So I think the Michelin Defender is the perfect all-terrain tire... (For most of us)

[gaijin]

I think I discovered this recently, but XL and SL get used interchangeably depending on the manufacture and website. Michelin has the MS2 listed as an XL on their site depending on the size, but Discount Tire Co has the same tire listed as an SL (285/65r18), both product codes show a 116T load index though, and after calling Discount Tire Co to inquire on the issue, XL and SL are the same, it’s just marketing, and depending on what website you’re looking at it will read one way or another.

SL and XL are two different types of tires, they are definitely not the same and would require different tire pressures.

TL;DR: Here's what the Discount Tire bot "Madeline" had to say about this:

The Michelin Defender LTX M/S2 285/65R18 116T is indeed an XL tire, not SL.

Here is the tire on the Michelin site:

And on the TireRack site:

So... whoever it was at Discount Tire who told you that SL and XL are the same, was just plain wrong.

HTH

 

[novamarc]

SL and XL are two different types of tires, they are definitely not the same and would require different tire pressures.

TL;DR: Here's what the Discount Tire bot "Madeline" had to say about this:

View attachment 4070727

The Michelin Defender LTX M/S2 285/65R18 116T is indeed an XL tire, not SL.

Here is the tire on the Michelin site:

View attachment 4070728

And on the TireRack site:

View attachment 4070730

So... whoever it was at Discount Tire who told you that SL and XL are the same, was just plain wrong.

HTH

What’s the difference if they have exact same load rating.

 

[gaijin]

I think I discovered this recently, but XL and SL get used interchangeably depending on the manufacture and website. Michelin has the MS2 listed as an XL on their site depending on the size, but Discount Tire Co has the same tire listed as an SL (285/65r18), both product codes show a 116T load index though, and after calling Discount Tire Co to inquire on the issue, XL and SL are the same, it’s just marketing, and depending on what website you’re looking at it will read one way or another.

For further clarification about the difference between SL and XL ISO-Metric tires, here is a snip from Toyo Tires' excellent monograph on tires and tire pressures:

And to use the tire size you cited as an example, the RCTIP (Recommended Cold Tire Inflation Pressure) for two tires of the same size with one SL and the other XL:

The RCTIP for a 285/65R18 116T SL tire on an LC200 is 33psi

The RCTIP for a 285/65R18 116T XL tire on an LC200 is 38psi

To see the whole Toyo Tire monograph, click here: Guidelines for the Application of Load and Inflation Tables

HTH

 

[gaijin]

What’s the difference if they have exact same load rating.

You asked while I was typing - see my post immediately above.

HTH

 

[novamarc]

You asked while I was typing - see my post immediately above.

HTH

Amazing explanation, and makes much more sense than simply “marketing.” I’m also not sure what stage of life this is where I’m so relieved to have finally acquired a solid understanding of load index labeling for my daily driven lx470 / 570 - but I’m here for it haha seriously, thank you for the insight.

 

[Dunbar]

I got them in and they are XL despite showing SL on the website. "Extra Load" is embossed in the oval.

 

[sdnative]

285/65R18 XL's installed, and aired up to 38 psi. Rides so nice compared to the LT's. Time will tell if this suits my needs better or not, for now liking the change.

View attachment 3762502

@Yossarian do you have any more pictures of this tire / wheel combo on your truck. I just picked up a set of these wheels and am about to pull the trigger on some tires.

Or does anyone else have pictures of the 285/65R18 or 275/70R18 on TRD Pro wheels on a 200? (Ideally a white 2008-2015 LX570 )?




I am almost completely convinced to try the Michelin LTX MS2, question now is size. It's either between 285/65R18 XL or 275/70R18 LT E. I had the 275/70R18 on my last 200, and they were fantastic off-road. Yes, a little stiff on-road but not too bad.

The bar I am setting for this build is places like White Rim (most places in Southern Utah actually), most of the stuff in the San Juans in Southern Colorado, and the Southwest CA/AZ/NV deserts. Established roads, I am not going looking for obstacles, but there may be some on the way to other places. No lift other than AHC high (no sensor lift).

Seems most everyone is recommending, and I am leaning towards, the 285/65R18, but I am concerned it may not be tough enough off-road.

I am attracted to the 275/70R18 as they are taller for increased ground clearance and would fill out the wheel well better.

 

[Dan Higgins]

These are not the best pics of the Defender 275/70R18s as they are from a distance. I have my snow tires on now so I can't get you a current pic. But maybe they will give you an idea. I have been running the 275/70R18 (XL) for nearly 2 years. Before that I ran 285/65 E BFG KO2s for about 8 years. I switched to save weight and to gain a bit of MPG and comfort. (The lighter weigh Michelins are much easier to stack and unstack during winter change over! At 73 years old that stuff matters. ) We drive plenty of back roads. No rock crawling. My greatest concern is sharp rocks. With the KO2s I didn't care. I just drove over anything. Now I am more careful about the sidewalls and sharp rocks. As for the very slightly narrower 275 I saw a YT video where a guy did tire patch comparisons and the difference was negligible. I run the 275s at 38 psi per gaijin's recommendations. There is therefore a slight improvement in on road comfort. That attached pics are from the Four Mile area near Buena Vista, CO this past summer. Dirt roads with plenty of ruts and moguls (articulation matters) but limited sharp rocks. A relatively easy yet fun area with nice views.) I also tow a 5600lbs travel trailer with ~750lbs in tongue with (with a WD hitch). I do increase the PSI by 2-3, especially on the rear tires, during towing season. The weight of my LC when not towing is ~ 6500lbs. (I have Slee rocks sliders, a Gamiviti roof rack and an ARB drawer on one side of the rear cargo area. I also have a 2" ARB OME lift.)

 

[hokiehigh]

On tirerack Defender LTX M/S2 275/70/18 only available in E load, not XL. Are you sure that's the size/load you have?

 

[bloc]

@Yossarian do you have any more pictures of this tire / wheel combo on your truck. I just picked up a set of these wheels and am about to pull the trigger on some tires.

Or does anyone else have pictures of the 285/65R18 or 275/70R18 on TRD Pro wheels on a 200? (Ideally a white 2008-2015 LX570 )?




I am almost completely convinced to try the Michelin LTX MS2, question now is size. It's either between 285/65R18 XL or 275/70R18 LT E. I had the 275/70R18 on my last 200, and they were fantastic off-road. Yes, a little stiff on-road but not too bad.

The bar I am setting for this build is places like White Rim (most places in Southern Utah actually), most of the stuff in the San Juans in Southern Colorado, and the Southwest CA/AZ/NV deserts. Established roads, I am not going looking for obstacles, but there may be some on the way to other places. No lift other than AHC high (no sensor lift).

Seems most everyone is recommending, and I am leaning towards, the 285/65R18, but I am concerned it may not be tough enough off-road.

I am attracted to the 275/70R18 as they are taller for increased ground clearance and would fill out the wheel well better.

I’ve had 285/65 and 275/70 on my vehicle at the same time due to a discount tire screw up.

Yes the extra diameter is marginally noticeable, but IMO it doesn’t justify the “somebody skips leg day” appearance of the narrower tread. Especially on the rear axle as viewed from behind the vehicle.

 

[sdnative]

Just ordered the 285/65R18 XL. I can't believe how expensive tires are these days.

 

[novamarc]

Just ordered the 285/65R18 XL. I can't believe how expensive tires are these days.

Yeah this size in particular is just pricey, the 275/70 is like 80ish bucks cheaper. I cant justify an E tire on my 99% street driven LX though.

 

[knuckle47]

Not a Land Cruiser vehicle but my daily driver pickup came with Goodyear Wrangler tires and on the highway they gave up nearly 80,000 miles. My goal was to take a reasonably quiet sedan like ride and reduce tire road noise. That’s where the Michelin Defenders came into play by accident. A web site I was reading about them actually had the decibel rating for many tires and brands displayed. I looked at every tire combo. I think they may have been almost $300.00 additional

Decided on the Michelins and they were spectacular for road noise, handling and dirt trail roads. At 75 mph they do not whine. I traded this truck in with 165,000 miles and the tires would still have been good for 20,000 more miles

 

[wjcunningham3]

Thank you all for this information!

I have a 2015 200 that I bought in May 2024. I love this truck. I have put about 39,000 miles on it in 20 months. I have the OEM spacer on the front and in August 2025 I put on some 275/70R18 E1 KO3 for off-roading in Colorado. I love the off-road ability of these tires when we do go off-roading, but most of my miles are highway and looking to return back to Michelin for the two roadtrips this summer (Austin to Maine round trip and Austin to Banff round trip). I love the LOOK of my truck at the moment miss the Defenders on long road trips.

This thread has convinced me to go with the Defender LTX M/S2 but in the 265/70R18 XL. I’ll enjoy the lower price and the 19 pounds less per corner! Now just waiting on sale pricing.

 

[sdnative]

Austin to Banff round trip

Sounds fun! We would like to do the same trip someday.

Now just waiting on sale pricing.

Michelin should be $80 off right now until 2/22. Not much but it's something.

 

[sdnative]

285/65R18

 

[tbutler]

285/65R18

View attachment 4081755

View attachment 4081753

Any rubbing?

 

[Gartenmeister]

I know this is the 200 board but I've got a 100 question for you guys since this seems to be the center of Defender LTX knowledge....

I have plenty of experience with various Defenders on my 200, 4Runner and an Excursion, and am considering grabbing a set for my LX470 while the Costco sale is on (Defender LTX MS). The stock size on the LX is 275/70R16 but the more common and entirely appropriate 265/75R16 is also available. I have them compared below, and I can see the obvious (small) differences in size, weight etc. What I am curious about is the difference in service description between these two sizes. The 275 is H-rated, the 265 is T. These are both SL load range although the 265 has a slightly higher load index. So the question is: in the real world is there likely to be a any difference in the ride quality between these two sizes? Thanks!

 

[sdnative]

Any rubbing?

Nothing yet but I haven't flexed them. No rubbing turning the wheel lock to lock in AHC low.

 

[Sandroad]

I know this is the 200 board but I've got a 100 question for you guys since this seems to be the center of Defender LTX knowledge....

I have plenty of experience with various Defenders on my 200, 4Runner and an Excursion, and am considering grabbing a set for my LX470 while the Costco sale is on (Defender LTX MS). The stock size on the LX is 275/70R16 but the more common and entirely appropriate 265/75R16 is also available. I have them compared below, and I can see the obvious (small) differences in size, weight etc. What I am curious about is the difference in service description between these two sizes. The 275 is H-rated, the 265 is T. These are both SL load range although the 265 has a slightly higher load index. So the question is: in the real world is there likely to be a any difference in the ride quality between these two sizes? Thanks!


View attachment 4081848

I don’t know about ride difference, but if your buying from Costco, it may be a moot point. My local Costco won’t mount or even order anything other than the OEM size.