig for the next 10 years. Lots of prelimimary reading around this forum as well, to get a sense of what I may be in for.

The First Trip: I found a really nice 2-owner 2004 LX 470 back East with 90k miles and no rust (southern car), an awesome owner/driver/seller, and decided to make the family acquisition memorable since we are a bit of a "car family" that sticks by our rigs and really use them. So, all four of us flew back east, bought the truck, and drove it back to the west coast. We got to see a lot of new territory, friends, and family along the way, as well as getting familiar with the truck. Doing almost 4000 miles inside of two weeks is sort of a tell for fit, feel, function and comfort. No complaints were registered by the pax, even on a couple of 10+ hour driving days. I am good with the mechanics, power range, fuel economy, and other driving characteristics of the truck in stock form, and have a pretty good idea how the suspension and other mods will alter these things.

So, Operation LX is a go! We'll transform the vehicle over the next year to be ready for a decade of trans-continental road trips and off-road hunting/science/exploration adventures around the West. Barring major accidents, of course!

Here's some idea of how we roll (kids are getting bigger though, more racks/towing are in my future...):

Planned functional modifications: I'll gladly take specific input/suggestions on any of this, I will be using FAQ and major threads on this forum to help guide the decisions. Not all mods will be bolt-on, I'm open to fabbing where needed on the frame and such.

- suspension: I LOVED the AHC functionality on our highway trip home. Originally I figured I would delete it and go 2" OME/Slee. Now I'm not so sure.

- airbag load assist: I run airbags on our Xterra and Honda Pilot, it's the only way to keep leveling, handling, and protect the suspension during overloading conditions.

- load range E tires: I run high-ply tires with appropriate pressures for on and off road on the X, I've only flatted once (sidewall rip), and prefer to be able to traverse rocky/dirt/washboard roads at high speeds without rattling the truck to death. Wheel/tire size TBD, but I lean to tall sidewalls and narrower tires. Looking at 275/70/18's right now.

- onboard air system: to fill tires and airbags, onboard compressor from Viair and small tank will be added.

- roof rack: will be adding an aluminum cargo rack to the roof. Requirements include keeping sunroof area accessible as well as light/bar mounting for exterior illumination. I'm liking @prospeed's rack, looks like I joined too late for the GB, but I'll keep an eye for the next one.

- rear bumper/carrier: I held off on this for a long time with the Xterra, but it will come early for the LX. Requirements: real towing capability, high clearance. Lots of options, haven't seen one unit with all the features I prefer yet. 4x4Lab's is looking good, and they are right over the hill from me.

- rear air locker: given the weight of the LX, it won't be quite as nimble off road. I suspect I will need at least a rear air locker for insurance purposes in sticky situations. I will do this down the road if the ATRAC system does not perform as I'd like.

- front bumper/winch: looking at aluminum options here, and I prefer the high bars for deer protection. ARB is surprisingly in the lead here, in spite of steel construction. Will get a 12k winch and probably synthetic for this one.

- ham radios: she will get VHF/UHF/APRS + HF. Have not decided on the HF antenna yet.

- lighting: depends on racks/bumpers, but there will be some!

- aux fuel tank: the 24gal LongRange aux looks intriguing.

More as it happens, but wanted to start up the thread here at the beginning!

ETA posts for reference: AHC fluid change post

ETA stuff done so far:
- rearview mirror delete: I'm tall, and know how to drive with side mirrors
- delete side steps
- installed Grom Vline V2
- got Techstream connected and can see ECU values and AHC pressures
- Ironman front bumper (on sale!)
- WARN VR Evo 12s winch
- fog & driving bumper lights
- 4x4 Labs rear bumper and tire carrier
- Prospeed roof rack
- 42" top light bar
- dual battery setup with BlueSea combiner switch and ACR
- cheap 6-relay aux circuit box for lights, fans, and compressor relay
- OEM AC aux fan
- Viair 400C compressor (engine bay)
- 16" OEM wheels (nasty chrome)
- King 79 rear springs
- Sway Away front torsion bars
- Firestone air bags
- Dobinson rear drawers
- Domitec 50L fridge
- Kenwood D710G VHF/UHF ham radio
- super custom side ladders took all day to build

Current photo:

 

[ScottyS]

Have been thinking hard about the suspension approach. Going to start with components that will allow an AHC lift of ~2", but keep the rig operational in case of AHC failure on a long trip and also lend themselves to a suspension conversion later (should that prove necessary).

All of the people running AHC lifts and off-roading have been inspiring to go this route. Particularly this thread by @1sar39 and this one by @DirtDawg. Going to start the parts list soon, and will be asking some questions to verify if the combo sounds good for the application.

Also thinking I need to get the high-weight items on the truck before doing the torsion bars, sensor lift, coils and AHC pressure tuning. My twist on the existing threads will be that I expect to install air springs/bags to supplement high loads (like motorcycle rack), which then means I need to be able to monitor AHC pressures in real time. Need to look into that more.

First steps though are going to be baselining my maintenance and condition. I have all the previous records, and will be doing various fluids and minor stuff like heater-tees as preventative. So that's my next week or two of garage time while I research and assemble parts.

 

[changingground]

I have the same basic rig (03 LX470) and am doing the same basic mods, for the same terrain. A couple of suggestions- consider underbody and slider protection. The ASFIR 1/4” front skid is inexpensive ($190 shipped) and lightweight, being aluminum, but offers coverage superior to the stock skid. AHC can be improved with more robust torsion bars and rear coils, but retain some of the flexibility. If you’re determined to go with all aluminum armor, Dissent has some very attractive stuff, though speedy. But if you’re going to run it for 10 years, then the benefits outweighs the initial price.

 

[95Fantasma80]

welcome to the LX and KDX crew. pure Japanese tanks and work horses.

View media item 86562

 

[ScottyS]

welcome to the LX and KDX crew. pure Japanese tanks and work horses.

View media item 86562

Heck yeah!! My KLX250 is the BEST $2000 I ever spent. Since that photo, I've made a few more mods. I run the Kenda TM2 rear and 13T pinion, holy cow it does amazing for a severely underpowered and heavy bike. Until I get to 9000+ feet on DG hills that is. My main riding pal has a superbike...KTM 300 with all the right mods, plus he's a lot lighter and younger...but we still tear it up.

 

[95Fantasma80]

Heck yeah!! My KLX250 is the BEST $2000 I ever spent. Since that photo, I've made a few more mods. I run the Kenda TM2 rear and 13T pinion, holy cow it does amazing for a severely underpowered and heavy bike. Until I get to 9000+ feet on DG hills that is. My main riding pal has a superbike...KTM 300 with all the right mods, plus he's a lot lighter and younger...but we still tear it up.

My mistake thought it was a kdx, either way klx is still a work horse. Gearing changes make huge difference for the technical stuff did 12t on the kdx and its a goat on the steep hills.

 

[ScottyS]

My mistake thought it was a kdx, either way klx is still a work horse. Gearing changes make huge difference for the technical stuff did 12t on the kdx and its a goat on the steep hills.

Yeah, this bike is closer to 300 lbs with all the gear on, and the exhaust outlet is tiny, but workhorse it is and pretty overbuilt. Your KDX's are a barrel of fun I bet.

 

[gregnash]

Looks like lots of fun... So now the question is... where in Western NV. Always looking to add new members to the BBCNN fold (see clubhouse).
Welcome to the madness!

 

[CBeckFJ]

I don't really see a use for an airbag system on an LX IMO. The AHC will auto level out the rear end while towing, or if there is a lot of weight in the rear. We've put a 3,000 Ib trailer and a 7,000 Ib boat on the rear and the AHC auto leveled both out perfectly.

 

[OwnerCS]

Congratulations and Welcome to the club.

Last weekend I purchased pearl white 99 model to use for off-road fun. While it needs some maintenance catch up, its all there and I really enjoy AHC.

Last year I restored a 99 model Tacoma. that included a complete engine swap. That was a good practice run for the LX470 restoration.
While it won't be as "all encompassing" as the Tacoma project, I do have a lot of new things to learn about properly adding weight, bumpers, and winch with AHC.

My automotive history (over the past 10 years) before getting into Toyota last year with the Tacoma, was all with Nissan/Infiniti.

The great thing about coming from Nissan/Infiniti to Toyota/Lexus is both manufactures use similar sized metric wrenches for 90% of maintenance operations. So I'm already well equipped with 8, 10, 12, 13, 14, 17, 19, 21, 22 mm tools and sockets in various drives and configurations. Its an easy transition that allows me to leverage my specialty tool collection.

I will be following your build with great interest.

Right now I'm collecting parts to rebuild my front suspension and CV drive line. Last weekend I replaced the AHC fluid, ATF, and installed new O2 sensors. Next up will be to replace the tile and telescopic wheel motors and the instrument cluster.

Good Luck! I know you will keep us posted with updates.

 

[J1000]

You picked the right truck you will definitely enjoy it more than the X-Terra. In regards to the AHC lift, you will probably find that the stock AHC "H" height is already quite tall. I don't have a ton of experience but from the small amount of wheeling I've done I would definitely recommend lockers instead of an AHC lift. The 100 AHC already goes pretty dang high. Would be better to make sure it can function and always reach that H height vs. trying to make it go even further and maybe get stuck in N.

I don't really see a use for an airbag system on an LX IMO. The AHC will auto level out the rear end while towing, or if there is a lot of weight in the rear. We've put a 3,000 Ib trailer and a 7,000 Ib boat on the rear and the AHC auto leveled both out perfectly.

That's impressive with the 7k boat. Loading my truck up with ammo from the gun show and I will bottom out the AHC really easily and it will failsafe to L. I added airbags and can now carry the same load in H if I wanted to.

 

[ScottyS]

Looks like lots of fun... So now the question is... where in Western NV. Always looking to add new members to the BBCNN fold (see clubhouse).
Welcome to the madness!

Reno area - I will check out the clubhouse, but my time is really tight so I won't be a regular. More of an occasional!

I don't really see a use for an airbag system on an LX IMO. The AHC will auto level out the rear end while towing, or if there is a lot of weight in the rear. We've put a 3,000 Ib trailer and a 7,000 Ib boat on the rear and the AHC auto leveled both out perfectly.

Here's my thinking on this: (1) I tend to REALLY overload my rigs (see the poster's comment on ammo v. AHC ); (2) I want a failsafe for AHC in case of corner failure. Airbags in the rear and HD torsion bars in the front should cover this. Airbags would let me tune within AHC pressure spec for a given trip loadout. Since it's inexpensive and simple, I don't see the downside.

Congratulations and Welcome to the club.
...
Good Luck! I know you will keep us posted with updates.

Awesome, thanks. Your project sounds pretty involved as well.

You picked the right truck you will definitely enjoy it more than the X-Terra. In regards to the AHC lift, you will probably find that the stock AHC "H" height is already quite tall. I don't have a ton of experience but from the small amount of wheeling I've done I would definitely recommend lockers instead of an AHC lift. The 100 AHC already goes pretty dang high. Would be better to make sure it can function and always reach that H height vs. trying to make it go even further and maybe get stuck in N.

Thanks, and good points.

So....AHC "high" is only good for low speeds and obstacles. A lot of travel in my part of the world is higher speeds on dirt/rocky roads. In fact, running low pressures on E tires really enhances this (with good suspension). I want to increase the N ride height by some amount to continue my usual practices. No, I won't be rallying around, but I have a solid mix of dirt road, two-track, and 4x4 ops in our adventure style.

In reading the AHC lift threads, I think it's pretty clear that the key to the whole business is keeping pressures within the system envelope. As long as you do that with good system maintenance, the right sensor lift adjustments, and solid torsion/spring upgrades, I don't see a downside. The system should operate as expected. I would only use the H setting for crawling obstacles, and rely on N setting for 90%+ of off-road activity. Based on what I am seeing in threads anyhow. Folks with actual long-term experience and a lot of mixed off-roading feel free to call me out if I'm off track.

Prediction: I will likely tune the AHC lift based on garage door height with final weight, rack, and tires on the truck.....

 

[ScottyS]

Got underneath today and took a good look around. She's really really clean and corrosion-free for a 16-year-old truck. Greased the drivelines and u-joints, they were really dry. Now the little clunk when letting off and then accelerating is gone. No other issues/noises noted.

 

[ScottyS]

So, questions for @caslim, @DirtDawg, and @1sar39:

- any longer-term issues with the AHC+spacers+TB+UCA 2" lifts yet?
- check my parts list if you don't mind:

• AHC spacers from Japan 4x4
• King KTRS-79 springs with 30mm spacers
• TT diff drop
• TT extended rear sway bar links (or, where did you get yours?)
• do I need extended front sway bar links?
• Dobinson's UCA's
• Sway Away torsion bars
• Firestone coil-rite air bags
• custom monkeying with the sensor brackets

This is for a 2004 that will have front/rear bumpers, sliders, winch, and a LOT of extra gear on the roof and rear cargo carrier. Appreciate your feedback since you run a similar setup.

 

[DirtDawg]

So, questions for @caslim, @DirtDawg, and @1sar39:

- any longer-term issues with the AHC+spacers+TB+UCA 2" lifts yet?
- check my parts list if you don't mind:

• AHC spacers from Japan 4x4
• King KTRS-79 springs with 30mm spacers
• TT diff drop
• TT extended rear sway bar links (or, where did you get yours?)
• do I need extended front sway bar links?
• Dobinson's UCA's
• Sway Away torsion bars
• Firestone coil-rite air bags
• custom monkeying with the sensor brackets

This is for a 2004 that will have front/rear bumpers, sliders, winch, and a LOT of extra gear on the roof and rear cargo carrier. Appreciate your feedback since you run a similar setup.

Nice rig Scotty, welcome to Mud!

I've been running conventional suspension (tough dog kit) for about 20k now, but ran with the AHC lift for about 15k. So I will share my thoughts and opinions from that experience.

I want to start by saying that if your rig is truly intended to be an expedition vehicle that is to take you & your family across the continent while being heavily loaded, reconsider going with a traditional suspension set up. While you may be able to get pressures in spec & the AHC to handle your loads properly, it is still a complex system that can fail or simply act up while on the road. Example: A height sensor can fail on the trail, then you are stuck dragging your a$$ for the remainder of the trail.

Mine never failed or showed issues on trips, but I swapped out due to 2 main points. 1. My control valves were starting to fail. While this didn't affect the functionality of the suspension, I was starting to feel every tiny imperfection in the road & I knew it meant potential failure down the road. 2. After DAYS of tuning the system and trying different things, I just never felt that the system liked being lifted & weighed down. It never acted funny or out of character, but never felt as stable as a conventional suspension set up.

With a conventional suspension set up, it is very easy to pinpoint issues and deal with them. And you can get your spring rates right where they need to be.

However, with all this being said, if you still would like to keep the AHC, here are my thoughts about your current plan:

-AHC spacers are good. I still beleive in these as they put the hydraulic piston back in its intended operating range. However, I believe that if you are really going hard offroad (dune bashing), you should stroke the shock after install of the spacers and extend the bump stops if needed.
-The King KTRS coils were designed for additional load on the AHC system, therefore I believe they are the perfect spring for this setup.
-Diff drops are good, but not required. I have been running for 3 years on 2.5" of lift with no diff drop.
-I believe extended front and rear sway bar links really benefit the vehicle. They put the bars back in the OEM position so that the leverage arm is the same. I would do front before rear. These are not needed however, I ran on stock links, lifted, for quite a while.
-No experience with Dobinson's UCAs, but fully believe in aftermarket UCAs post lift to correct alignment geometry. Nitro or Total Chaos arms are my preference.
-I dont believe in using traditional springs on the AHC system. The spring rates on aftermarket springs is way to high and will overspring the system. I know several people have installed them and they "work", but they dont allow the system to work as designed and severely alter the pressure curve. I would stick with the stock AHC torsion bars or if you really load up the front end (bumper, winch, dual batteries, lights), then maybe the OEM LC torsion bars would work.
-I'm not an airbag guy due to several reasons. I believe you should pick your spring based off of the intended use of the vehicle. However if it is a dual purpose rig that will be heavily loaded on trips and empty for daily duty, they are ok. I dont like them with the AHC system. And it is a bad idea to rely on aftermarket TBs & airbags to support the vehicle in a failure instance as they will be working against you the other 99.99% of the time (torsion bars mainly).

With the above points, I want to reiterate swapping to a traditional system. I like AHC, and believe it works well for certain situations. But I believe when you try to take the system too far outside of its intended use, you are asking for issues/trouble. With the brackets & upgraded king springs I think it works perfect as a lifted setup that can carry light to medium loads. And while people are swapping in coils/TBs intended for traditional setups & getting pressures in spec, they are completely ignoring the pressure curve. Which most do, as its not commonly talked about on here.

While we can get pressures in spec sitting still, it is a completely different story about how those pressures fluctuate while driving (pressure curve). Thats what everyone ignores, especially when installing a way too stiff spring. This leads to either putting too much pressure on the system, or not enough, which leads to poor dampening. So when I was messing with my system, I always was shooting to get close to that stock pressure curve. The closer I got, the "better" the vehicle rode and handled.

TLDR; Go with a traditional setup, especially if you plan on carrying heavy loads.

 

[caslim]

Welcome to MUD! I completely agree with DirtDawg for the fact that you will be putting a lot of armour on the rig. However, if you are able to get aluminum bumpers, you may be ablet to keep and maintain the AHC. I upgraded my TB's and rear springs along with the AHC lift, and I was able to still keep the pressure within spec. What I love about the AHC is the versatility and the ability to change the dampening on the fly. The globes and such will eventually go out no matter how much I maintain them. So, I too will eventually ditch the AHC and go with a different setup. For now though, it's been great. I have about 20k miles on the lift with the upgrades coils.

 

[turbotoyz]

I love AHC and I run full armor.

Up front:
Ironman front number
9.5k winch synthetic line.
Knock off ARB intensity lights.

Back:
4x4 labs dual swing out with ladder.
34" spare

Other heavy bits:
Metaltech sliders
Dissent roof rack
KISS drawers
ARB 50 quart and fridge slide.

I've adjusted my TB and added 30mm spacers and new AHC springs to get the pressure in spec. Also a fluid change. The rig has 225k miles on it and it's been running like this for 30k. 19.5" front and 20.5" back hub to fender. No static lift...well maybe 0.25" up front. I don't intend to lift it as i can clear 34" and go in high mode when I need to.

I did add airbags to the back for when I load it down for family camping trips and when I tow my car trailer. When it's not loaded I keep about 10 psi in the bags. I am thinking of getting the king coils some time, but the system works great. I love the ability to adjust damping on the fly and lift it when I need it. I intend to keep maintaining the system and not go conventional. I am a frugal guy and does all my work myself. There are plenty of used AHC parts to snag next to nothing as spares.

 

[1sar39]

So far I have zero issues with running my setup. I think the ride is great.

My rig is pretty heavy with the steel bumpers, winch, sliders, roof rack, and rear drawers. When we hit the road to go camping, I'm typically loaded with 2 adults, 3 kids, 2 dogs, gear, and my teardrop trailer in tow. We've been on several trips (on and off road) loaded up this way and the suspension had been flawless. I think I'm going to install airbags in the near future, just to ease the pressure in the rear while fully loaded. I havent had it drop to low being loaded down, yet. But as my kids get older, heavier, and want to bring more stuff along, I'm hoping to prevent my lx sticking in low with the help from airbags.

And like @turbotoyz said "There are plenty of used AHC parts to snag next to nothing". I have almost a complete spare ahc system for parts if anything fails, and I got it all for less than $300.

 

[suprarx7nut]

Reno area - I will check out the clubhouse, but my time is really tight so I won't be a regular. More of an occasional!



Here's my thinking on this: (1) I tend to REALLY overload my rigs (see the poster's comment on ammo v. AHC ); (2) I want a failsafe for AHC in case of corner failure. Airbags in the rear and HD torsion bars in the front should cover this. Airbags would let me tune within AHC pressure spec for a given trip loadout. Since it's inexpensive and simple, I don't see the downside.



Awesome, thanks. Your project sounds pretty involved as well.



Thanks, and good points.

So....AHC "high" is only good for low speeds and obstacles. A lot of travel in my part of the world is higher speeds on dirt/rocky roads. In fact, running low pressures on E tires really enhances this (with good suspension). I want to increase the N ride height by some amount to continue my usual practices. No, I won't be rallying around, but I have a solid mix of dirt road, two-track, and 4x4 ops in our adventure style.

In reading the AHC lift threads, I think it's pretty clear that the key to the whole business is keeping pressures within the system envelope. As long as you do that with good system maintenance, the right sensor lift adjustments, and solid torsion/spring upgrades, I don't see a downside. The system should operate as expected. I would only use the H setting for crawling obstacles, and rely on N setting for 90%+ of off-road activity. Based on what I am seeing in threads anyhow. Folks with actual long-term experience and a lot of mixed off-roading feel free to call me out if I'm off track.

Prediction: I will likely tune the AHC lift based on garage door height with final weight, rack, and tires on the truck.....

Maybe I'm underestimating your use case, but I can't see how a sensor lift would help at high speeds. If you're going over 20 mph in areas where the bumper and undercarriage are at risk of hitting obstacles, you need some skid plates. If you lift it, you're going to want a diff drop if reliability is your concern. And then you're right back to the ground clearance you started with before the lift.

Adding a lift creates more of a reliability detriment than AHC, IMO. CVs wear out much faster; with traditional setups, the torsion arm bracket can fail, etc...

I'm a fan of AHC and the unparalleled flexibility and comfort it offers. Setup the system so that your heaviest load out is still right near the top end of the pressure range and I think you'll be fine. Maybe set it up so some air bags provide that extra help when you've got the dirt bikes hanging off the rear.

The motor portion of the AHC pump is available relatively cheaply as well. That makes for a good spare part on hand if you're really way out in a remote setting jumping dunes. You can also pro-actively replace the globes for around half the cost of a good aftermarket lift kit.


Lockers: @J1000 made a good point to me recently. I have been contemplating adding a locker to my "new to me" 06LX. I was thinking rear first. He said to reconsider adding one up front because the rear axle is rock solid where the front diff has some failure potential. I think there's some merit to that idea. the instances where a center diff lock, front diff lock and ATRAC are not enough to get you out of a jam will be few and far between. The risk of front diff failure might be greater. Food for thought.

Good luck with the build and keep us updated!

 

[CloudCity]

Awesome find man, welcome and glad to see you already in love with the rig. Phenomenal vehicles and the addiction will only grow. Enjoy and make those family memories!