QSB 4.5 swap in my FJ80? Talk me out of it.

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I'm dead set on putting a diesel engine in my 1991 FJ80, but which one? At first I liked the 4BT until I went for a ride in a friend's FJ60 with a 4BT; power? A lot, would never call it slow. MPG? Unbelievable! 23mpg. But it rattles bad, like someone shaking your seat. And the noise, oh the noise. It sounds just like a tractor with no muffler revving to 3k. Ear plugs, a suspension seat, and it would be ideal.
Next was the 4BD1T which is a LOT quieter because it's a highway engine. Other attributes that are nice about a highway engine are the mounting brackets for accessories, you don't have to reinvent the wheel. It's also 4" shorter from valve cover to oil pan than the 4BT, and its sleeved, and there're quite a few experts out there who are willing to help get the most out of them.
I also saw a build thread for a 4D34T, and I liked the idea of it being a near drop in; bolts up to the A440, uses stock mounting location, just minor mount modifications for shape and strength. Also 4" shorter on the vertical and I saw one with 30psi in an 80 series do a 0-100mph run and it looked like it was hauling the mail.
Toyota engines are out for me because they're hilariously expensive and I've never heard of one making 500ftlbs, I'm sure it's possible, but at what cost? I don't want a $20k 1HDT that I can't get parts for.
I'm really curious about two options that I'm still learning about;
The first is the HINO; its owned by Toyota, but they don't seem to translate to passenger vehicles. Wondering if anyone has put one in a Cruiser and what goes into it.
The other is the QSB 4.5; from what I was told, they are converted for automotive applications a lot in Brazil. it's common rail and computer controlled, but its quiet for an industrial diesel engine. Like all industrial applications the power rating is all over the place, but I've seen quoted power and torque figures of 170 and 440 respecively, I've also heard of 300hp tunes but don't really have a way to confirm that (although it would be epic right up to the point that it broke everything its attached to lol). If I went the QSB route, I'd want to go full tilt; get a trans and Tcase from a pickup/truck with a 6.7 Cummins. I'm sure that Advanced could spin me up any adapters that I might need, Painless could make me a harness, the difficult/interesting challenge would be to find an ECU to run it all. Holley, F.A.S.T, F.I.Tech, and Haltech all make products that basically do what I'm asking for, but there's the diesel factor, and the Tcase to consider.
I'm also considering C303 portal axles, but that might limit highway use.
And before the money issue comes up; a friend of mine owns an equipment rental place and can get any of these engines, so the cost breakdown works like this; the 4BT, 4BD, and 4D34T all cost about the same, $3500 for a good used one.
The HINO is closer to $5,000 used and $7,000 new.
The QSB 4.5 is about $6,000 used(when they can be found) and $8,000 new.
What direction should I go? Don't say 6.2 or 6.5 GM, I blew up one of each in my K5; the block of the 6,2 cracked and a hole was punched in the number one piston of the 6.5, both were too expensive to fix.
 
Hino use Toyota engines, not sure which variant.

You seem dead against 1hd-t. I'm fairly sure 500ft/lb is doable (but might be wrong) and they are bolt in.
I live in Australia, 1hd-t capital of the world, yes, we can walk into most auto parts stores and buy basic spares, but its often cheaper to import parts for major maintenance or repairs from either Japan or UAE. even cheaper when shopping with USD?
I wouldn't say parts are unavailable, you just need to look outside the box, plan ahead for maintenance etc.
 
In a word, no. I dunno if the 6.7 uses the same SAE#3 pattern that the 4.5 does. If it does, then that's a $1,500+ item off the list. I imagine the harness being in the $1-2k range. The ECU will be the real trick, upwards of $2500? $6,000 to make $12,000 worth of parts work together... I've definitely lost it.
 
Hino use Toyota engines, not sure which variant.

You seem dead against 1hd-t. I'm fairly sure 500ft/lb is doable (but might be wrong) and they are bolt in.
I live in Australia, 1hd-t capital of the world, yes, we can walk into most auto parts stores and buy basic spares, but its often cheaper to import parts for major maintenance or repairs from either Japan or UAE. even cheaper when shopping with USD?
I wouldn't say parts are unavailable, you just need to look outside the box, plan ahead for maintenance etc.

I have nothing against the 1HD-T, they last forever, but it seems to me that if I wanted 500ftlbs, everything would have to be bespoke. Injection pump, injectors, turbo(s), intercooler, waste gate... etc. And that is where it gets way up there in price, I don't think $20k is an exaggeration. You are right though, it wound be easy to install, I'd probably have to upgrade the trans to an AW450 to stand up to all that and either the Toyota two piece case or spring for an Atlas. If I see a 1HD-T on KAJIJI in Canada for a good price, I will definitely look into it.
The HINO WO4C-TH is the one I'm looking at. It appears to be an overgrown 13B, it has the same 3.9 liter displacement that the 4BT, 4BD, and 4D34 have, but far more output. The WO4 is rated at 200hp and 400ftlbs when intercooled, and it's all mechanical, so turn a few screws and we're at 500ftlbs. I love the challenge of the QSB, but the simplicity of that HINO has me thinking.
 
Hino use Toyota engines, not sure whicu seem dead against 1hd-t. I'm fairly sure 500ft/lb is doable (but might be wrong) and they are bolt in.
I live in Australia, 1hd-t capital of the world, yes, we can walk into most auto parts stores and buy basic spares, but its often cheaper to import parts for major maintenance or repairs from either Japan or UAE. even cheaper when shopping with USD?
I wouldn't say parts are unavailable, you just need to look outside the box, plan ahead for maintenance etc.
Question for you, have you heard of anyone using a Haltech product in a diesel application?
 
Of course! But its operating under similar principals, I mean all the same sensors are there, ignition timing would now control the injection pump instead of the distributor. Pulse width modulation is basically the same. Its totally doable. And that's the part I like about this swap, the challenge. But, then again, having a rig that will be able to do more than I'll ever ask it to in six or eight months sounds amazing too and probably full of challenges too. Gonna take a while.... Maybe build two rigs... Lol.
 
sounds like an interesting project.

one difference with an oil burner rather than a gas engine is O2 sensors would need to be wide band sensors, and I guess calibration would be different
 
dgeon, post: 10753039, member: 30057"]sounds like an interesting project.

one difference with an oil burner rather than a gas engine is O2 sensors would need to be wide band sensors, and I guess calibration would be different[/QUOTE]
The pyromitor could be used in place of an O2 sensor, the higher the egts, the more fuel is being used and the system could respond with more boost or less fuel to maintain optimal efficiency. That can be accomplished through pulse width motulation and electronic boost control. Just a theory.
 
I don't think a pyro would be accurate enough, nor responsive enough. A pyro can have lag in registering changes in temps.

wide band O2 sensors are available for AFR testing in diesels. You'd just need to know the relevant output voltages for the wide band O2 sensor so you can set up the PWM to suit
 
I'm still getting to know all the computer controls, I didn't know that diesels had O2 sensors. Technology moves so fast. That makes sense, you could at least get a baseline to work from.
 
Interesting stuff. It looks like they've taken what they've learned from gas engines and applied it to diesel engines. So, in theory, if all the data collection points are there, one would only need to tell the computer what the values mean and where the ideal parameters are. So, if the goal in maximum MPG or 300hp, the computer can make the tweeks to get the desired result. I see the Haltech guys do stuff like that with gassers all the time. Maybe I can get them to sponsor the build. Lol.
 
Why not a V6 TDI of a Touareg? Or V10 for that matter. Readily available, legal to swap, affordable (compared to everything you listed) and very reliable.
I never considered either of those because of the cost of the
vehicles that those engines come out of. A well optioned Q7 with a V10 can get close to $100k, so I figured those engines would be astronomically expensive. Do you have a site or a company that can be contacted for more details? As far as the legality, I live in a rural county in Arizona, so I can put a 6V53 from the 70s in a brand new truck. If one doesn't live in Maricopa County, or within 30ish miles of Tucson, one does not have to smog their car. I'm gonna go research this out. That would be very exciting. But would I have to go to ABT to get it tuned? That would be extremely expensive.
 
I never considered either of those because of the cost of the
vehicles that those engines come out of. A well optioned Q7 with a V10 can get close to $100k, so I figured those engines would be astronomically expensive. Do you have a site or a company that can be contacted for more details? As far as the legality, I live in a rural county in Arizona, so I can put a 6V53 from the 70s in a brand new truck. If one doesn't live in Maricopa County, or within 30ish miles of Tucson, one does not have to smog their car. I'm gonna go research this out. That would be very exciting. But would I have to go to ABT to get it tuned? That would be extremely expensive.
The V10 came in mid 2000's Touaregs, and the V6 replaced it. Tunes are readily available from several vendors for a few hundred dollars, all without having to drive a mile. You'd be well served to check out Tdiclub forums.

If you could be happy with 400 ft lbs, you'd be very happy with any of the later model 4 cyl models. The BHW or CJAA would be my pick. Motors can be had for $500-$1,500 and there's a massive aftermarket community with tons of mods and support.

My 1HDT had 163/300 hp/tq, and it felt very quick. I can only imagine what a 225/400 2.0L TDI with instant boost would feel like...

Making the swap 50 state legal will tremendously increase your resale value.

Edit: There is a V10 for 4,500 on car-part.com
 
I can't imagine a 2.0l, 4cyl engine being particularly impressive in a 2.5+ tonne vehicle. I guess torque is torque, but how highly strung and how heavily loaded is a 2.0 going to be in a cruiser?
then what do you use for transmission? the donor vehicles trans? Adapters for transfer case? is a transmission from a 1800kg vehicle going to cope lugging a cruisers 2800kg fat ass around?
Or do you use a cruiser trans, and reinvent the wheel making adapters to the engine?
what would you need to do with final drive gearing?

plus, it would look ridiculous in the engine bay of a cruiser, you'd fit two of them in there :rofl:
 
An ECU per bank of cylinders? I can tell that it will be extremely expensive to work on. I found a 2007 V10 for $5k, but then I went looking for parts. $300 for an alternator, $400 for an injector, even the gaskets are stupid expensive. I'll look at the V6 next, but the V10 is way out.
 
I can't imagine a 2.0l, 4cyl engine being particularly impressive in a 2.5+ tonne vehicle. I guess torque is torque, but how highly strung and how heavily loaded is a 2.0 going to be in a cruiser?
then what do you use for transmission? the donor vehicles trans? Adapters for transfer case? is a transmission from a 1800kg vehicle going to cope lugging a cruisers 2800kg fat ass around?
Or do you use a cruiser trans, and reinvent the wheel making adapters to the engine?
what would you need to do with final drive gearing?

plus, it would look ridiculous in the engine bay of a cruiser, you'd fit two of them in there :rofl:

They use the same 2.0 in the VW Amarok. There is a adapter kit for the R150F trans out of the V6 4Runner.

Your biggest "strain" factors will be EGTs, boost, oil and coolant temps. Egts are kept in check with higher boost and larger intercoolers, the stock block can easily handle the boost required to churn out 400 ft lbs, and a slightly larger oil heat exchanger will remove any heat concerns.

There are several documented swaps in similar vehicles on tdiclub, and they are easily able to keep their parameters in check.

VNT turbos, especially the latest generation, put out boost just off idle. The cjaa would be more complicated, but have more headroom. The BHW would be very simple and reliable.
 
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