Mile Miker Hidraulic Winch

[albertom]

Well, i bought one of these, installed it and now i dont know if i made the right choice. It's installed correctly and it looks good, but it is rediculously slow when i use it. Has anyone had any experience with these? is my hydraulic pump shot, because it sounds allright and steering is fine... i was just wondering if there was a way to speed it up a... LOT!

Its one of those winches that everyone knows works even under water, but we never want to use it when wheeling cuz it takes so damn long to get someone out!

thanks for any imput

 

[Mace]

They are slow.. period..

But for giggles, how slow is it?

 

[JRFJ4-]

Slow

I just got my install finished up yesterday. How slow is slow? Are you talking slow when it pulls a load or just rolling up the cable?

Which one did you get? Is it a 2 speed?

I tweaked my pump per the instructions on West Texas Off Road.

How much faster is a Warn 8274?

Concerning the speed. For us rednecks, it's still alot quicker than going and getting every damn tractor we can find to pull a truck out of a pond. I can see the speed issue if it was a competition. I don't care if I drink one or ten beers while pulling somebody out. I just want it to work.


JR

Here's some pics of my install. I need to clean up the wiring to the remote.

 

[IBCRUSN]

what model rig do you own? If you have room under the hood install a dedicated hydraulic pump with a minimum of 3.5 gallons/minute. The flow rate dictates speed and pressure is the power. Take a look at the info available on this site, it may change your mind on the hyd. winches:

http://www.4x4winches.com/

If you go with a dedicated pump here is something I have been looking at to install in my 80. It has good flow and pressure.
http://www.pscmotorsports.com/product_info.php?products_id=512

Aside from self recovering if your on your roof hydraulic is the cats meow for power, durability and unlimited duty time.

 

[JRFJ4-]

Test

OK, I just went out and cranked the cruiser, got the remote, pulled out 100 feet of cable and rolled it back up all in a little over 4 minutes.

It was 5:36 on my phone when I started and it said 5:40 when I stopped rolling it up.

Glad I did this, because I have a leak somewhere on my power steering pump.

This is a $45.00 reman pump from Advance Auto Parts. 79 Chevy 1/2 ton truck power steering pump. I think I will go ahead and order a new pump from AGR or PSC. I'm running hydro assist also, and it may be a little too much for the cheapest pump money can buy.

JR

 

[albertom]

thanks for the input guys... well i have even gotten to the point where the winch just stalled, and it wasnt even on a very agressive pull... Mechanics told me my steering pump was fine, but i have also heard the best way to get performance out of it is adding a dedicated pump.

I have a FJ70, im guessing its the original steering pump and it does seem to be working fine... my mile marker is the 2speed, and when its on high, its a pretty good speed. When i put it on LOW, it definitely takes a while to pull in the 100 feet.

It also took me a while to learn how to use the darn thing... i was sort of thinking about swapping over to a Warn Electric... with the variable pull speed depending on weight on the line...

How complicated is the aditional pump install? isnt it easyer to get a bigger pump for both things?

THanks again,
Alberto

 

[flintknapper]

How much faster is a Warn 8274?

The 8274 has a well earned reputation for having good line speed and providing a decent amount of "grunt". It also carries 150 ft. of cable vs. the 100 ft. found on many other winches.

If your engine won't run to power the pump for the milemarker, line speed is zero, so I'd say the 8274 would be a lot faster in that case.

On the other hand, if you have to pull for a long time (and your engine runs), then the hydraulic begins to look pretty good.

They are both good winches IMO.

I have an 8274 I bought new 20 yrs. ago and its still going strong, I'm pretty much sold on 'em.

 

[Tigerstripe40]

For me, if it wasn't for the fact that the Milemarker won't run without the engine running, I'd get one.

That said, I am more likely to tip over than get stuck in a way I can't just back out.
Tipped over means no enigne running, which means no winch.

Warn 8274-50 for my truck.

 

[JRFJ4-]

Which one?

The old argument of hydraulic/electric will never end.

I would think that if the winch stalled, you do not have enough PSI. They are rated at 1500 psi.

I almost bought a used 8274. But by the time I added dual batteries and a good alternator, it would have been about $100.00 more than what I will have in mine, even with a new power steering pump.

That was for a used winch. So I decided to go with the new hydraulic.

Time will tell.


JR

 

[Bambusiero]

So, that's about 25 ft/min.

Milemarker specs is 31-48 ft/min. (in high gear) , varying with which wrap you are on. Average of about 40.
The reduction is probably explained by your PS pump not delivering
the specified 3.5 GPM.

(25/40)*3.5 = 2.2GPM - Maybe that's what your pump is giving.

An interesting comparison is to the Warn specs (unloaded and nothing about which wrap):
M8000 at 42 ft/min
M12000 at 30 ft/min
9.5XP at 38 ft/min
M8274 at 72 ft/min (but that's really a different category of winch)

Except for the 8274, the Warn electric models and the Milemarker
hydraulic are about the same, by spec anyway. They are all in the
same ballpark. So why does everyone complain about Milemarker
being so slow? Do the electrics actually much faster than specified
and everyone compares to that?

 

[Tigerstripe40]

For grins,

THere are a few cars out there with an electric power steering pump.

The Honda Insight is one I can name off the top of my head.
I think there are a few Ford and Subaru models that have the same thing?

How 'bout using one of these hydraulic over electric pumps to power the MM hydraulic winch? THat way you get the best of both worlds...

Any idea's on what vehicles that a Hydraulic over electric power steering pump could be obtained off of?

 

[IBCRUSN]

JR,

You beat me to it.

The old argument of hydraulic/electric will never end.

I won't bother to get into that battle.

Albertom,

I'm not familiar with the 70 series but IIRC didn't they have an option for a PTO? If so to keep an easy install you have two choices. One, find a setup that will run a hydraulic pump off the PTO (would be my 1st choice). Second, find an extra spot under the hood or ditch an air pump and replace it with the hyd. pump.

If you're looking for high duty cycle and power hydraulic will always win out. It just takes a little more engineering that dropping in a dual battery system for the initial installation after that you'll never look back. Stick with it and I think you'll change your mind.

 

[JRFJ4-]

So, that's about 25 ft/min.

Milemarker specs is 31-48 ft/min. (in high gear) , varying with which wrap you are on. Average of about 40.
The reduction is probably explained by your PS pump not delivering
the specified 3.5 GPM.

(25/40)*3.5 = 2.2GPM - Maybe that's what your pump is giving.


4 minutes was the entire time. I cranked the cruiser, got my remote out and plugged it up. Put the winch in "free" and physically walked and pulled out all the
cable. I started winding then had to stop when the power steering pump started whining. I went and flipped on my cooling fan, and started winding again. That's when I realized I'm leaking PS fluid.

So 40 ft/min is pretty accurate for the Milemarker.

JR

 

[JRFJ4-]

AGR Pump

I decided to not even mess around with this power steering pump leak. I ordered a AGR Rock Ram Super Pump today.

We'll see if it's any better when I get it installed.

JR

 

[lowenbrau]

These winches that are designed to use your ps pump are never going to be anything but slow. My towtruck hydraulic Superwinch wants 15gal/minute and then its almost as fast as an 8274. The good news is its that fast at full load too. I have a big hydraulic pump on my PTO.

 

[IBCRUSN]

True, your hyd. Superwinch is still reasonably slow. I'd be willing to bet that it's a worm gear type winch, they are slow as all get out. However they are very durable require little maintenance and do not need an additional drum brake. Once you get into planetary type winches two things dictate speed, one is the hydraulic motor on the winch and secondly, speed is directly proportional to the fluid flow.

Take a look at the numbers on this page:
http://www.4x4winches.com/powering.htm

Yes, it confirms that running off the PS pump is a very slow endevour but once you get into dedicated hyd. pumps the speed comes up quickly.

I realize that purchasing a winch system form the UK is not really the most economical idea (shipping and taxes) but the pump alone isn't bad. As a whole the dedicated pump setup with the modified ZF pump would be ~$1900 USD. I don't see it as being that bad considering the 19ft/min line speed at 10300lbs. Compare that to a new 8274 or M12 and an adequate dual battery installation.

If your interested in more details email Allan at sales@4x4winches.com he knows his stuff and has been a pleasure to talk to.

 

[rev_wing13]

It's All About Application

Folks - This is an argument that has been hashed and re-hashed in various forums and on the LCML for years (like tire brands/models). The bottom line is that it really comes down to how you are going to use it most.

Do you usually need a winch for assist while on a tricky trail? To get out of deep mud? To pull you out of deep water crossings? Or because you seem to spend more time on you lid or side than wheels down?

I have used Toyota PTOs, Warn electrics, and Mile Marker hydraulics. Each has it's strengths and weaknesses. The Army re-fit all it's HMMWVs with Mile Marker hydraulics, replacing the Warn electrics. I have used the crap out of both of these types in Iraq and Afghanistan. The electrics we replaced were killing batteries or burning up at an alarming rate... I don't know about you, but I don't want my winch crapping out while recovering an IED'd vehicle when there is potential for small arms fire. The hydraulics have been much more reliable for us, for both self- and buddy-recoveries. Not that most of you are facing these trail conditions.

The hydraulic and PTO winches (unless you're gonna hand-crank, which is basically a ridiculous proposition) require the vehicle to be running (a major detractor for stalled deep water recoveries or rollovers - at least for self recovery) and the hydraulics can be pretty slow, but both will pull strong forever if it is running; the electric ones will suck the life out of a 12-volt (single battery) vehicle if it's not running and don't have as long a work cycle, but are fast and don't require the vehicle to be running.