PTO winches

[nickw]

Well, installed on a gasser, I'd agree; however, a hydraulic winch installed on a diesel is a great combination, IMHO. Three of my four cruisers have (or will have winches). My BJ-42 has the hydraulic, the KZJ-70 has an aftermarket electric, and the BJ-73 has an OEM electric to be installed. They each have their merits; however, my hydraulic is the most solid of the three.

Could you please expand upon the benifits of a hydraulic winch.
I had written then off. To me they seemed like an alternitive to electric if your truck has no PTO.

I know hydraulic is faster and stronger than electric, don't have to worry about about an electric winch motor overheating, but the truck still has to run. However, an electric powered hydralic was mentioned, but then wouldn't you have the overheating issues on the motor? Not sure, I guess it depends on the motor.

How would a hydralic do, for work? I.E. All day use? Build a log home, skidding etc...? Could you give a summary of the hydralic winch?

Thanks,
Nick

EDIT: I just did some reading on PTO vrs Hydralic.
It seems PTO is much better. It can go harder, and faster.
So as long as your truck has a PTO out, it seems PTO is the way to go over hydralic.
A 24v volt 8274 seems to be about the best electric winch in the world.
I am getting the Toyota copy (which I am told is even better. more refined).
So I will see what I think of it.

 

[dieseldog]

Could you please expand upon the benifits of a hydraulic winch.
I had written then off. To me they seemed like an alternitive to electric if your truck has no PTO.

I know hydraulic is faster and stronger than electric, don't have to worry about about an electric winch motor overheating, but the truck still has to run. However, an electric powered hydralic was mentioned, but then wouldn't you have the overheating issues on the motor? Not sure, I guess it depends on the motor.

How would a hydralic do, for work? I.E. All day use? Build a log home, skidding etc...? Could you give a summary of the hydralic winch?

Thanks,
Nick

EDIT: I just did some reading on PTO vrs Hydralic.
It seems PTO is much better. It can go harder, and faster.
So as long as your truck has a PTO out, it seems PTO is the way to go over hydralic.
A 24v volt 8274 seems to be about the best electric winch in the world.
I am getting the Toyota copy (which I am told is even better. more refined).
So I will see what I think of it.

A lot of what you'll read is very subjective--much like the choice of which series cruiser to purchase. What I will say is that the most reliable part of a cruiser equipped with a diesel engine is -- THE ENGINE. You practically have to nuke the sucker to get it to stop running. On top of that, if you have power steering, a hydraulic winch is a very good choice. My hydraulic runs at two speeds and is quite fast enough for anything and everything I've asked of it. Seeing as the solenoid and remote are the only electrical connections, it is very capable under less-than optimum wet weather/submersion conditions. I have no need to set-up anything special under the hood to take into account a massive amp draw and my hydraulic winch will work all day long--long pulls, short pulls--you name it. It's only the electric winch that suffers from the problem of overheating, not the hydraulic. Also, I can drive and pull at the same time--unlike with a PTO.

But, like I said--it's a personal choice. And I think that 8274's rock the house, no doubt.

 

[Malahki]

Don't be so quick to write off hydraulic winches altogether, they do have their advantages. I drive a winch truck for a living moving oil rigs and in the last 10 years hydraulic winches have become the prefered choice. My company now only builds trucks with hydraulic winches, they are set up one of two ways:

1) pump running off of the PTO, wich most people think of, so when the clutch is in their is no winch but depending on truck gearing and winch speed doing both together may or may not work very good.

2)Live hydraulics; a drive shaft running with an electric clutch setup (similiar to a fan clutch) off the front of the engine crank. With this setup hydraulics can be engadged with the flick of a switch regardless of what else you may be doing. Even if truck gearing and winch speed don't match up they can still be done together quite easily by working the clutch pedal. An autamatic transmision takes this setup to the next level. You can get similiar results by running a pump off of a fan belt in small trucks (if you have the room).

Yeah their are some disadvantages to hydraulics: the truck has to be running (unless adding the electric motor for back up as someone previousely mentioned), hydraulics can still heat up (although it takes way way more then an electric), more peices to the set up means more things to go wrong, needs more room, it's heavier and initial cost is much greater.

Their are also lots of good things: you can set up pressures so that the winch will not brake the line (much safer), you are not stressing the vehichles charging system, you don't risk not being able to start your vehichle after extended use in the case of a stall, system is totaly sealed against water, can be set up with Hi and Low range capability and the greatest benifit is the unlimited size potential (their is no 100 ton electric winch trucks).

All that being said, for the average Joe who uses a winch a few times a month (if that), an electric winch is the way to go.

 

[Satamax]

NickW

Well, i was explaining that the hydraulic winches run of the PTO or from an engine pump are the best, i like the idea of the PTO ones being able to run at different speeds, which helps when you have some line to pull. Or if you're pulling small trees in the woods. And for the big work you go for the slow and big torque gears. And you can do this all day long.Then if you have quick disconect ends, you could also run your log splitter or snow plough out of that. And with the electric backup pump, even stalled you could get out of a ditch with the winch.

Bye.

Max.

 

[frp88]

I dont know if you boys in Canada are familiar with winch challenge comp but unless you have a top battery and alt.you would struggle to pull your back on it wheels in a gully.I have used my pto plenty and would not change it for an ele.but I would buy a cheap one as an extra if you do alot off wheel with only 1truck

 

[Entaran]

Thankyou dieseldog and BJ71. Very informative.

I've been advised by the SES down here in Aus that Hydraulics are the way to go for recovery power. Being that 75 series don't have PTO takeoff's and it's next to IMPOSSIBLE to stop a hydraulic winch running plasma rope with a snatch block. They'll pull -anything-.

Or so i've been told. We will soon see when I take delivery of my 10k pound hydraulic winch!

 

[Satamax]

Thankyou dieseldog and BJ71. Very informative.

I've been advised by the SES down here in Aus that Hydraulics are the way to go for recovery power. Being that 75 series don't have PTO takeoff's and it's next to IMPOSSIBLE to stop a hydraulic winch running plasma rope with a snatch block. They'll pull -anything-.

Or so i've been told. We will soon see when I take delivery of my 10k pound hydraulic winch!

BJ75 or hzj 75, usualy both can be fitted with PTO's BJ most of the time has it stock!

 

[crushers]

Thankyou dieseldog and BJ71. Very informative.

I've been advised by the SES down here in Aus that Hydraulics are the way to go for recovery power. Being that 75 series don't have PTO takeoff's and it's next to IMPOSSIBLE to stop a hydraulic winch running plasma rope with a snatch block. They'll pull -anything-.

Or so i've been told. We will soon see when I take delivery of my 10k pound hydraulic winch!

i have seen the results of a too powerful a winch in the hands of the inexperienced. a twisted frame, crushed winch mount, shattered winch housings...
i have not used the hydralic winches but i can picture the same results if not carefull

 

[clintnz]

I've just fitted a std toy PTO to my LJ71, approach angle isn't so much of a problem if you make your own mount & have the winch further back.

For pulling speed & power a PTO is the best, no contest. Big $$$$$ PTO-hydraulic setups will have similar performance, but their only real advantage is being able to smoothly engage/disengage the winch while the vehicle is under power.

I have only needed to self recover without a running motor once in the last 10 years. I always carry a Tirfor style hand winch for backup when doing any serious 4x4ing solo & would do so no matter what winch I had.

To answer the orginal question, the std toy PTO setup is pretty strong. The winch comp truck I've been co-driving has a big higher geared winch pushed by about 400hp through a std pto box with no probs so far. At 5000rpm in 4th it was a sight to see

A mate has had a toy PTO setup on his 40 series for ages now & he uses 4" nails for shear pins. We've a lot of serious pulls with it over the years with no problems, the only time the pin breaks is when he forgets to disengage the PTO & drives off with it hooked onto the bumper :whoops: So I intend to use nails too, the price is right

 

[crushers]

you want speed and stength then run a 12V 8274 on 24V and get out of the way... i have yet to see a stuck that this setup won't budge...

 

[Radd Cruisers]

Way way back like 17 years ago, we burned out two 8274 winches trying to get my 1972 blazer out of a mud hole.


Finally a one ton ford pulled in hooked up the to the blazer, strapped the rear end to a tree and and after about 10 minutes of pulling and stopping to cool off the 12000 pound warn winch it was out.

Having left the trucks for two days in the mud might not of helped.....

Sorry no pto info.

 

[nickw]

Way way back like 17 years ago, we burned out two 8274 winches trying to get my 1972 blazer out of a mud hole.


Finally a one ton ford pulled in hooked up the to the blazer, strapped the rear end to a tree and and after about 10 minutes of pulling and stopping to cool off the 12000 pound warn winch it was out.

Having left the trucks for two days in the mud might not of helped.....

Sorry no pto info.

Did you use a snatch block?
Or just a straight pull?

Seems crazy to burn two winches out.

Cheers,
Nick