LX600 vs Supercharged LX570 (1 Viewer)

[CT3]

If Toyota had offered the supercharger with a TRD tune from a dealership, this might be a more reasonable comparison. If both were offered new today at the same cost and with the same warranty, I too would choose the 200 series. Mostly for the aesthetics and the V8.

Once you start comparing modified to unmodified though you’ll lose a lot of folks in the process. I am skeptical of the long term reliability of the new LX700 for instance but I would certainly take one over a used 200 series with added forced induction that almost certainly doesn’t have the tune or supporting mods to be durable for another 200-300k miles…

 

[tbisaacs]

I’m jealous of your supercharger but I suspect that most 200 series owners who’ve added a 250 series or LX600 to their stable weren’t chasing more power.

Or in the other direction, holding out for the power of a SC 3UR would still be bizarre given all of the other “quirks and features” of this platform.

BTW I’m making arrangements to be buried in my 570. We’re all a little crazy.

 

[Girl Dad of 3]

If Toyota had offered the supercharger with a TRD tune from a dealership, this might be a more reasonable comparison. If both were offered new today at the same cost and with the same warranty, I too would choose the 200 series. Mostly for the aesthetics and the V8.

Once you start comparing modified to unmodified though you’ll lose a lot of folks in the process. I am skeptical of the long term reliability of the new LX700 for instance but I would certainly take one over a used 200 series with added forced induction that almost certainly doesn’t have the tune or supporting mods to be durable for another 200-300k miles…

That’s a fair take. The use case probably affects the durability as well. For example, heavy towing may exacerbate the risk of failure. Fortunately I don’t do a lot of that.

 

[Girl Dad of 3]

If Toyota had offered the supercharger with a TRD tune from a dealership, this might be a more reasonable comparison. If both were offered new today at the same cost and with the same warranty, I too would choose the 200 series. Mostly for the aesthetics and the V8.

Once you start comparing modified to unmodified though you’ll lose a lot of folks in the process. I am skeptical of the long term reliability of the new LX700 for instance but I would certainly take one over a used 200 series with added forced induction that almost certainly doesn’t have the tune or supporting mods to be durable for another 200-300k miles…

CT, you seem very knowledgeable so here is a question for you:

If the supercharger does blow up the engine, how much do you think it would cost to repair? Things like blown gaskets or cracked pistons, while bad, would seem to be fixable for a lot less than the price difference between the modded 200 and the LX600/700.

So if we are comparing reliability of supercharged vs non-supercharged 200, then clearly the supercharger adds a degree of complexity and risk, though we could debate how severe the risk is.

But if we are comparing modded 200 to the 300 series, there is still a LOT of financial buffer even if there is a failure.

Though it would suck to be stranded on the side of the road with the whole family on board. Have to build in the expected domestic cost (substantial) of getting yelled at by the missus in that situation.

 

[CT3]

CT, you seem very knowledgeable so here is a question for you:

If the supercharger does blow up the engine, how much do you think it would cost to repair? Things like blown gaskets or cracked pistons, while bad, would seem to be fixable for a lot less than the price difference between the modded 200 and the LX600/700.

So if we are comparing reliability of supercharged vs non-supercharged 200, then clearly the supercharger adds a degree of complexity and risk, though we could debate how severe the risk is.

But if we are comparing modded 200 to the 300 series, there is still a LOT of financial buffer even if there is a failure.

Though it would suck to be stranded on the side of the road with the whole family on board. Have to build in the expected domestic cost (substantial) of getting yelled at by the missus in that situation.

I’m not an authority on this by any means. Many others have more direct, hands-on experience and would likely be (much) better informed. That being said, we need more cowboys to test the platform, push the aftermarket to provide more options, etc. so thank you for your service.

For reference, as additional perspective, I have a very low mileage 2020 HE LC. If I spent the money to do a supercharger correctly on this five year old used LC, given current market value, there would be minimal financial buffer vs a new LX600. I see multiple new LX600s for sale for under $105K and that’s before any negotiations. Could probably still find a buyer for 2020 at $80-85K is my guess.

In my case then the financial argument doesn’t matter as much. The new car warranty on the LX600 would easily be worth the $5-10K delta. The minute the reliability or durability of the 200 series comes into question, the platform, to me, no longer makes sense. If I needed to replace blown gaskets or cracked pistons on a car that still barely gets to 60mph in the 5 second range, I would have to have a serious thought about continuing to invest… a Honda Accord 2.0T has the same or better 0-60 for context and would still make a great daily driver.

After some initial stumbling on the engine issues of for Toyota/Lexus, I am willing to bet that new model year LX600s will be very robust. You’re absolutely right that the roll-out of the new engine and platforms has been far from flawless. But long term Toyota/Lexus seems to have a great understanding of hybrid tech, as good as any company globally, and they’ve demonstrated again and again that their 4x4s are some of the longest lived of any brand. This makes me feel good about the new LX700 and the current LX600.

All that being said, the specific use case is the most important thing to consider. If you stay within 50-100 miles of your home, don’t tow, don’t offroad, and want a quick SUV, there are plenty of options that probably make more sense. The slowest BMW X5 from five years ago would still be faster to 60mph than a supercharged 200 and could still be under a CPO warranty. For $60Kish you can get a X5 with a V8, under CPO warranty that will do 0-60 in the mid 4 second range and, critically, has the suspension, brakes, tires, drivetrain, etc to safely handle that speed and power.

Keep pushing the limit of the platform for the rest of us, but don’t kid yourself on what you have. That’s the fastest way to end up frustrated, and it accelerates the likelihood of moving on to a new platform entirely, at least from my experience. Appreciate the 200 for what it is — a very well made, very reliable, exceedingly comfortable SUV for getting you there AND back.

Good luck!

 

[Girl Dad of 3]

I’m not an authority on this by any means. Many others have more direct, hands-on experience and would likely be (much) better informed. That being said, we need more cowboys to test the platform, push the aftermarket to provide more options, etc. so thank you for your service.

For reference, as additional perspective, I have a very low mileage 2020 HE LC. If I spent the money to do a supercharger correctly on this five year old used LC, given current market value, there would be minimal financial buffer vs a new LX600. I see multiple new LX600s for sale for under $105K and that’s before any negotiations. Could probably still find a buyer for 2020 at $80-85K is my guess.

In my case then the financial argument doesn’t matter as much. The new car warranty on the LX600 would easily be worth the $5-10K delta. The minute the reliability or durability of the 200 series comes into question, the platform, to me, no longer makes sense. If I needed to replace blown gaskets or cracked pistons on a car that still barely gets to 60mph in the 5 second range, I would have to have a serious thought about continuing to invest… a Honda Accord 2.0T has the same or better 0-60 for context and would still make a great daily driver.

After some initial stumbling on the engine issues of for Toyota/Lexus, I am willing to bet that new model year LX600s will be very robust. You’re absolutely right that the roll-out of the new engine and platforms has been far from flawless. But long term Toyota/Lexus seems to have a great understanding of hybrid tech, as good as any company globally, and they’ve demonstrated again and again that their 4x4s are some of the longest lived of any brand. This makes me feel good about the new LX700 and the current LX600.

All that being said, the specific use case is the most important thing to consider. If you stay within 50-100 miles of your home, don’t tow, don’t offroad, and want a quick SUV, there are plenty of options that probably make more sense. The slowest BMW X5 from five years ago would still be faster to 60mph than a supercharged 200 and could still be under a CPO warranty. For $60Kish you can get a X5 with a V8, under CPO warranty that will do 0-60 in the mid 4 second range and, critically, has the suspension, brakes, tires, drivetrain, etc to safely handle that speed and power.

Keep pushing the limit of the platform for the rest of us, but don’t kid yourself on what you have. That’s the fastest way to end up frustrated, and it accelerates the likelihood of moving on to a new platform entirely, at least from my experience. Appreciate the 200 for what it is — a very well made, very reliable, exceedingly comfortable SUV for getting you there AND back.

Good luck!

Thank you for these thoughts. I mostly agree. Certainly, if quickness is the top priority, there are better options. I have an Audi Q7 that I daily drive for that reason.

For the 200 series, my use case is light off-roading, roadtrips, camping/fishing trips, weekend family wagon, occasional daily driver. I’ll put roughly 10k miles per year on this truck. I don’t tow often, and I don’t do much hardcore off-roading. But I do like having the added quickness for passing those cars on the two lane highway or when driving at altitude in the mountains. Plus it’s just more fun to drive with the extra zippiness.

My experience so far has been that the supercharged 570 is quicker than my Q7 or the x5 40i. Which surprised me. The supercharged engine so far feels buttery smooth, very OEM feel. Does not sound or feel like it’s working hard or struggling at all. Just pulls strong and smooth throughout the powertrain. It’s fun. I like to think I now get the best of both worlds: the Offroad capability and comfort of the 200 series, with the quickness of the German SUVs. The Powerbrake x-line kit I have on it also helps with the performance.

Time will tell how it holds up over the long term. It’s a concern but a risk I was willing to take. YOLO. I will definitely have to stay on top of the maintenance. I’m working with a really good specialty shop called Tandem Offroad in Fort Worth. Those guys know their stuff. So hopefully they will keep me running like a top.

I’ll be the guinea pig and keep you guys posted on how it goes.

 

[TeCKis300]

Thank you for these thoughts. I mostly agree. Certainly, if quickness is the top priority, there are better options. I gave an Audi Q7 that I daily drive for that reason.

For the 200 series, my use case is light off-roading, roadtrips, camping/fishing trips, weekend family wagon, occasional daily driver. I’ll put roughly 10k miles per year on this truck. I don’t tow often, and I don’t do much hardcore off-roading. But I do like having the added quickness for passing those cars on the two lane highway or when driving at altitude in the mountains. Plus it’s just more fun to drive with the extra zippiness.

My experience so far has been that the supercharged 570 is quicker than my Q7 or the x5 40i. Which surprised me. The supercharged engine so far feels buttery smooth, very OEM feel. Does not sound or feel like it’s working hard or struggling at all. Just pulls strong and smooth throughout the powertrain. It’s fun. I like to think I now get the best of both worlds: the Offroad capability and comfort of the 200 series, with the quickness of the German SUVs. The Powerbrake x-line kit I have on it also helps with the performance.

Time will tell how it holds up over the long term. It’s a concern but a risk I was willing to take. YOLO. I will definitely have to stay on top of the maintenance. I’m working with a really good specialty shop called Tandem Offroad in Fort Worth. Those guys know their stuff. So hopefully they will keep me running like a top.

I’ll be the guinea pig and keep you guys posted on how it goes.

Great to see you pushing the platform. As @CT3 says, we need more cowboys and great to hear you're finding success. It's all about the tune, and so glad to hear that this platform has support now.

As a fellow forced induction tinkerer and tuner for a long time, this platform for the right user/use case is great for that. We know Toyota themselves validated that it was robust enough to provide a factory warrantied TRD/Magnuson supercharger early on in Tundra. Hardware wise should be robust.

If there were additional wear items over time it'll probably be the supercharger rotors, rings/ringlands, head gasket, spark plugs. Just make sure to feed it high octane fuel and stay on top of, or decrease all fluid change intervals and should live a healthy life. Make sure the cooling system and fuel system (pump) is in good repair. Keep an eye on airflow and avoid giant bumpers in front or underbody armor that block airflow.

The missing link in my mind has always been availability of a good tune as that will make or break long term durability.

 

[Girl Dad of 3]

The other is obviously used, and in OP's case IIRC was just purchased Lexus CPO'd. Speaking of which, that CPO warranty is now most definitely voided after adding an aftermarket supercharger. If that motor blows - $16k out of pocket to swap one from a junkyard, minimum. (Probably more considering the mods)

Taking your chances is a good way to put it.

CPO isn’t voided. It may be limited when it comes to some things, including some big ticket things, but it still covers a lot of stuff, including some big ticket things.

 

[Stickgunner]

It occurred to me today, while zipping around town on the third day since picking up my OTT tuned Harrop TVS 2650 supercharged LX570 from the mechanic, that I cannot understand why anyone would pay $110k+ for an LX600 rather than get a good condition LX570 or 200 series LC and put a supercharger on it.

The cost of the supercharged 570, even if you pay full freight for the SC and the labor, is a fraction of the LX600. And having driven both, there is no comparison: The supercharged 570 blows the doors off the 600. It’s quicker, more responsive, sounds better, feels better.

One of the primary appeals of the LX600 was the quicker turbocharged engine. But the supercharged 570 negates that advantage. And if there is any concern about reliability, I’ll take my chances with a tuned 570 and the unstoppable V8, over the TT V6 that has been subject to recalls.

Perhaps I’m drinking the koolaid too much. Perhaps it’s because I had a few beers at dinner and I’m not thinking clearly. But after experiencing the legitimate quickness and power of the supercharged 570, I can’t imagine ever wanting to swap it for a new 600.

And that’s before we even get to the fact that they inexcusably deleted the iconic split tailgate and double visor in the 600. Talk about thumbing your nose at tradition. Heresy!

I support this message. I also think the new Prado/ LC 250 is ripping people off at the price they are selling for, plus they are stuck with a junk tailgate. They could have at least done the split tailgate for the memories....

If I didn't insult enough people please let me know. I'll happily point out that I would prefer the new LC models as well as all other models be like the interior of my 60 series. Sure its all mechanical, with dials and sliders and levers, but to me, that is what a Land Cruiser is all about.

 

[kong24680]

Tuning for the supercharged later model LX/200 isn't really a problem anymore. Additionally, the reliability of the supercharger on the 5.7L engine is essentially a non-issue if power is kept under 600whp. There’s been 100s of supercharged tundra’s over the years, some with 100k+ supercharged miles. CPO on the motor will be 100% voided with the supercharger, but as long as regular maintenance is performed this should be a non-issue as well.

As others have mentioned, the comparison between the LX570 and LX600/700 really depends on priority. The 600/700 will have better tech, mpg, out of the box on road/off road performance, and refinement vs the 570’s proven reliability.

While Toyota/lexus has had a solid reputation in the past with their off-roaders, I’m of the opinion that this new twin turbo motor is inherently flawed. On top of the recalled vehicles, there’s been numerous stories and examples of newer vehicles outside of the recall that are still blowing up and it doesn’t seem like Toyota has a true solution is still blaming it on “machining debris”.

I cross-shopped the LX 600/700h and Sequoia TRD Pro before ultimately choosing a modified LX 570. For me, reliability was the most critical factor - I never want to find myself stranded with my family on the side of the road or a remote trail due to an engine failure. I’d rather dump $50k into a used 570 building the ultimate cruiser (what I’m planning to do) than spend $120k and be a guinea pig for an unproven motor.

 

[Girl Dad of 3]

Tuning for the supercharged later model LX/200 isn't really a problem anymore. Additionally, the reliability of the supercharger on the 5.7L engine is essentially a non-issue if power is kept under 600whp. There’s been 100s of supercharged tundra’s over the years, some with 100k+ supercharged miles. CPO on the motor will be 100% voided with the supercharger, but as long as regular maintenance is performed this should be a non-issue as well.

As others have mentioned, the comparison between the LX570 and LX600/700 really depends on priority. The 600/700 will have better tech, mpg, out of the box on road/off road performance, and refinement vs the 570’s proven reliability.

While Toyota/lexus has had a solid reputation in the past with their off-roaders, I’m of the opinion that this new twin turbo motor is inherently flawed. On top of the recalled vehicles, there’s been numerous stories and examples of newer vehicles outside of the recall that are still blowing up and it doesn’t seem like Toyota has a true solution is still blaming it on “machining debris”.

I cross-shopped the LX 600/700h and Sequoia TRD Pro before ultimately choosing a modified LX 570. For me, reliability was the most critical factor - I never want to find myself stranded with my family on the side of the road or a remote trail due to an engine failure. I’d rather dump $50k into a used 570 building the ultimate cruiser (what I’m planning to do) than spend $120k and be a guinea pig for an unproven motor.

This tracks with what I found during my research/diligence before doing the install. There don’t seem to be many reported failures out there, despite a fairly high number of installs. If the supercharger were a powder keg waiting to explode your engine, you’d expect to see many reports of catastrophic failures since this kit has been around for several years now.

My conclusion (but I am no expert): If the install is done by a competent tech and you get a tune from a competent tuner, it isn’t too risky. And it makes the truck a lot better (in my opinion).

It is kind of ironic that some handwring or clutch pearls about hypothetical risks of engine failures which have not been widely seen in the real world, while happily putting their trucks on difficult trails that could result in a total loss if there is a mishap. We have seen plenty of documentation of those kinds of catastrophes here.

I guess, we all figure out what we are willing to tolerate for joy in this brief wondrous life.

 

[kong24680]

This tracks with what I found during my research/diligence before doing the install. There don’t seem to be many reported failures out there, despite a fairly high number of installs. If the supercharger were a powder keg waiting to explode your engine, you’d expect to see many reports of catastrophic failures since this kit has been around for several years now.

My conclusion (but I am no expert): If the install is done by a competent tech and you get a tune from a competent tuner, it isn’t too risky. And it makes the truck a lot better (in my opinion).

It is kind of ironic that some handwring or clutch pearls about hypothetical risks of engine failures which have not been widely seen in the real world, while happily putting their trucks on difficult trails that could result in a total loss if there is a mishap. We have seen plenty of documentation of those kinds of catastrophes here.

I guess, we all figure out what we are willing to tolerate for joy in this brief wondrous life.

Most Land Cruiser and 570 owners aren’t supercharging. You really need to venture into the tundra forums if you want more info on supercharging the 5.7 motors. From my research as long as you stay under 600whp, you’ll be ok on the stock motor.

 

[ryanCA]

It’s an OTT retailer. I’ll let you guys know if the engine blows up though. Hopefully not.

However, to the point of the thread, there are a lot more documented failures / recalls of the stock TTV6 than supercharged 3UR-FE v8s.

Because most people who mod them (lot less than the TTv6 that has been around since the Lexus LS500), don't write about their failures... ego and all

 

[Girl Dad of 3]

Most Land Cruiser and 570 owners aren’t supercharging. You really need to venture into the tundra forums if you want more info on supercharging the 5.7 motors. From my research as long as you stay under 600whp, you’ll be ok on the stock motor.

Yes I’ve spent a lot of time browsing those forums. Is there any reason to think the results will be much different on the LC/LX platform?

 

[Girl Dad of 3]

Because most people who mod them (lot less than the TTv6 that has been around since the Lexus LS500), don't write about their failures... ego and all

Interesting theory. Maybe you’re right. But we do see people reporting about all sorts of other failures on this and other forums. I’d also expect to see more reports from third parties, vendors, etc.

Ryan, do you personally know anyone that has had a big blowup with their SC?

 

[ryanCA]

Interesting theory. Maybe you’re right. But we do see people reporting about all sorts of other failures on this and other forums. I’d also expect to see more reports from third parties, vendors, etc.

Ryan, do you personally know anyone that has had a big blowup with their SC?

I do not know rich people like you.

Most of my friends are blowing up their stock 5.7L (4 so far in the last 20 months on this forum alone)

 

[Girl Dad of 3]

I do not know rich people like you.

Most of my friends are blowing up their stock 5.7L (4 so far in the last 20 months on this forum alone)

I think you do. A lot richer than me I bet.

Weren’t you saying you got rid of two cars and your wife didn’t notice for months? I thought I also saw you posting some Ferrari pics but I may have been mistaken.

 

[kong24680]

Yes I’ve spent a lot of time browsing those forums. Is there any reason to think the results will be much different on the LC/LX platform?

If anything results should be better on the LC/LX. 5.7 motors for the LC/LX were built in Japan (vs US on the Tundra) and the tundra never got the 8 speed.

 

[ryanCA]

I think you do. A lot richer than me I bet.

Weren’t you saying you got rid of two cars and your wife didn’t notice for months? I thought I also saw you posting some Ferrari pics but I may have been mistaken.

My wife is blind.

Yeah it was a Toyota Tercel and Nissan March . Both of my cars combined cost less than your BBK + wheels.

 

[Girl Dad of 3]

My wife is blind.

Yeah it was a Toyota Tercel and Nissan March . Both of my cars combined cost less than your BBK + wheels.

This is your garage?

Don’t get me wrong. It’s a funny bit. But you are richer than all of us.