Well I think I am going to try this paint thing again. I painted my cruiser with a guy from work who had made him self out to be quite knowlegdable which I took for granted and did not do research for myself. We used rattle can primer from the local autozone and then painted with a ppg 2 stage paint needless to say the paint is practically falling off only a few months later. My questions now are what is the best way for paint removal ( as i believe it will be necessary to remove the work we have already done) ? I have a steel windshield, hood, bib, and bezel. My fenders are aluminum and my tub is fiberglass. Which brings me to my next issue primer? Would an epoxy primer or self ecthing primer adhere to all of these different surfaces that I am working with? Then comes to paint what are your feelings on single stage paints? Will I have better results with a 2 stage? I have only sprayed one time and that was because half way into the paint process the guy got a call from his wife left and never came back so I picked up the gun and went for it. No runs but the clear is definately applied unevenly. Would like to get some input on this before I get started thanks. -Dan
Primer/Paint Questions
- Thread starter 77landsitter
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DanS HJ-45
SILVER Star
Definitely a problem with the rattle can primer. That stuff sucks big time. I will use it just to keep the rust off, then as soon as I get ready to actually primer, I blast it off of there and put the real stuff on.
I'd probably stick with an epoxy primer, as it should adhere evenly to all of the surfaces, even with their different materials. The PPG DP50LF has been a great primer for me (and others here). Dangerous (isocyanide), but very strong, and easy to shoot.
As to the single vs. 2 stage question.... That depends on the finish you want, and if you were happy with the finish you got earlier (other than it falling off). If the finish before was one you liked, then 2 stage would be a fine choice. If you really couldn't stand the clear being a bit uneven, then single stage probably makes more sense.
It also depends on what you want out of the finish. The two stage will give you the best finish, but will take a lot more work to get. The single stage is easier to apply, but won't give you a seriously shiny paint job (well, not as shiny and wet looking as the 2 stage).
Is there a good local paint shop you trust? I love mine--they have yet to steer me wrong.
FWIW--I haven't decided if my HJ will get single or two stage yet either. But luckily I don't have to worry about it for quite some time!
Dan
I'd probably stick with an epoxy primer, as it should adhere evenly to all of the surfaces, even with their different materials. The PPG DP50LF has been a great primer for me (and others here). Dangerous (isocyanide), but very strong, and easy to shoot.
As to the single vs. 2 stage question.... That depends on the finish you want, and if you were happy with the finish you got earlier (other than it falling off). If the finish before was one you liked, then 2 stage would be a fine choice. If you really couldn't stand the clear being a bit uneven, then single stage probably makes more sense.
It also depends on what you want out of the finish. The two stage will give you the best finish, but will take a lot more work to get. The single stage is easier to apply, but won't give you a seriously shiny paint job (well, not as shiny and wet looking as the 2 stage).
Is there a good local paint shop you trust? I love mine--they have yet to steer me wrong.
FWIW--I haven't decided if my HJ will get single or two stage yet either. But luckily I don't have to worry about it for quite some time!
Dan
also single stage tends to fade a lot faster as the clear (duh) in it wont have as many mils as the 2 stage.
honestly its easier to get even clear then no runs. you might have been going to fast, all you need to do is spray wit 50% overlap on each pass.
no idea what Im talking about? you can pm me...or I can make pic's
honestly its easier to get even clear then no runs. you might have been going to fast, all you need to do is spray wit 50% overlap on each pass.
no idea what Im talking about? you can pm me...or I can make pic's
i hope you dont mind a bit of a sidetrack but you guys seem to know what you are talking about,
I am looking at doing this myself but i need to know of a decent primer to use, where do you get the PPG DP50LF at? also if this isnt availible in canada is there any other brands to get or avoid. also do you need a HVLP or spray gun for this? I have heard there are some good primer/fillers that make this simpler, any advice or reccomendations? and finally, filler first than primer or other way around or does this matter?
sorry for the newb questions any advice appreciated.
I am looking at doing this myself but i need to know of a decent primer to use, where do you get the PPG DP50LF at? also if this isnt availible in canada is there any other brands to get or avoid. also do you need a HVLP or spray gun for this? I have heard there are some good primer/fillers that make this simpler, any advice or reccomendations? and finally, filler first than primer or other way around or does this matter?
sorry for the newb questions any advice appreciated.
DanS HJ-45
SILVER Star
You can buy the DP line of primers at any auto paint supply shop that carries PPG products. I'm sure DuPont has a competing product, but my local shop is PPG--so I am too. Look in the phone book under automotive paint supplies.
As to the gun....
You can use a normal spray gun or an HVLP gun. Personally, I'd say buy a decent HVLP gun (I got a DeVilbiss FinishLine model for about $160). The amount of overspray from an HVLP gun is much, much less and I have found the gravity feed cup (which virtually ALL HVLP guns use) to use significantly less air than the siphon feed spray gun that's been hanging around the shop for years and years.
I'd shoot the DP primer onto bare metal, and then work the metal with whatever bodywork you are going to do to it. In fact, I'd even weld (and reshoot DP over the affected area) after putting down a coat of the DP.
Quick nomenclature for you: DP is the primer line. Number indicates color (50=grey, 90=black, etc...). LF="Lead Free."
The only major drawback to the DP line is that being an epoxy primer it is loaded with isocyanides. Definitely invest in some good safety gear for dealing with that stuff (If I'm doing a lot of painting I put on a full paper suit and wear a full face respirator--and even that is "cheaping out" a bit for a relatively enclosed space).
Hope this helps! I'm certainly no expert, but I've gotten pretty good at shooting DP primer lately.
Dan
As to the gun....
You can use a normal spray gun or an HVLP gun. Personally, I'd say buy a decent HVLP gun (I got a DeVilbiss FinishLine model for about $160). The amount of overspray from an HVLP gun is much, much less and I have found the gravity feed cup (which virtually ALL HVLP guns use) to use significantly less air than the siphon feed spray gun that's been hanging around the shop for years and years.
I'd shoot the DP primer onto bare metal, and then work the metal with whatever bodywork you are going to do to it. In fact, I'd even weld (and reshoot DP over the affected area) after putting down a coat of the DP.
Quick nomenclature for you: DP is the primer line. Number indicates color (50=grey, 90=black, etc...). LF="Lead Free."
The only major drawback to the DP line is that being an epoxy primer it is loaded with isocyanides. Definitely invest in some good safety gear for dealing with that stuff (If I'm doing a lot of painting I put on a full paper suit and wear a full face respirator--and even that is "cheaping out" a bit for a relatively enclosed space).
Hope this helps! I'm certainly no expert, but I've gotten pretty good at shooting DP primer lately.
Dan
- Thread starter
- #6
Clear
Yes, I think I was going to fast with the gun. I was kind of in a hurry and stressed as we were shooting on a warm day in fall and as the sun dropped so did the temps. Between coats I was able to kick the heaters on but the make shift booth in my garage was no match for the cold. I will mostl likely be shooting the cruiser again in mid april early may depending on temps and moisture in the air, as april can be quite wet. I will post pics up when the time comes.
Yes, I think I was going to fast with the gun. I was kind of in a hurry and stressed as we were shooting on a warm day in fall and as the sun dropped so did the temps. Between coats I was able to kick the heaters on but the make shift booth in my garage was no match for the cold. I will mostl likely be shooting the cruiser again in mid april early may depending on temps and moisture in the air, as april can be quite wet. I will post pics up when the time comes.
hmm, i was hoping to avoid spending alot on a hvlp, i wont be doing alot of painting, mostly fixing the rear quarters and surface rust on doors, then i was going to do the roll on method.
thanks for breaking down the abreviation for me!
thanks for breaking down the abreviation for me!
hvlp's run from like $80 (ampro, generic) to $150 (base devilbiss) up to $500 (sata)
if you want I can see what I could get you a ampro for there decent and I get 20% off. if your interested
if you want I can see what I could get you a ampro for there decent and I get 20% off. if your interested
- Thread starter
- #9
Pic
Try some of their products
Carboline: Products
Carboline: Products
Funny,
Five years later, never got anything done on that cruiser, in fact the rust was too bad and I ended up dismembering it to use the drivetrain for my hilux. But, now Ive just cut out the firewall and patched in a LHD firewall and need to cover the seam, bumped into this thread while searching for info about epoxy primers.
Here's my question: on the firewall I just need to protect the seam where I welded things together, Ive already got the steel cleaned up, but Id like something I can paint on with a brush in one coat (or two maybe). The firewall is going to have insulation sound deadener on both exterior and interior, so Im not concerned with its appearance, just concerned about rust. Also, if there was a product that didnt require SCBA gear or at least was safe with a cheap respirator that would be helpful too.
What would you guys reccomend for slopping on top of bare steel and existing paint? Is a two part self etching epoxy primer the trick, or is there other reasonable options? Keep in mind, Ill send the bed and cab off to get some dents cleaned up and maybe some repainting later (Ill let the pros take care of that), so I really dont need large quantities of expensive paint, mostly I want it sealed up so I can get the insulation and engine in it while I have access.
What say ye?
Five years later, never got anything done on that cruiser, in fact the rust was too bad and I ended up dismembering it to use the drivetrain for my hilux. But, now Ive just cut out the firewall and patched in a LHD firewall and need to cover the seam, bumped into this thread while searching for info about epoxy primers.
Here's my question: on the firewall I just need to protect the seam where I welded things together, Ive already got the steel cleaned up, but Id like something I can paint on with a brush in one coat (or two maybe). The firewall is going to have insulation sound deadener on both exterior and interior, so Im not concerned with its appearance, just concerned about rust. Also, if there was a product that didnt require SCBA gear or at least was safe with a cheap respirator that would be helpful too.
What would you guys reccomend for slopping on top of bare steel and existing paint? Is a two part self etching epoxy primer the trick, or is there other reasonable options? Keep in mind, Ill send the bed and cab off to get some dents cleaned up and maybe some repainting later (Ill let the pros take care of that), so I really dont need large quantities of expensive paint, mostly I want it sealed up so I can get the insulation and engine in it while I have access.
What say ye?
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