Starting: LX 470 family (on/off road) adventure rig

[ScottyS]

Wow guys, great replies and I really appreciate the longer write-ups. This is all very good food for thought.

@turbotoyz do you like the Ironman? The traditional braced hoop style is really what I am wanting to go with. There is a thread on an aluminum bumper of that style, I think by a fella Kavik, that looked sweet, but seems he's MIA at the moment. Do you have more photos of your awesome rig? That is pretty much what I am going for. What size wheels/tires? Did you go with a non-stock offset? Did you have to do anything to the wells to clear 34's?

@suprarx7nut I am so used to having extra clearance that I really am hesitant to leave at stock height with this longer, wider rig. I've been thinking I will go skid plates no matter what though. The diff drop would change clearance for the front diff, sure, but everything else will be higher. I did pick up a diff drop kit, not installed yet. Is the front diff on the 2004+ still a weak point? There is something to be said for locking up front, for sure.

The airbags would be in place for exactly the reason of occasional overloading (not all the time). Also would double as "backup" to a rear AHC failure.

@DirtDawg do you think that the method of re-indexing the TB's as described in one of the other threads will throw the pressure response curve off that far with armor and load? So, like you I am much more comfortable mechanically with a traditional system. I'm trying to pick parts that would also directly apply to a swap if a couple years down the road the AHC system just had to go. Thanks for that long writeup, that took some time. I'm sure I'm not the only one that will be taking that info home.

I'll keep accumulating parts and thinking about all this....still deciding how to stage out the mods.

 

[DirtDawg]

@DirtDawg do you think that the method of re-indexing the TB's as described in one of the other threads will throw the pressure response curve off that far with armor and load? So, like you I am much more comfortable mechanically with a traditional system. I'm trying to pick parts that would also directly apply to a swap if a couple years down the road the AHC system just had to go. Thanks for that long writeup, that took some time. I'm sure I'm not the only one that will be taking that info home.

I don’t think reindexing the stock TBs with throw off the pressure curve, but I believe overdoing it with weight up front can.

 

[turbotoyz]

@turbotoyz do you like the Ironman? The traditional braced hoop style is really what I am wanting to go with. There is a thread on an aluminum bumper of that style, I think by a fella Kavik, that looked sweet, but seems he's MIA at the moment. Do you have more photos of your awesome rig? That is pretty much what I am going for. What size wheels/tires? Did you go with a non-stock offset? Did you have to do anything to the wells to clear 34's?

I do like the Ironman bumper. It is a lot like ARB and this fit and finish is great, one thing to note I had to adjust my grill support to allow the hood to clear the top tube. I was just going to do a hidden witch mount behind my oem bumper or a aluminum bumper from Dissent to keep weight down. I got a killer deal under $900 shipped I couldn't pass up on.

I am running 285/75R17 Falken WILDPEAK A/T3W on TRD Rock Warrior rims. I have to use 1" wheel spacer up front to clear the drive flange. I cant recall the offset but there is a post on Mud about fitting the wheels on 100 series. I had to do a pinch weld mod and heat and remold the fender liner in a few places. I love the tires and size. I wheel it with AHC in normal mode no lift. Put it in high when I need the extra clearance, low for fitting in garages or loading up gear.

It had been mentioned on the forums here how the AHC front will flex better. It will use all of its available travel more than non-AHC setups. Previous IFS rigs would always leave a lot of uptravel on the table when flexing.

Appreciate the complement on the rig. Looking forward to see what you do with yours.

 

[suprarx7nut]

Wow guys, great replies and I really appreciate the longer write-ups. This is all very good food for thought.

@turbotoyz do you like the Ironman? The traditional braced hoop style is really what I am wanting to go with. There is a thread on an aluminum bumper of that style, I think by a fella Kavik, that looked sweet, but seems he's MIA at the moment. Do you have more photos of your awesome rig? That is pretty much what I am going for. What size wheels/tires? Did you go with a non-stock offset? Did you have to do anything to the wells to clear 34's?

@suprarx7nut I am so used to having extra clearance that I really am hesitant to leave at stock height with this longer, wider rig. I've been thinking I will go skid plates no matter what though. The diff drop would change clearance for the front diff, sure, but everything else will be higher. I did pick up a diff drop kit, not installed yet. Is the front diff on the 2004+ still a weak point? There is something to be said for locking up front, for sure.

The airbags would be in place for exactly the reason of occasional overloading (not all the time). Also would double as "backup" to a rear AHC failure.

@DirtDawg do you think that the method of re-indexing the TB's as described in one of the other threads will throw the pressure response curve off that far with armor and load? So, like you I am much more comfortable mechanically with a traditional system. I'm trying to pick parts that would also directly apply to a swap if a couple years down the road the AHC system just had to go. Thanks for that long writeup, that took some time. I'm sure I'm not the only one that will be taking that info home.

I'll keep accumulating parts and thinking about all this....still deciding how to stage out the mods.

It's possible I'm still underestimating your use case, but I just can't see how driving over 20mph is anywhere near reasonable if you're driving over 10" obstacles. That's like full on Baja Racing! The 100 series has a TON of overall clearance underneath it compared to virtually everything expect a Wrangler. If you install full skids, you'll have to really try to break something.

If you're driving over obstacles that anything in the undercarriage on a stock 100 would be at risk of hitting, you should be slowing down enough to put it in H, IMO. You might just be that much of a baller and you're racing through boulders, but I think you might just be a little overly clearance-cautious.

I wouldn't call the front diff weak, but if anything's going to fail during a heavy duty wheeling adventure, that's probably one of the first. I think driving style and caution goes a long ways towards preventing that failure (IE, if a front tire starts to spin, get your foot off that accelerator and come back at it with a delicate touch).

 

[ScottyS]

Dropped by 4x4Labs today and got an order started for a rear dual-swing w/tire carrier. Going to have three 2" receivers put in for a multi-piece motorcycle carrier, apparently @4x4labs built a system for this that's currently with Luke in MX so I didn't get to see the final version in person.

The spacers from @Japan4X4 got here just fine, and King springs are on in customs. I have the Sway Away TB's on hand as well as the diff drop.
Still have to round up: sway bar bushings and links, 30mm spacers, airbags, and UCA's.

Thinking about all the great replies from folks for a while has me on the fence between going with an initial 1" sensor lift with the Japan4x4 spacers to recover full stroke in H mode, or else the full 2" which would require the UCA's and extended sway links. I may start with a shorter lift and see if I can get the ride/pressures dialed in, and drive it for a while like that.

Techstream says my pressures as-is (I haven't touched the suspension components yet) are 7.2 Front and 8.1 Rear, 10.6 accumulator, which is not what most people seem to report (front is usually higher than rear).

Short-term solution is to throw the King springs in with no spacers, and adjust the factory TB's to get in spec. Then, when the bumpers are added, put the new TB's and spring spacers in, probably with the AHC spacers and sensor lift all at the same time.

 

[CBeckFJ]

I do like the Ironman bumper. It is a lot like ARB and this fit and finish is great, one thing to note I had to adjust my grill support to allow the hood to clear the top tube. I was just going to do a hidden witch mount behind my oem bumper or a aluminum bumper from Dissent to keep weight down. I got a killer deal under $900 shipped I couldn't pass up on.

I am running 285/75R17 Falken WILDPEAK A/T3W on TRD Rock Warrior rims. I have to use 1" wheel spacer up front to clear the drive flange. I cant recall the offset but there is a post on Mud about fitting the wheels on 100 series. I had to do a pinch weld mod and heat and remold the fender liner in a few places. I love the tires and size. I wheel it with AHC in normal mode no lift. Put it in high when I need the extra clearance, low for fitting in garages or loading up gear.

It had been mentioned on the forums here how the AHC front will flex better. It will use all of its available travel more than non-AHC setups. Previous IFS rigs would always leave a lot of uptravel on the table when flexing.

Appreciate the complement on the rig. Looking forward to see what you do with yours.

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How do you like the Falkens? Definitely considering them for tires once I get my lift on

 

[suprarx7nut]

Dropped by 4x4Labs today and got an order started for a rear dual-swing w/tire carrier. Going to have three 2" receivers put in for a multi-piece motorcycle carrier, apparently @4x4labs built a system for this that's currently with Luke in MX so I didn't get to see the final version in person.

The spacers from @Japan4X4 got here just fine, and King springs are on in customs. I have the Sway Away TB's on hand as well as the diff drop.
Still have to round up: sway bar bushings and links, 30mm spacers, airbags, and UCA's.

Thinking about all the great replies from folks for a while has me on the fence between going with an initial 1" sensor lift with the Japan4x4 spacers to recover full stroke in H mode, or else the full 2" which would require the UCA's and extended sway links. I may start with a shorter lift and see if I can get the ride/pressures dialed in, and drive it for a while like that.

Techstream says my pressures as-is (I haven't touched the suspension components yet) are 7.2 Front and 8.1 Rear, 10.6 accumulator, which is not what most people seem to report (front is usually higher than rear).

Short-term solution is to throw the King springs in with no spacers, and adjust the factory TB's to get in spec. Then, when the bumpers are added, put the new TB's and spring spacers in, probably with the AHC spacers and sensor lift all at the same time.

My AHC pressures are very similar to yours. King springs will lower the rear pressure by around 3 but that new rear, presumably steel, bumper will add back quite a bit. I gave my Tbars 3 turns and that brought front pressues right into spec. I have King springs on hand and they'll go in as soon as is convenient. Until I get my Dissent rear bumper, the King springs will push pressures too low so I'm in no rush now.

 

[turbotoyz]

How do you like the Falkens? Definitely considering them for tires once I get my lift on

I really like them would definitely buy them again at this point.

 

[ScottyS]

The King springs got here today, so I decided to put them in. The higher AHC pressures demand some adjustment, and I want to see how these ride before we start loading them down.

Following this super-easy step-by-step: https://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/lx470-slee-30mm-coil-spacer-install.854017/

Didn't take very long at all. Before I fired everything back up, I started with 3 full turns on the TB's. AHC pressures after driving around the block, then putting into H, dropping into L, then back to N were 6.9-front and 4.7-rear.

Decided to crank one more revolution on the TB's.

Going to take a little drive tomorrow and see how the ride is, but didn't feel stiff running around the block.

 

[ScottyS]

Our weekend drive was great, about 100 mi, and the suspension felt good.

Changed the oil, used Royal Purple HMX 5w-30.

Also bled the AHC system with new fluid all the way around, using @PADDO's nice writeup. Amounts bled were healthy, indicating that my spheres are not trashed. This correlates with the number of increments on the tank between L and H, which was like 12.

Also, with the colder weather it's clear I need new bonnet gas struts. Bleh.

 

[ScottyS]

Finally getting something done here! HD @4x4labs got my rear bumper made, it really is an expert piece of work. Super jazzed with the result and how I will use it in the future.

I asked for triple 2" hitch receivers so that I could have custom rack (motorcycles, etc) versatility. The craftsmanship, welding work, and design of this bumper is just killer. I bought a built and coated bumper, and then took it home for an install. Followed the online directions for cutting/grinding the rear frame xmember, and removing the rear spare carrier. Pretty easy, took a couple of hours total (cheated with a plasma torch).

The new bumper dropped *right* into place, and I mean perfect fit and hole alignment, for both the 8 main bottom bolts as well as the 6 12mm's on the sides where the spare bracket used to be. I'd say this is a really mature design, and it looks/feels very bomber. I'm not going to be crawling, but I think this would do the trick if I was.

Removed the side steps at the same time.....so she's no longer all stock.

Here it is, all dusty from the dirt road to my bro's shop and back.

 

[ScottyS]

Making some progress.....done in the last couple months, and need to take photos:

- Ironman bumper (sale at $999 shipped, could not resist)
- Warn VR EVO 12k synthetic winch
- Dobinson's drawers
- VHF/UHF D710G ham radio (replaced the console DVD)
- 6 switch relay box
- AC cooling fan
- old-school PIAA lights on the bumper
- custom bracket and wiring for dual-battery Blue-Sea switch + ACR

In the box and coming up in the next month:

- HD torsion bars
- airbags
- dual batteries + combiner switch + auto charging relay
- air tank/Viair compressor
- Dometic 50l fridge

To finish researching/acquire/make:

- roof rack (tried contacting Dissent, no luck so far)
- 16" wheels + tires
- HF radio + antenna + tuner
- rear wiring panel + thin batteries
- water tank
- heat exchange + plumbing
- rear swingout accessory holder + ladder
- modular motorbike rack
- interior pockets/holders/organizing

 

[ScottyS]

Progress made, in spite of a crazy workload and wildfire season wreaking havoc....

- dual batteries + combiner switch + auto charging relay
- air tank/Viair compressor
- Dometic 50l fridge

 

[Kabanstva]

Nice work brother!

 

[ScottyS]

Been working in more mods.....added the list to date in the OP.

This weekend has been suspension work: Firestone air bags and SwayWay torsion bars.

The airbags will be great for overloading with AHC in N position, won't help much in getting AHC to H position with a full load, I suspect.

The front SwayAway bars needed -1 spline (PS) and -2 spline (DS) indexing to get even adjustment amounts with lots of adjustment left. No report on road handling yet. Current AHC pressures with the car empty are 6.2 front and 4.8 rear, 10.4 accumulator.

Found some 16" wheels with Yoko Geolandar tires, gonna roll with those until I decide on the 33" option (will probably be 255/85-16 Duratrax or similar).

 

[ScottyS]

Towing at last!

The airbags are working out awesome for both direct motorcycle mounting as well as towing. Been running between 2 and 35 psi depending on what's going on. I did some basic checks with Techstream, but my rule of thumb now is checking to see how easily the AHC goes into H mode with the load on.

Getting close to another front TB assessment since I've got about 3k miles on the install.

Also made some sweet side ladders. Made some nice tabs and welded them to the 4x4Labs bumper, then fit some 1" ~80 wall tubing to the body lines and using round rod for the top two steps and rod-reinforced flat bar w/dimple-die holes for the lower two steps. Secured them to the Prospeed rack on top. Still need to put some clear 3M on the paint behind the steps.

 

[Live to Ski]

W/r to ladder, how do you accommodate frame twisting affects on upper and lower mounting?

 

[menancyandsam]

Love the work you've done. Can you elaborate on the dual batter set up? Is there any solar recharging planned.

 

[ScottyS]

W/r to ladder, how do you accommodate frame twisting affects on upper and lower mounting?

Since this is a pretty stable SUV body, I'm not concerned about major flexing between the bumper and rack (I'm NOT rock crawling, and have no intention of bouncing the bumper off something). In the case of something strange happening with major frame flex that translates to the bumper, I would expect the ladder to flex at the bends, since after all it goes through about 70 total degrees in the pipe between the 2 bends. I guess the question would be if there is frame flex that the ladder bends can't accommodate that instead get translated to the roof mounts, yes? I sure hope I don't get that crazy. One alternative would be heavy rubber spacers at both top and bottom. There is room for it for sure.

Love the work you've done. Can you elaborate on the dual batter set up? Is there any solar recharging planned.

Dual batteries are fit into the stock location with a custom tray and tie-down. They are separated by a Blue Sea ACR for charging and a Combine switch if I need to manually combine. Various light/compressor/radio/other circuits have self-resetting breakers before fuse banks. I've got wiring in the rear ready for a solar input/combiner for the Aux battery, just haven't gotten that far yet. I really need to do a bunch of photos of the circuits and distribution I have so far. Thanks!

 

[Live to Ski]

Since this is a pretty stable SUV body, I'm not concerned about major flexing between the bumper and rack (I'm NOT rock crawling, and have no intention of bouncing the bumper off something). In the case of something strange happening with major frame flex that translates to the bumper, I would expect the ladder to flex at the bends, since after all it goes through about 70 total degrees in the pipe between the 2 bends. I guess the question would be if there is frame flex that the ladder bends can't accommodate that instead get translated to the roof mounts, yes? I sure hope I don't get that crazy. One alternative would be heavy rubber spacers at both top and bottom. There is room for it for sure.



Dual batteries are fit into the stock location with a custom tray and tie-down. They are separated by a Blue Sea ACR for charging and a Combine switch if I need to manually combine. Various light/compressor/radio/other circuits have self-resetting breakers before fuse banks. I've got wiring in the rear ready for a solar input/combiner for the Aux battery, just haven't gotten that far yet. I really need to do a bunch of photos of the circuits and distribution I have so far. Thanks!

Sounds like you know what your doing w/r ladder. Keep on keeping on!