New Exhaust recommendations

[IPOR]

no background other than Iron Pig recommending that stainless steel exhaust. If you want me to be completely honest, Lance kind of freaked out on me because I had questions about his charges. I was completely posed and calm but asked him to breakdown certain costs. He said he felt I was questioning his integrity. I had to talk him off the ledge and calm him down. It was a super odd experience and quite frankly, have never experienced anything like that. It made me suspect that perhaps he does overcharge given how quickly he got angry towards me. Once he calmed down and we agreed on the work, I received an email 10 minutes later saying he didn't realize he had other trucks he had to work on and it wouldn't work out. So odd.

No freak out here. I told you that we bill time and materials for custom work and that was what we had estimated. Our parts cost alone (without labor) exceeds the suggested amount of $230. If you can get a magniflow/cats/stainless exhaust installed for that then I suggest you do so. Our exhaust is run above the frame rail so that you don't have problems off-road, yes it takes more time to to so. Part numbers if you can really do $230.

Actually, we were discussing the rear bumper - not the exhaust. You added the powdercoat and if you search online you'll find that our price is right in line with other vendors, and we were including installation so in fact we were a little cheaper.

Lance

 

[FJ40Jim]

No, the customer is not always right.

 

[IPOR]

Yeah I have not experience with them and have only heard the name IRONPIG before so I am not sure what is going on. From what I have read, going with the electronic dizzy CAN help things out but is not a guaranteed solution. The header is great for areas that don't require the heat riser flap in the exhaust and will add a bit of performance but if you Intake is cracked/the problem then the exhaust manifold has nothing to do with that. Then the stainless steel exhaust was just overthetop for no reason. I could see if you had asked for it but I dont see it as being a defacto go to item. Something is very strange and fishy here... time to find another shop.

I know you said you werent much of a wrench but take the manifold off and take it to a machine shop to see if they can repair, lots have had this done, and then take the truck to a separate muffler shop for exhaust. Think there is something else going on here that needs to be addressed causing the 4 blown HG. Maybe see if you can get on the phone with someone like JimC (@FJ40Jim) and if he has time walk through some diagnosis. There are also the guys at ACC in Atlanta but I know that aint close.

He has received a detailed assessment of the condition and recommended repairs. None of that involved a cracked intake. We're subject to VA safety inspection in our area and as such are required to notify owners of state requirements. His exhaust has multiple holes below the passenger compartment - I feel that we made the recommendation in his best interest.

Lance

 

[IPOR]

not what I would do

I just did the intake and exaust manifold.

I used OEM gaskets. but others have used Remflex
I had a machine shop plane the stock manifolds
unless your exhaust/muffler and cat are shot, use them or have a good shop make up an exhaust. You can even have Toyota install a muffler and tailpipe for $300 and get a lifetime warrantee

NO reason to use a DUI dizzy, the fj60 dizzy very good.

I would suspect there is a combination of issues on your rig.

I would find a shop that understands older rigs, they don't need to know Cruisers, the less computer crap you see in the shop the better you will be.......looks for a place 1970's and 80's trucks, if all you see are 90's+ cars on the lot....just keep driving. Or head down to a few local Auto Parts stores(old ones) and ask around. Check a machine shop and ask who they would use.

And the cost to machine intake/exhaust vs just using remflex gasket? It's ok, I know, I used to do it that way before I learned there was a cheaper option. We offered him the best cost conscious option.

Lance

 

[kowalski]

We're unable to purchase complete exhaust with cats for under $230, if you can then please share all of your part numbers. Stainless is the option we recommend due to it's durability and longevity. We don't make this stuff up, we live it every day.

Lance

If you live this stuff every day, why would you tell a customer to bring their truck to you, and then turn them away as soon as they ask you to explain pricing? That really doesn't sound professional.

You took the time to respond in this thread, but you did not address any complaints raised by the potential customer, except that you can't get an exhaust with cats for under $230. I see the quote you gave the customer was almost $1,500.

You stated you can get the exhaust for $230, but you are quoting the customer $1,500. Seems like there is still some wiggle room in your margins, about $1,000 of wiggle room which still leaves you with an impressive profit margin on the exhaust.




Shifting gears... I really don't understand why changing the intake and the exhaust address the fact that the carburetor is dumping too much fuel. If you live this every day, can you please explain why changing the intake, exhaust, and exhaust manifold address carburetor issues?

Seems to me that fixing the carb first to address the over fueling issue is the only thing the OP came to you to fix, but ended up with a long list of parts that he/she doesn't need and still no fix for the carb.

This sounds like pure incompetence, and it looks like the OP dodged a major bullet.

 

[JMJA]

Let's hear it for Brother KOWALSKI!

 

[IPOR]

The CUSTOMER is always right. I feel for the existing truck owners that Iron pig is working on. Yes bring it to me No don't bring it to me. IPOR not on my favorite list anymore.

It's a relationship. We do

If you live this stuff every day, why would you tell a customer to bring their truck to you, and then turn them away as soon as they ask you to explain pricing? That really doesn't sound professional.

You took the time to respond in this thread, but you did not address any complaints raised by the potential customer, except that you can't get an exhaust with cats for under $230. I see the quote you gave the customer was almost $1,500.

You stated you can get the exhaust for $230, but you are quoting the customer $1,500. Seems like there is still some wiggle room in your margins, about $1,000 of wiggle room which still leaves you with an impressive profit margin on the exhaust.




Shifting gears... I really don't understand why changing the intake and the exhaust address the fact that the carburetor is dumping too much fuel. If you live this every day, can you please explain why changing the intake, exhaust, and exhaust manifold address carburetor issues?

Seems to me that fixing the carb first to address the over fueling issue is the only thing the OP came to you to fix, but ended up with a long list of parts that he/she doesn't need and still no fix for the carb.

This sounds like pure incompetence, and it looks like the OP dodged a major bullet.

The carb is dumping too much fuel because it has too much vacuum due to the leaks. HEI and header were performance recommendations, at Dan's request, not recommended repairs. The carb has also been into before, we found the top half of the carb completely loose - all of this is in the report provided to Dan. We billed him only one hour for this assessment. Over the course of the two days we had the vehicle we provided over 5 hours of telephone support.

There are elements to our dealings with this customer that would be unprofessional to share in a public forum. I will not sling mud, even on ih8mud... I'm happy to discuss in private with any interested party. 540-361-7400

[edit to correct typo on phone number, seriously - call if you have questions]

 

[gregnash]

It's a relationship. We do



The carb is dumping too much fuel because it has too much vacuum due to the leaks. HEI and header were performance recommendations, at Dan's request, not recommended repairs. The carb has also been into before, we found the top half of the carb completely loose - all of this is in the report provided to Dan. We billed him only one hour for this assessment. Over the course of the two days we had the vehicle we provided over 5 hours of telephone support.

There are elements to our dealings with this customer that would be unprofessional to share in a public forum. I will not sling mud, even on ih8mud... I'm happy to discuss in private with any interested party. 540-360-7400

Well as everyone always says, there are two sides to every story. Thanks for the professional response Lance! Always appreciate the vendor answering questions.

 

[MOCO62]

If I owned a rig with this history, I personally would want the estimates for all recommended work. If I went home with 1 thing fixed and was left as clueless on all the other issues as I was when I arrived... I would consider that the mark of an incompetent shop. How's coming in with a mysterious problem... And walking away with a baseline perspective for $95 signify incompetence?

Dan is in there asking for ideas, and is receiving written estimates in return. He never wrote that these ides were pushed on him, only that he's pissed off they turned him away. Forum members made that former conclusion on their own, and they over-reached here.

Everything else speculated on with regards to motives has been the opposite of my experience with Lance/jack/Tim. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend them, and suspect Dan knows this to be sound advice as well.

 

[kowalski]

It's a relationship. We do



The carb is dumping too much fuel because it has too much vacuum due to the leaks. HEI and header were performance recommendations, at Dan's request, not recommended repairs. The carb has also been into before, we found the top half of the carb completely loose - all of this is in the report provided to Dan. We billed him only one hour for this assessment. Over the course of the two days we had the vehicle we provided over 5 hours of telephone support.

There are elements to our dealings with this customer that would be unprofessional to share in a public forum. I will not sling mud, even on ih8mud... I'm happy to discuss in private with any interested party. 540-361-7400

[edit to correct typo on phone number, seriously - call if you have questions]

Thank you for taking the time to answer my question in a professional manner without slinging mud. I can imagine that being a vendor on a forum is tough business as anyone can create a post complaining about their dealings that everyone can read.

The way the users complaint reads, it sounds like you pushed all of this work on them, when all they wanted was a carb fix.

A user issuing a complaint always seems to have more credibility then the party defending the complaint. In these scenarios, I would recommend that you take the time to summarize the issue in plain English like you did in response to my question. There is a lot of publicity on the form, and if a user posts a complaint that is not adequately responded to by the vendor, it will make the vendor look bad even if the vendor was right.

I respect that you came on here to reply, addressed my question, and kept your response professional.

 

[Landpimp]

No, it's not really OK.
Its about $50(might be $100 someplace) to machine.

I think that is the correct fix vrs the Remflex which does not fix the actaully issue. It's more of a bandaid. Sure if it never has to be done again. ..it might be cheaper but if you have to do it again....it's not

But you were also adding a header....which is more(than to machine), then the issue of the heat riser with header.

And the cost to machine intake/exhaust vs just using remflex gasket? It's ok, I know, I used to do it that way before I learned there was a cheaper option. We offered him the best cost conscious option.

Lance

 

[FJ40Jim]

You're getting off cheap Pimp. For the machinist to tank the manifolds, mill the gasket face, then spotface all mounting holes is more than $100 around here.

Just sayin'

 

[Landpimp]

must have got fleet pricing

You're getting off cheap Pimp. For the machinist to tank the manifolds, mill the gasket face, then spotface all mounting holes is more than $100 around here.

Just sayin'

 

[murf]

The court of public opinion can be funny. Thank Goodness its America where both vendors and customers alike can choose who they do business with. When I hear of a respectable facility declining to start into a business relationship before it even starts, I guarantee you there is more to the story but in the end - it's none of my damn business anyway.

nothing to see here 'cept hurt feelings, moving on ~

 

[JMJA]

Danland, you really stirred up a hornets nest and I still support you. Stay the course and you will get your Cruiser running and in shape. In your position as a customer you are RIGHT. Good Luck!

 

[CaptClose]

Man... This just sounds like a horrible first date. It seems like Dan and Iron Pig just got off on the wrong foot to begin with and it went downhill from there. As a business owner myself, I can tell you that some customers are just more trouble than they're worth. Some may even cost you more than you make. However, I'm as understanding as possible and I always try an exceed every client's expectations. Sometimes I wish I could afford to tell a customer to go to hell... I just don't have that luxury, but it is EVERY business owner's right to do so. If Dan didn't like the quote, he also had every right to take his business elsewhere and get a second opinion. He chose the nuclear option first though, and called his vendor out Ina public forum. In Dan's defense, I think he started this thread just seeking unbiased advise... And then it just started to spiral down from there. I don't think that was his original intention.

The moral of the story is, if you need to have custom work done to your rig, it's not gonna be cheap. Call around and get estimates. If you don't like one quote, ask questions to make sure you understand the scope of the work involved, and then politely move on to get your next quote. Shops operate in this manner everyday, it doesn't offend them. At the end of the day, take your business to the shop that you feel most comfortable with, even if it's not the cheapest bid.

I'm sure Lance and IPOR are still a reputable shop, and perhaps Lance was having a bad day or just lost his cool with a prospective client. It's a regrettable thing, but it happens. Dan and Lance shouldn't do business together, but that doesn't mean other ships should turn Dan away, or other customers should shun IPOR. Just move on with no hard feelings. ISIS is the real enemy. Beers to all!

 

[IPOR]

Man... This just sounds like a horrible first date.

Spot on. We performed the work requested, I've even supplied a copy of our assessment to the shop receiving his truck. Trying to do the right thing here and we just can't work with Dan. I do take these concerns seriously so I spent the time to sit down with my staff and discuss what transpired. I don't think Dan is being honest here but I don't think it's productive to continue this discussion. If anyone would like to discuss further you have my number - 540-361-7400

 

[LAMBCRUSHER]

3 pages????> REALLY????

 

[MOCO62]

Dan you wrote earlier that he effectively fired you out of the blue. Later you wrote that he told you in advance on the phone that you shouldn't work together. From the start of this thread, you have left out a number of details, in an incredibly disingenuous move, and several on here pounced all over Lance because you have misled us. Now your up in arms over saving $200 on a $3-4,000 ticket. Just let it die man. That's 4% of the invoice. Your rig sat ___ up for a year and now you have a solution. Last time you posted a new thread about your prior mechanic everyone here in mud hurled accusations at that shop too. Give it a rest already. You got hours of sound advice for free. You should be thankful. Stop inciting this nonsense already.



edited when i see Dan edited and deleted some of his posts before and after this one....and for grammatical / language errors

 

[LAMBCRUSHER]

you chucked a well known vendor under a he-said/she-said bus and don't expect him to take the time to explain his position? I think I know why you had trouble here...if you were looking for a solution, then you wouldn't be still pouring gas...this tripe took 3 pages- and the worst part is all of us are watching...nuff said, I'm out. GLWS